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Well, Sternguard have gotten a boost in the 6th edition, since the armies will be more infantry based.

Sternguard have a solution to almost everything: anti-MC (special ammunition, combi-plasma), anti-horde (heavy flamer), anti-tank (combi-melta), anti-cover (special ammunition).

Thoughts?

Thing is that even though they may be able to take on any of these things if you know what's coming up, unless you take 2 combimeltas and 2combiplasmas and then a heavy flamer, you're probably going to struggle against one or two of the three things: if you know what you're up against then sure you can arm yourself to be amazing at taking it out, but if you don't then chances are you won't be particularly good against any, or you'll need 3 sternguard squads as one for each. TBH, it could work if you're writing an army list for a specific opponent, but don't expect them to work against whatever comes up.

For the cost of 1 sternguard, you can have 2 tactical squads. Augment those with the right combination of units, and you overcome the benefits of sternguard special ammo. Totally not worth the points.

For less points you can have a grey knight squad, as an ally, and they can have str5 shooting, and have power weapon attacks, and hammerhand, and warp quake, str 8 psycannons. Overall a much better bargain.

Sternguard are only worth it if you take 5 and two heavy weapons and run them as a mini dev squad.

KGatch113 wrote:
For the cost of 1 sternguard, you can have 2 tactical squads. Augment those with the right combination of units, and you overcome the benefits of sternguard special ammo. Totally not worth the points.

For less points you can have a grey knight squad, as an ally, and they can have str5 shooting, and have power weapon attacks, and hammerhand, and warp quake, str 8 psycannons. Overall a much better bargain.

Sternguard are only worth it if you take 5 and two heavy weapons and run them as a mini dev squad.

...wow. Just wow. S5 shooting is as nothing compared to wounding on 2+, ignoring cover or having AP3. You also can't have S8 psycannons, and you'd have to take a GK HQ as well, only to find out that the Grey Knights can't score for you and can't go in a Drop Pod.

5 Sternguard in a Drop Pod with combi-(somethings) will pretty much annihilate their intended target. Have to kill that Land Raider? Here you go, 5x combi-melta. That Trygon looking evil? Wham, combi-plasma. Those Orks Waaagh!-ing all over the field? Combi-flamers. You can tailor a squad of Sternguard Veterans to fill a gap in your army and they'll do it much better than Tactical Squads. You're underestimating the power of the special ammo.

AlmightyWalrus wrote:

KGatch113 wrote:
For the cost of 1 sternguard, you can have 2 tactical squads. Augment those with the right combination of units, and you overcome the benefits of sternguard special ammo. Totally not worth the points.

For less points you can have a grey knight squad, as an ally, and they can have str5 shooting, and have power weapon attacks, and hammerhand, and warp quake, str 8 psycannons. Overall a much better bargain.

Sternguard are only worth it if you take 5 and two heavy weapons and run them as a mini dev squad.

...wow. Just wow. S5 shooting is as nothing compared to wounding on 2+, ignoring cover or having AP3. You also can't have S8 psycannons, and you'd have to take a GK HQ as well, only to find out that the Grey Knights can't score for you and can't go in a Drop Pod.

5 Sternguard in a Drop Pod with combi-(somethings) will pretty much annihilate their intended target. Have to kill that Land Raider? Here you go, 5x combi-melta. That Trygon looking evil? Wham, combi-plasma. Those Orks Waaagh!-ing all over the field? Combi-flamers. You can tailor a squad of Sternguard Veterans to fill a gap in your army and they'll do it much better than Tactical Squads. You're underestimating the power of the special ammo.

This can work well. Then again, if you're up against a DE army with your squads of 5x meltas and 5x flamers, well done, you can use all those points to take out a ravager and a transport, or possily take out a transport and its unit intstead, and then guess what? You'll have wasted those points because the two squads get obliterated in the next turn. I agree that it could work, but so could many other things.

I have to say, I think a lot of people go wrong by trying to over-equip their Sternguard. You pay a premium for the special ammo that they carry, which is very good at performing various battlefield roles. If you start turning them into a keystone unit, sinking more and more points into them, you'll find yourself short in other areas. That's my take on them, anyway.

