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So I am going to paint a 35pt Khador army that I have collected, and then sell it off - and probably do the same with my Ret and other Khador stuff (I have enough for 50pts of each I think)

I am starting Trolls instead as from playing against them, and then playing a lot of Hordes - the play style seems to be more of a fit for how I like to play.
I have e/P Doomshaper as my first caster - I plan to play a lot with him and really get the hang of him before adding anyone else - looking at Madrak or Gunnbjorn as my second Warlock.
Getting a Extreme Mauler which will be converted into Mulg, as well as an Axer, and Earthborn Dire Troll
A unit of Champions + Skaldi, and then a full unit of Krielstone bearers are what I have so far.

Just wondering everyones thoughts on this army so far and things I should look to add synergywise and also tactics they would use given this start to the force.

Thanks!!!

Janissa Stonetide - her rockwall will help you mitgate Doomy's squishyness, interacts well with Elemental Communion, blocks non-reach models from getting to those Champions and reach non-pathfinder models charging in from extreme distances.

A Bomber/Impaler combo works great with any Trollblood warlock not just the Doomies. Cycling Refuge or Fortune from which ever Doomy you are using.

Whelps for fury control and aspect healing are great since both Doomies like their beasts. They can even help out defensively in a pinch.

Personally I've been a fan of Feralgiests. Not just keeping my beast around slightly longer in a disfunctional form, but for contesting zones and/or forcing you oppenent to put magical weapon model in specific areas.

I used to love Swamp Gobbers with Doomy but I now feel like they were compensating for bad play on my part and I've stopped taking them and don't miss them.

Great feedback! Thanks!
Didn't even think of a Feralgiest - I'll have to read up on them as I am not familiar.

From a competitive standpoint stay away from Gunnbjorn. He looks like Siege, he acts like Siege, he wants to be Siege, but he's no Siege and he's about the least competitive caster the trolls have. He's a shooting caster in an army that wants to apply axe to face. For funzies, go for it. Maybe after the Mountain King hits he'd be worth it, but not really yet.

If you're going to build to eMadrak as a second list, you're going to want Pygmy Burrowers (Dygmies), Fell Caller, and the Chronicler. Giggle as gobbos tear apart multiple heavies in a single turn.

Fennblades + UA are another really great unit to have.

Fennblades for any caster?
I was thinking about getting some Sluggers as well to provide some range in my Doomshaper list?

Fennblades are pretty universally good, especially with the UA.

I like the Fenns way more than the Champs. The champs are too slow and no reach :-(

ICleadpeople wrote:I like the Fenns way more than the Champs. The champs are too slow and no reach :-(

They serve different purposes.

Champs can be difficult to move. Add a champ hero and suddenly they're
a lot easier to coordinate. Add Skaldi and you have a good counter-punch that can
prevent some general nastiness from happening. That, or they will chew through
infantry like no one's business. (Attack, kill, overtake, attack again, kill, overtake back
into defensive line).

Fennblades are a lot squishier than Champions and do less damage. Their UA
gives them obscene threat range, and their immunity to impact attacks means they
can hold the line against cavalry. However, even with Vengeance, they simply can't
hold an area quite like the champs do, and they can't hurt heavy armor the way
that weaponmasters can.

The Fenn vs. Champs vs. Warrior Cabers debate goes around the block on a bi-monthly scheduel on the PP boards.

From what I can tell the gist is this:

1. They all serve a different purpose (shocking).
2. None of the units opperate in a vaccuum (also shocking).
3. When Cabers are the best choice Fenns are second best, often a close second.
4. When Champs are the best choice Fenns are second best, often a close second.
5. When Fenns are the best choice Fenns are also the second best choice, they are that good.

From a game playing and monitary perpective as a Trollblood Faction player you are best off buying Fennblades. Later buy Cabers and/or Champs if you sepcifically want them for what they do, even then try using Fenns in that role first, you might save yourself money and time.

The above is just my interpretations.

Hmmm, well I am getting the Champs in a trade, so maybe the Fenn's will be my next addition after.
Should I look at any shooty options before adding the Fennblades? I know you mentioned the Bomber...maybe have that and the impaler instead of the Axer and Earthborn? And if that's the case when would be practical to use both of those trolls?

Those pairings sound fine.

If you get a bomber, use an Impaler.

If you get an Earthborn, use it with the Axer.

When someone mentions Cabers they also have to mention
that Cabers only come with an expensive (dollar wise) unit
of Warriors that take up very little points. Warriors are a fantastic
unit. They can be fast when they need to be. They can hit
hard or accurately when you need them to be. They can tarpit
like no one's business thanks to their Standard.

So this is the potential 50pt army I am thinking to start with and build upto/learn the mechanics of:

pDoomshaper
Bomber**
Mulg
Impaler

Feralgeist*
Janissa*
6 Krielstone
Whelps*
Champions +Skaldi
6 Fennblades+UA*


* = units that I will need to purchase still.
In the beginning I think I will keep the Earthborn and Axer until I get the bomber via trade/purchase

Just added it up, I will have 35pts already which is:

pDoomshaper
Earthborn
Mulg
Axer

6 Krielstone
and 5 champs.

dripwelquest wrote:The Fenn vs. Champs vs. Warrior Cabers debate goes around the block on a bi-monthly scheduel on the PP boards.

