Union demands credit card numbers from members

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**Frazzled**

Union demands credit card numbers from members
One school employee union in Michigan is demanding that members turn over bank account and credit card information so that the union can automatically claim monthly dues after the state voted to stop deducting the money on behalf of the union.

“Debbie Bence, president of the Plymouth-Canton Cafeteria Association, sent a letter to her union members on June 4 stating that the dues had to be paid as a condition of employment,” the Capitol Confidential (Mich.) reports. Members can also pay dues in full at the beginning of the year.

Her demand came after the Michigan Supreme Court found that the state’s practice of automatically deducting dues on behalf of the union’s political action committee violated campaign finance laws; the state legislature also passed a bill ending the automatic deduction of union dues that is under contention in federal court.

In Wisconsin, the state AFL-CIO lost over half its members after Gov. Scott Walker, R, and the state legislature ended the automatic deduction of dues from worker paychecks. Bence’s union chapter is part of the Michigan Education Association, one of the most powerful education unions in the country.

http://washingtonexaminer.com/union-demands-credit-card-numbers-from-members/article/2500210

**SilverMK2**

Not really sure what the story is other than union fees now have to be paid actively by members rather than having them paid direct from their wages...

**Palindrome**

And?

So people need to pay their union membership fees by other means. I fail to see how the sky is falling.

Oh, wait I forgot; unions are apprently the embodyment of EVIL.

**SagesStone**

So members can't request their bank to automatically make the payment on their behalf with this?

**Frazzled**

SilverMK2 wrote:Not really sure what the story is other than union fees now have to be paid actively by members rather than having them paid direct from their wages...

I think the fact the union trying to get bank account numbers from their members is a bit...instrusive.

**SilverMK2**

Frazzled wrote:I think the fact the union trying to get bank account numbers from their members is a bit...instrusive.

Isn't that pretty much what any direct debit type payment requires?

**Medium of Death**

I think it might just be you on this one Frazz, your idea of Intrusive is probably different to everybody else's.

I can imagine you thinking that the Postman delivering mail is intrusive.

I was going to post Clint, but this made me laugh more.

**Albatross**

Well, demanding that dues be payed as a condition of employment is disgraceful. Membership of a union should be separate to one's employment status. You shouldn't be forced to join one if you want to work in a particular place. I find that fairly sinister. Those crazy communist europ-....

Oh. Haha.

**SilverMK2**

Albatross wrote:Well, demanding that dues be payed as a condition of employment is disgraceful. Membership of a union should be separate to one's employment status. You shouldn't be forced to join one if you want to work in a particular. I find that fairly sinister. Those crazy communist europ-....

Oh. Haha.

Some jobs will require you to have certain insurance cover etc, which is often provided by a union - it could be this that is required rather than actual union membership. Could also be sloppy reporting.

**Relapse**

Trust a union with my bank information? Not in this lifetime or reality. The way the union is forcing people to be a part of it and then saying they have to give up this information seems a lot like extortion and once again proves to me why people where I live hate unions with a passion.

**Frazzled**

Medium of Death wrote:I think it might just be you on this one Frazz, your idea of Intrusive is probably different to everybody else's.

I can imagine you thinking that the Postman delivering mail is intrusive.

I was going to post Clint, but this made me laugh more.

Maybe so. I don't give my bank accounts to anyone, don't have direct billing, and don't ahve a debit card. Consider the amount of times the wife and I have been ID hacked on credit cards, my reticence is warranted.

Like that meme!

**PhantomViper**

“Debbie Bence, president of the Plymouth-Canton Cafeteria Association, sent a letter to her union members on June 4 stating that the dues had to be paid as a condition of employment,”

This is the only controversial bit of these "news", provided that its true... Do you really HAVE to be a member of a union to have certain jobs in that part of the world?

**Frazzled**

NOTE: as Relapse noted, it may be that union membership is mandatory to work there. Links to your bank account to coerce payments as a way around the recent court rulings is troubling.

**PhantomViper**

Frazzled wrote:NOTE: as Relapse noted, it may be that union membership is mandatory to work there. Links to your bank account to coerce payments as a way around the recent court rulings is troubling.

That seems rather "communisty" of you folks, if I may say so myself...

**Frazzled**

Many of the yankee states and West Coast are union states meaning to work at a certain job, you have to be a member of the union representing that position. That includes government jobs. Some whole industries are like that, especially govenrment positions (teachers unions for example).

Some even had where you didn't have to belong to the union, but had to pay dues anyway. That may still be legal. I'm not a union labor law guy.

**Albatross**

It would be hilarious if all the non-union workers (or those wishing to dissolve their union membership) went on strike in protest against this. Oh, I would fething LOVE that!

**daedalus**

PhantomViper wrote:
“Debbie Bence, president of the Plymouth-Canton Cafeteria Association, sent a letter to her union members on June 4 stating that the dues had to be paid as a condition of employment,”

This is the only controversial bit of these "news", provided that its true... Do you really HAVE to be a member of a union to have certain jobs in that part of the world?