AlmightyWalrus wrote:

KGatch113 wrote:
For the cost of 1 sternguard, you can have 2 tactical squads. Augment those with the right combination of units, and you overcome the benefits of sternguard special ammo. Totally not worth the points.

For less points you can have a grey knight squad, as an ally, and they can have str5 shooting, and have power weapon attacks, and hammerhand, and warp quake, str 8 psycannons. Overall a much better bargain.

Sternguard are only worth it if you take 5 and two heavy weapons and run them as a mini dev squad.

...wow. Just wow. S5 shooting is as nothing compared to wounding on 2+, ignoring cover or having AP3. You also can't have S8 psycannons, and you'd have to take a GK HQ as well, only to find out that the Grey Knights can't score for you and can't go in a Drop Pod.

5 Sternguard in a Drop Pod with combi-(somethings) will pretty much annihilate their intended target. Have to kill that Land Raider? Here you go, 5x combi-melta. That Trygon looking evil? Wham, combi-plasma. Those Orks Waaagh!-ing all over the field? Combi-flamers. You can tailor a squad of Sternguard Veterans to fill a gap in your army and they'll do it much better than Tactical Squads. You're underestimating the power of the special ammo.

My bad, I was thinking dreadnought autocannons can be str 8. How do Grey Knights not count as scoring? Drop pods = putting your army close enough for the enemy to kill. As for HQ, you can take a cheap Inquisitor and throw Prescience on them, augmenting their shooting. I'd rather have str 5 shooting that can glance a rhino, wounds Marines on 3's and most xenos on 2's, and get 2 shots at 24 any day. Throw in the power weapons etc....

KGatch113 wrote:

AlmightyWalrus wrote:

KGatch113 wrote:
For the cost of 1 sternguard, you can have 2 tactical squads. Augment those with the right combination of units, and you overcome the benefits of sternguard special ammo. Totally not worth the points.

For less points you can have a grey knight squad, as an ally, and they can have str5 shooting, and have power weapon attacks, and hammerhand, and warp quake, str 8 psycannons. Overall a much better bargain.

Sternguard are only worth it if you take 5 and two heavy weapons and run them as a mini dev squad.

...wow. Just wow. S5 shooting is as nothing compared to wounding on 2+, ignoring cover or having AP3. You also can't have S8 psycannons, and you'd have to take a GK HQ as well, only to find out that the Grey Knights can't score for you and can't go in a Drop Pod.

5 Sternguard in a Drop Pod with combi-(somethings) will pretty much annihilate their intended target. Have to kill that Land Raider? Here you go, 5x combi-melta. That Trygon looking evil? Wham, combi-plasma. Those Orks Waaagh!-ing all over the field? Combi-flamers. You can tailor a squad of Sternguard Veterans to fill a gap in your army and they'll do it much better than Tactical Squads. You're underestimating the power of the special ammo.

My bad, I was thinking dreadnought autocannons can be str 8. How do Grey Knights not count as scoring? Drop pods = putting your army close enough for the enemy to kill. As for HQ, you can take a cheap Inquisitor and throw Prescience on them, augmenting their shooting. I'd rather have str 5 shooting that can glance a rhino, wounds Marines on 3's and most xenos on 2's, and get 2 shots at 24 any day. Throw in the power weapons etc....

Nevermind, they are scoring, I misremembered. At any rate, dismissing Drop Pods as "putting your army close enough for the enemy to kill" is just silly. Dropping a pod on one flank and then melting whatever you're shooting the first round combined with terrain means that far from the entire enemy army can shoot you.

Yes, you can have S8 Autocannnons... on Dreadnoughts. Psycannons aren't Autocannons. Also, why would you rather have shooting that wounds Marines on 3+ and most xenos on 2+ when you can have shooting that wounds Wraithlords, Mephiston, Grots, Bloodthirsters, Trygons, Bikers and everything else on 2+?

