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My friend says they suck but he likes them anyway.
What are you thoughts on using them in games, this may change his mind.

Depends on the codex. For guard they are good, being transports and all, and aiding the Mech heavy gameplay that 5th ed thrives in.

But for GK they are damnright awesome.

Here is what I would do if I actually wanted all this stuff and could afford it.

Any inquisitor
Henchman Warband of some Warrior Acolytes, either Hotshot Lasguna or Bolters, and buy a chimera.
Then get a 10 man Purifier Squad with 4 Psycannons.

Turn 1, the Purifiers hop into the Chimera. Now all 4 Psycannons and a stormbolter are firing from that hatch, as well as the Multilaser and HB. And in subsequent turns it is even better as the now stationary unit can fire twice as many Psycannon shots.

So, for Guard a solid 7.
For GK henchmen, an average of 6.
But with 4 Psycannons inside? 10.

Your friend is wrong. They are a great unit in general. Decent mid range fire power, good transport capacity, and average front armor. Plus 5 models can shoot out of the back hatch. It's awesome. I'd easily rate it as an 8 out of 10.

Hikaru-119 wrote:Your friend is wrong. They are a great unit in general. Decent mid range fire power, good transport capacity, and average front armor. Plus 5 models can shoot out of the back hatch. It's awesome. I'd easily rate it as an 8 out of 10.

This.

The ability to turn it into a melta bunker is kinda tough to oversell.

azazel the cat wrote:

Hikaru-119 wrote:Your friend is wrong. They are a great unit in general. Decent mid range fire power, good transport capacity, and average front armor. Plus 5 models can shoot out of the back hatch. It's awesome. I'd easily rate it as an 8 out of 10.

This.

The ability to turn it into a melta bunker is kinda tough to oversell.

Double this.

They are pretty dern good.

11

10 points too cheap. 3 fireports too many (especially since it itself has a heavy weapon) and what ever BS special rule it has that allows orders to be given from inside it.

It has all of the advantages and nothing of the drawbacks that might have helped make it balanced against other non fast, non open topped type transports.

Jayden63 wrote:11

10 points too cheap. 3 fireports too many (especially since it itself has a heavy weapon) and what ever BS special rule it has that allows orders to be given from inside it.

It has all of the advantages and nothing of the drawbacks that might have helped make it balanced against other non fast, non open topped type transports.

Aside from AV10 flanks, no side hatches (actually matters quite a bit), can't really be upgraded economically, and doesn't carry anything particularly durable or horrifically scary aside from a clutch of short ranged weapons (aside from the odd single autocannon or the like)? The Orders thing is relatively minor typically, if you're running mech, then there usually isn't much to give orders to since you can't give orders to units in a chimera and if you're not then the chimera becomes a quickly prioritized (and quickly killed) target as the enemy knows exactly what it is and what it's doing and you likely don't have much to stress that AT ability.

The Chimera is good, but it does have some very real limiters, not the least of which is the T3 5+sv Ld7/8 cargo equipped mostly with S3 guns.

Vaktathi wrote:

The Chimera is good, but it does have some very real limiters, not the least of which is the T3 5+sv Ld7/8 cargo equipped mostly with S3 guns.

Funny how the only thing I ever see shooting out of them are S7 or S8 guns that vaporize most anything on the table.

Its rare that someone fields 8 of something that are just "good".

Multilaser, Heavy Bolter, Heavy Stubber, Heavy weapon squad w/ 3 autocannons or heavy bolters shooting out of top = 18 shots coming from one cheap model that can wipe out other transports of rhino-equivalent down. I say it equals out to about..say...Awesome (is that a number?) Not to mention the melta box.

Jayden63 wrote:

Funny how the only thing I ever see shooting out of them are S7 or S8 guns that vaporize most anything on the table.

Probably because the S3 guns are either out of range or can't hurt what everything else is shooting at. Such units are typically decidedly mono-role, if a meltavet squad doesn't have anything close or particularly scary to shoot at it's not doing much. If it's just an Infantry squad with an Autocannon and a Grenade launcher, it has a decent bit of range but isn't particularly scary either.

Also, if a mechvet squad is throwing around firepower that vaporizes anything on the table in the blink of an eye that isn't a tank at point blank range, something is wrong.

Its rare that someone fields 8 of something that are just "good".