For a lot of jobs, yes, actually. Then you not only have to cope with office/workplace politics, but union politics as well. My ex had a job at a dairy processing plant doing labwork, and the plant workers were unionized. Nice, reasonable guys who did their jobs but weren't liked by the union leaders got shafted, and the guys who had been there for 20 years basically treated the place like it was an old boys club.

I realize that's my anecdote, and not necessarily the norm, but between that and what my dad says about the union he's in, I'm rather glad that most technology related professions DON'T have unions.

**Frazzled**

Actually they can be unionized including programmers or whtever they call themselves.

**daedalus**

Frazzled wrote:Actually they can be unionized including programmers or whtever they call themselves.

Well, they CAN be, but from what I understand, the vast majority aren't. Generally speaking, we possess this bizarre mental disorder which causes us to not get that pissed when we work 60 hour weeks. I usually go home at 4 pm, but it's not been unknown for me to sit and home staring at a problem because it doesn't work and I don't know why.

**KingCracker**

Palindrome wrote:And?

So people need to pay their union membership fees by other means. I fail to see how the sky is falling.

Oh, wait I forgot; unions are apprently the embodyment of EVIL.

I can tell you over here in Michigan, Unions really are a gakky enterprise. They take from its members, and pretty much tell them to piss off when they are needed. Funny story, my father worked at a shop for 20 years, and paid his dues always, like everyone else that worked there. When there shop was in trouble (like all the others that dealt with the auto industry) they were bought out by a rival, and instead of trying to work with the shop for everyone there, they literally, made deals so only the union reps got to keep their jobs, WITH pay increases while the company fired every single other employee. And this isnt the only story like this here in Michigan.

**Chongara**

I really can't think of any entity I interact with that I haven't given either my credit card or bank account info to at some point. Heck barring using 100% cash only for everything, there isn't any way to avoid it. Not that I'd particularly care to.

**Frazzled**

Chongara wrote:I really can't think of any entity I interact with that I haven't given either my credit card or bank account info to at some point. Heck barring using 100% cash only for everything, there isn't any way to avoid it. Not that I'd particularly care to.

There's a big difference between a credit card and bank account info.

**helgrenze**

American Unions do not function like their European counterparts.

In this case, the union is demanding payment on their terms: Either pay in full, or allow them to have access to your bank and credit info. Not sure but this may be illegal.

One thing I do find funny is this

Michigan Education Association, one of the most powerful education unions in the country.

Michigan and especially Detroit, have some of the lowest test score in this country. They may be powerful.. but they are not effective.

**Frazzled**

Why are they not effective? Their job is not education. Their job is to protect their union members, especially their union management. People forget that, admittedly because its a smoke screen thats thrown up.

After all some animals are more equal than others.

**daedalus**

helgrenze wrote:
One thing I do find funny is this

Michigan Education Association, one of the most powerful education unions in the country.

Michigan and especially Detroit, have some of the lowest test score in this country. They may be powerful.. but they are not effective.

Really, it sounds like the problem is not that the union is not effective, but really that it is TOO effective.

At least, for some values of education based upon test scores.

**PhantomViper**

Frazzled wrote:Why are they not effective? Their job is not education. Their job is to protect their union members, especially their union management. People forget that, admittedly because its a smoke screen thats thrown up.

After all some animals are more equal than others.

Seems like unions work exactly the same in the US as over here in my corner of Europe.

**Frazzled**

Evidently it is indeed still legal as SCOTUS just dropped an opinion related to one:
http://www.breitbart.com/system/wire/D9VHINNG5

**IcyCool**

daedalus wrote:Well, they CAN be, but from what I understand, the vast majority aren't. Generally speaking, we possess this bizarre mental disorder which causes us to not get that pissed when we work 60 hour weeks. I usually go home at 4 pm, but it's not been unknown for me to sit and home staring at a problem because it doesn't work and I don't know why.

It's usually seen in Government positions. The position I hold is a union one. It was made pretty clear to me when I applied that it was a union position, which meant I was required to join the union if I wanted the job. So I did. It's not like I give two gaks what they do with the roughly $7 I pay in monthly union dues (which are automatically deducted from my paycheck).

If I could no longer have the dues deducted directly from my paycheck, I'd setup some other automated payment, for convenience sake. If I had to write them a check every month, I'd inevitably forget, which would be bad if my employment was contingent upon prompt payment. If the union demanded automated payment, and I didn't have a family to feed, I'd probably fight that fight and try to pay via cash or check every month just to tick them off.

**Testify**

I had to give my card details when I joined the union...it's standard practice in most of the world.
Right-wing troll much?

**helgrenze**

Michigan Supreme Court found that the state’s practice of automatically deducting dues on behalf of the union’s political action committee violated campaign finance laws

This is why some people are upset (bolded). Aren't union dues supposed to go for strike funds and such?