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How, exactly, are we supposed to resolve Drazhar's Darting Strike ability in any combat in which a challenge has been issued?

Any ideas?

It's covered in the FAQ;

http://www.games-workshop.com/MEDIA_CustomProductCatalog/m2420311a_Dark_Eldar_6th_Ed_V1.pdf

Unless I cant readz... I don't think it's clear...

After Drahzer accepts the challenge, he's allowed to move around the fight, thus not in btb with the challenger anymore...

Does that mean the challenge doesn't occur?

Does that mean Drazher can strike at the model he's currently in btb?

What happens to the challenger? Does he get to strike at whomever he's in btb?

Drazhar challenges. Opponent accepts with basic character to let hero character live and swing at the squad. Move Drazhar and character into base contact. Then, Drazhar can be removed from that challenge and placed anywhere he'll fit in the combat. BA Sanguinary Priest hiding from you while you kill the Sergeant? Not anymore. Drazhar gets Darting Strike and a pile-in at I7 to go hit whoever he wants.

The real question is whether or not the rule about the Challenger and Challengee being the only ones who can strike blows against each other still matters once Drazhar gets out of base contact with the challengee. If so, then Drazhar can't hurt the character unless he's somehow still engaged with him after Darting Strike and Pile-In, but equally, the character can't hurt Drazhar and is in B2B with no one.

That totally depends on if GW wanted to be defensive, IE run away from a challenge; or offensive, and attack where most needed.

Personally think it's the latter (once he Darts he can hit something else).

culsandar wrote:That totally depends on if GW wanted to be defensive, IE run away from a challenge; or offensive, and attack where most needed.

Personally think it's the latter (once he Darts he can hit something else).

I'm inclined to agree, but I also think Darting Strike is meant to be a defensive AND offensive tool. You can use it to get out of challenges with a character that can kill Drazhar and move to where he won't be able to engage. You can also use it to get yourself into engagement with any character you want. Does this mean that Drazhar can "cut in" to other challenges that he's not previously part of?

Loch wrote:I'm inclined to agree, but I also think Darting Strike is meant to be a defensive AND offensive tool. You can use it to get out of challenges with a character that can kill Drazhar and move to where he won't be able to engage. You can also use it to get yourself into engagement with any character you want. Does this mean that Drazhar can "cut in" to other challenges that he's not previously part of?

No. The Dart ability does not override the rules on affecting another model's challenge. What most are unsure about is whether it's meant to allow him to continue to fight having left his own challenge.

what happens if he declines a challenge? WAaaaghing Gazgull charges in and issues a challenge. Drazhar delines. Can he then use his darting strike to repositionhimself back into combat?

Exergy wrote:what happens if he declines a challenge? WAaaaghing Gazgull charges in and issues a challenge. Drazhar delines. Can he then use his darting strike to repositionhimself back into combat?

No, because if you decline the Challenge rule says you do not attack, regardless of position.

The Challenge rules indicate that the models you and your opponent are challenging with 'are assumed to be' in base-to-base with each other for that combat even if they are not physically located next to each other for some reason.

This probably means that accepting or issuing a challenge with Drazhar and then moving him is probably futile as it'd do very little apart from putting him in a different location. (which you can already do as part of the challenge itself actually, abet only to move him closer to his opponent.)

So does that mean that if Drazhar is challenged or challenges, he can't use Darting Strike to move to another part of the unit and fight them? Or can he do so, and the challenged enemy character is left there, unable to fight?


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Neorealist wrote:The Challenge rules indicate that the models you and your opponent are challenging with 'are assumed to be' in base-to-base with each other for that combat even if they are not physically located next to each other for some reason.

The problem is that this line you're referencing is applied before Drazhar uses his Darting Strike, during which he then moves.

Doomaflatchi wrote:The problem is that this line you're referencing is applied before Drazhar uses his Darting Strike, during which he then moves.

Granted, but it's also applied during and after. The challenger and challengee are presumed to be in base to base (even if they literally aren't) for the entire 'ensuing fight', not just the commencement of such.

Challenge clearly states that they are assumed to in b2b regardless how far apart they are

Fair enough... it seems that not even Darting Strike can save Drazhar from a simple Sergeant yelling "Hey, you!" Thanks for answering my initial question.

But that makes me think of something else... can Drazhar's Darting Strike cause a unit to Pile In out of coherency if there's an ongoing challenge? Consider this: Drazhar is alone (a single-model unit) fighting a large enemy squad. In the first round of combat, he is challenged by the opponent, and accepts because he must (again, single-model unit). The enemy character moves into base-to-base with Drazhar. Then, Drazhar uses his Darting Strike to move out to the very edge of the enemy unit, adjacent to models that are unengaged (which he can do because they're part of the same combat).

Now, the Challenges section says that, until the Challenge is resolved, both the challenger and the challengee are considered to be in base to base with each other, and only with each other; so no other models can be in base-to-base contact with them. How does the Pile In move work?

First, the enemy character. "First, any models Pile In if this will bring them into base contact with an enemy." Done, he's already in base-to-base with Drazhar, so he doesn't move.

What about the other models in the squad? Their Pile In move cannot bring them into base-to-base with Drazhar, as the ongoing Challenge prevents it. "Second, any models Pile In if this will bring them to within 2" of a friendly model in base contact with an enemy." Okay, so those enemy models within 2" of the Challenging character Pile In around him, clumping up. What about the models farther than 2" away from the character? "Any remaining models that are not in base contact with one or more enemy models and have yet to Pile In must now do so, and must attempt to get as close as possible to one or more of the enemy units locked in this combat." Now that, they can do - they move towards Drazhar, and Pile In around him, because he is the only model in the enemy unit locked in the assault.

So now you seem to have the enemy unit split into two groups - one clump gathered tightly around the enemy character, and another clump gathered tightly around Drazhar. Drazhar and the character cannot move during their Pile In, as they're already in base-to-base. But with Darting Strike, Drazhar can move outside the ring of units that are surrounding him, pulling them even farther away from the character.

Is this right? Can Drazhar really kite half a unit across the board, as long as no one dies in the challenge? Does this mean that, if he wins the challenge, he can only be attacked by the models he pulled out of position, but can still kill all of them if he rolls well enough? Could this be used to allow Drazhar to 'pull' units around as temporary terrain? If this is possible, are there any other neat uses for it?