Sternguard also synergise wonderfully with three good C:SM HQs: Vulkan, Pedro and Lysander. Twin-linked combi-meltas speak for themselves, scoring speaks for itself and Bolter Drill speaks for itself.

Im thinking of running a unit of Sternguard with 10 combi-flamers, it should make people think twice about assaulting them, an averaqge of 20 hits on overwatch to the first unit that attacks you could be huge. at worst it helps in the one phase that Sterny dont want to be in.

Brother Sergeant Bob wrote:Im thinking of running a unit of Sternguard with 10 combi-flamers, it should make people think twice about assaulting them, an averaqge of 20 hits on overwatch to the first unit that attacks you could be huge. at worst it helps in the one phase that Sterny dont want to be in.

But that's gonna cost masses for simply making them think twice about assault, and if I were facing that I'd just shoot them to death anyway. Unless special weapons are going to be used on the offensive, I don't see the point. That unit would just be spending 50 points on making sure the enemy shoots them.

I'm currently Running 2 Sternguard Squads
1] Sergeant with Power Fist/Combi-Plasma, x7 Combi-Plasma and 2x Plasma Guns
2] Sergeant with Power Fist/Combi-Melta, x7 Combi-Melta and 2x Melta Guns

I have done well with the Plasma Sternguard; it is an excellent Multi-Tasker. I can use them for killing TEQs/MCs/Transports. With the change to how Firing Ranges works I don’t have to land 12” away when Podding in. the Special Issue Ammunition elevates the Have need to fire my Plasma at MEQs, allowing me to save it for MCs, Tanks or Dreads.

My Melta Sternguard should also be come a good Multi-Tasker, though not as much as the Plasma Armed Sternguard. What it will do is Kill Armor Quick. You do have to get within 12” when you pod in which makes there use a little tricky.

Looking at the Special Ammunition:
>Dragonfire Bolts: This become your main Killer of Jet-Bikes and AV10 Skimmer, Jink is a Cover Save. So it’s only S4, 20 S4 Shots should Glance a Land Speeder to Death, No Save.

>Hellfire Rounds: With the 2+ Poison and AP5 these will be murder vs. Ork and Nid Assault. They will also be great for dealing with MCs.

>Kraken Bolts: 15” Rapid Fire and a 30” Single Shot, with an AP4, you can shoot up most thing from a superior range for a while.

>Vengeance Rounds: These are your MEQ Killers.

Looking at the Missions I am only going to talk about 2; Big Guns Never Tire and The Scouring and with the change of who are scoring units.
With Pedro you can have up to 12 Scoring units, without Combat Squading, that’s up to 24 with Combat Squading.
With out him you can easily put your Sternguard the Objectives on you side and use them to Deny your opponent the Points while your FA or HS units Scores.

The change of the Move and Fire Rules also changes things with Special and Heavy Weapons.
>Flamer: Why, when you can take Heavy Flamers.
>Heavy Bolter: A pair of these still give you 6 Shots when you Snap Fire, but if you don’t move give you a good RoF.
>Heavy Flamer: S5 AP4, Kills Bugs [and Skimmers] Dead. No Jink!
>Las Cannon: With the Snap Fire Rules they become very viable.
>Melta-Guns: They have just became better Tank Killers
>Missile Launchers: Once more with Snap fire you can still fire them on the move or on Overwatch. Once the Skyfire=Missile Launcher rule is finally worked out will give you another unit that is capable of AAA work.
>Multi-Melta: With the Snap Fire Rules they become very viable.
>Plasma Cannon: As much as I love Plasma Cannons these will be a waist for Sternguard as it will slow then down.
>Plasma Guns: Got even better for both there ability to kill TEQs and every thing with an AV of 13 or Less.

Sternguard are pretty.

if i still had my Crimson Fists army i woudl take in a Pod with pedro every game.

i'm hoping that Chaso get an equivilant in the new 'dex.

p_gray99 wrote:

Brother Sergeant Bob wrote:Im thinking of running a unit of Sternguard with 10 combi-flamers, it should make people think twice about assaulting them, an averaqge of 20 hits on overwatch to the first unit that attacks you could be huge. at worst it helps in the one phase that Sterny dont want to be in.