Depends, really what it is is the synergy with a couple of units that makes the Chimera a really good unit. One will notice nobody howls about Stormtroopers, Infantry Squads, Ogryns or Commissar's in conjunction with Chimeras, and nobody howls about Veterans or Command squads unless they're in a transport. Particularly one will notice that one almost never sees vets without a transport of some kind (and I've never seen a Veteran squad in any edition with just meltas that didn't have a transport or the ability to Deep Strike) and chimeras are a simple way to get them where they need to go. It doesn't hurt that a mechvets army is cheaper to buy, easier to build, faster to paint, easier to transport, and faster to play than just about any other kind of IG army, even though other IG builds can be just as competitive.

Da Kommizzar wrote:Multilaser, Heavy Bolter, Heavy Stubber, Heavy weapon squad w/ 3 autocannons or heavy bolters shooting out of top = 18 shots coming from one cheap model that can wipe out other transports of rhino-equivalent down. I say it equals out to about..say...Awesome (is that a number?) Not to mention the melta box.

Heavy Weapons squads cannot purchase Chimeras, you'd have to buy it for another squad and have the HWS hop in, depriving them of a turn of shooting (often the most critical turn).

A 7 or 8 out of ten.

Why?

The good: 12/10/10 armor. Better front than a rhino, the other standard transport. 12 model capacity. Two weapons, with strength 5 or 6. Five models can fire from the hatch.

The bad: Only opens from the rear. Guardsman are only T3, so, when the Chimera blows up, and it will, you lose half the squad on average.

12 out of 10 easily.

They mitigate the IG's greatest weakness (squishy troops) without diminishing their greatest asset (many cheap special weapons) at practically no draw-back and far too low costs. They are no-brainer in most lists and I never ever ever ever ever ever saw a IG player opt for "no chimera" for a chimera-capable squad out of point-cost concerns (they only reason they ever would forgo the Chimera is either another transport, e.g. Valk, or blog-squads that cannot use a chimera effectively).

9 of 10

The only downside is the Armour 10 on the sides. But otherwise it fits its role perfect.

Only rear exit is no downside because you dont need an assault vehicle as the Guard.

The Multilaser is a great weapon wounding even Marines on 2+

Would you rather have to walk your Guard across the table? No? Then Chimaeras are worth buying.

Zweischneid wrote:12 out of 10 easily.

What is wrong with just a 10...?

They mitigate the IG's greatest weakness (squishy troops)

IG troops in chimeras are still rather squishy, if they explode the vehicle, quite often half the squad is dead already, and being Ld7/8, quite often pinned much more than other army's units. It's real strength is really in increasing the number of hulls on the board and stressing the opponents AT capabilities.

without diminishing their greatest asset (many cheap special weapons) at practically no draw-back and far too low costs. They are no-brainer in most lists and I never ever ever ever ever ever saw a IG player opt for "no chimera" for a chimera-capable squad out of point-cost concerns

Let me ask you this, when was the last time you saw an Eldar player run Dire Avengers or Fire Dragons without either Wave Serpents or Falcons? I've certainly never seen one opt for "no hovertanks" for a hovertank capable unit out of points costs concerns.

(they only reason they ever would forgo the Chimera is either another transport, e.g. Valk, or blog-squads that cannot use a chimera effectively).

It doesn't help that the current game mechanics make lots of small, easily killed infantry units a rather large drawback in terms of CC resolution, victory conditions, etc.

Dark Scipio wrote:9 of 10

Only rear exit is no downside because you dont need an assault vehicle as the Guard.

It means if something is out of reach of a 6" move and you need to move the full 12" and pile out, you need to put your one good facing the opposite direction of any incoming enemy fire and present only the weakest facings, and don't have 3 choices of where to pile out to hide from enemy fire/assault if it gets blown up, something that Rhino's can use to great effect (advance up sideways, if they pop it you can hop out the closest side to get extra range of movement for the next turn or hop out the opposite side to hide from additional fire/assaults).

I'd give chimeras about a 6. The firepower they have was rendered mediocre by 5th ed, which makes them little more than a piece of AV12. The higher front armor is nice, but the unit itself isn't doing much - especially compared to other chimera-chassis vehicles. Why spend 55 points for a chimera, when I could spend 75 for a hydra and actually kill stuff?

As for being a transport, it's okay, but not all that great. Once again, the front armor of 12 is nice, but at close range, the side of 10 is less than ideal. Most importantly, in the guard codex at least, the thing it transports is basically three special weapons, and that's it. The guys inside are flimsy as hell, and are nearly non-viable once they get blown out of their ride.

Chimeras provide an AV12 wall, and allow you to concentrate meltaguns at mid-range, but that's about it. There's a reason most mech lists relatively minimize the number that they take so that they can pack in better vehicles from other slots. It's more like a unit that people have to take, rather than ones that they want to.