From what I can tell the gist is this:

1. They all serve a different purpose (shocking).
2. None of the units opperate in a vaccuum (also shocking).
3. When Cabers are the best choice Fenns are second best, often a close second.
4. When Champs are the best choice Fenns are second best, often a close second.
5. When Fenns are the best choice Fenns are also the second best choice, they are that good.

From a game playing and monitary perpective as a Trollblood Faction player you are best off buying Fennblades. Later buy Cabers and/or Champs if you sepcifically want them for what they do, even then try using Fenns in that role first, you might save yourself money and time.

The above is just my interpretations.

Thanks a lot. Was leaning towards getting the fennblades and you just sold me.

From being on the other side of the table from Champs before Fennblades became ubiquitous, it's also better to run two min units than one max. You pick up an additional model and more flexibility with how they can operate.

If you want to see how sick Fenns can get from a threat range, try them with Borka.

12thRonin wrote:If you're going to build to eMadrak as a second list, you're going to want Pygmy Burrowers (Dygmies), Fell Caller, and the Chronicler. Giggle as gobbos tear apart multiple heavies in a single turn.

How exactly do the dygmies work? I remember looking at them and not being too impressed.

By themselves, yeah they aren't that good outside a pow 14 gun.

Turn 1 burrow and move up the marker. Keep in eMadrak and the fell caller's range. Madrak casts Blood Fury.
Turn 2
-pop up within 5" of the marker
-Fell caller moves up and does WarCry (Dygmies are now MAT 6 with boosted damage)
-Chronicler can give them an additional +2 MAT if they are near a beast but not necessary
-eMadrak Feats and does whatever else he needs to do
-Dygmies charge and wreck alot of face with charges (4d6+8), Point Blank (3d6 + 14 x2).

I lost three khador heavies in a single turn to this the first time I saw it.

More info on Dygmies, go here. http://privateerpressforums.com/showthread.php?28305-The-Burrownomicon

12thRonin wrote:By themselves, yeah they aren't that good outside a pow 14 gun.

Turn 1 burrow and move up the marker. Keep in eMadrak and the fell caller's range. Madrak casts Blood Fury.
Turn 2
-pop up within 5" of the marker
-Fell caller moves up and does WarCry (Dygmies are now MAT 6 with boosted damage)
-Chronicler can give them an additional +2 MAT if they are near a beast but not necessary
-eMadrak Feats and does whatever else he needs to do
-Dygmies charge and wreck alot of face with charges (4d6+8), Point Blank (3d6 + 14 x2).

I lost three khador heavies in a single turn to this the first time I saw it.

More info on Dygmies, go here. http://privateerpressforums.com/showthread.php?28305-The-Burrownomicon

Wow, thanks! They looks pretty awesome, I might have to proxy them for my next game.

Properly run Dygmies can be a very sudden and very rude shock to a gaming group that has not seen or thought of them before.

The Burrownomicon is as much for people that play against dygmies as those that play using them.

Untill a person learns to deal with them they can be very frustrating to play against and until they are played against someone that know how to mitigate them crushing people with them is nothing to brag about.

12thRonin wrote:From a competitive standpoint stay away from Gunnbjorn. He looks like Siege, he acts like Siege, he wants to be Siege, but he's no Siege and he's about the least competitive caster the trolls have. He's a shooting caster in an army that wants to apply axe to face. For funzies, go for it. Maybe after the Mountain King hits he'd be worth it, but not really yet.

That bad? Because I'm only starting out with Trolls and I can't wait to get him.

dripwelquest wrote:Properly run Dygmies can be a very sudden and very rude shock to a gaming group that has not seen or thought of them before.

The Burrownomicon is as much for people that play against dygmies as those that play using them.

Untill a person learns to deal with them they can be very frustrating to play against and until they are played against someone that know how to mitigate them crushing people with them is nothing to brag about.

The problem with Dygmies is that in scenario play, you either have to devote a large amount to killing a 6 point unit on turn 1 or dispersing to avoid the popup on 2. Either way, they are drastically affecting your plans and how you have to deal with it. All this while the rest of the troll army is advancing. Caster kill games you can minimize the impact of them to a better degree. Otherwise you are ceding control of the middle of the board and the objectives to the trolls and then you are faced with dislodging them.

With the Burrowers could I first turn have them burrow, place the marker 5" away, and then next turn have them pop up 5" ahead of that marker, then burrow again, effectively giving them 15" of movement/invulnerability for the first 2 turns?

Or even keep burrowing them and have them come up behind an enemy unit and then charge on the turn they come up from behind them?

Yes.

However, chances are that if you burrow first turn you're not
popping up behind the enemy.

To do that you have to burrow second turn.

So I can't burrow the turn after I burrowed? Aka would need to wait until Turn 3 to burrow again?

Yes, but if the game goes to turn 4 the Dygmies are killing the caster from behind when they come back up.

Awesome! These guys sounds like a lot of fun and potentially nasty
You said to pair them with eMadrak eh? would they pair up with Doomshaper very well?

Doomie doesn't do much for them. eMadrak, Grim, and Calandra really seem to be the nastiest with them.

Awesome, thanks!

Looking at Grim Angus on Battle College...he seems like a solid Warlock...what would be some solid things for a 35pt list led by him?

It's really hard to go wrong with Grim. He can run most things pretty well. He's just not as flashy or having a big knockout blow like Madrak or Calindra do. I see gators and scattergunners alot with him.