But that's gonna cost masses for simply making them think twice about assault, and if I were facing that I'd just shoot them to death anyway. Unless special weapons are going to be used on the offensive, I don't see the point. That unit would just be spending 50 points on making sure the enemy shoots them.

YH but id take my Sternguard getting shot at because it means they could shoot back with their special ammo, Sternguard really suffer in assault, and if it means were still shooting at each other then ill take it.

Brother Sergeant Bob wrote:YH but id take my Sternguard getting shot at because it means they could shoot back with their special ammo, Sternguard really suffer in assault, and if it means were still shooting at each other then ill take it.

It could work...
Then again, if you're in a position where you're going to be a threat, I'm just going to fire 45 poisoned shots into you which should on average take you down to no guys left (though only just), then throw something out so assault you if you survive, relying on either armour or FNP to not take too many hits on the way in. That still leaves me another 3 squads of anti-infantry, and all my anti-tank to put somewhere else for that turn.

Sternguard are very nice in combination with divination powers in 6th. Full BS on overwatch makes the squad extremely unpleasant to assault and the primaris reroll power makes their shooting even nastier.

I've been pleasantly surprised by Sternguard in my Blood Angels. Whether they are gunning down necron warriors with kraken bolts or lighting up monstrous creatures will hellfire, they've been the rock that my 6e Blood Angels are built on. I'm currently running them pretty lean with 2 squads of five with a pair of lascannons in one squad and a pair of multimeltas in the other.

I used a Sternguard drop pod army for a while. Drop pod assault with 2 units of combi meltas first turn can really wreck an opposing army but after that they get shot up by everything, assaulted, and you probably lost more points than your opponent did. My suggestion is to take Pedro, drop pod them on objectives, and depending on load out and size of the unit they can probably defend it pretty well.

10 man squad combat-squadded in a pod.

2 Heavy flamers, 2 combi flamers, 2 combi plas, and 4 combi melta, 310 pts plus pod.

Termies in a raider? 4 melta and a combi flamer in one squad, both heavies and the remaining combies in the other. 4 meltas pop the raider, termies eat 4 plas shots and 3 templates from squad 2. Any counter charge unit meets at least one flamer on overwatch.

Razor/chimera/Battlewagon/venom spam? Split them even. 2 melta and a plas knock down almost any medium light vehicle reliably, and any counter charge eats 2 templates.

Infantry horde? Even split again. 4 templates drop, then each unit has one remaining for the countercharge.

In all of these situations you have a good shot to earn your points and more, and counter assaults get flamed and force your opponent to choose between multi-assault neutering or possibly leaving a unit active for another turn of flame and fancy ammo. Combat squadding out of a pod up to 6" allows them to target moderately seperated units if necessary, and make the pod dropping too far away a laughable prospect.

Sternguard with Divination would be very nice.

Guess which school Codex Marines don't get.

Technically you could take an Allied Psyker, but I don't find that a particularly inspiring option.

How to use my bikes in 6th edition? That I'm still working on.

6th Ed has me having a recurring dream of 10 sterngaurd, with Lysander in a drop pod, with a mix of combi-weapons. The idea of lysander absorbing all their incoming fire/helping hold off any assaults they face, and giving them rerolls to hit, makes it seem pretty deathstarish.

Dont forget tjhat they get 2 attacks each in melee.

htj wrote:I have to say, I think a lot of people go wrong by trying to over-equip their Sternguard. You pay a premium for the special ammo that they carry, which is very good at performing various battlefield roles. If you start turning them into a keystone unit, sinking more and more points into them, you'll find yourself short in other areas. That's my take on them, anyway.

I do like equipping my sterngaurd with some combi- melta's and flamers, just to help deal with any things that the special ammo may not be able to handle, and maybe a heavy weapon or 2 if i am going to use them as a long range support squad. I do agree with the don't over equip them statement, but because I run a Pedro list, its much better for me to equip them more then say, the scouts I am taking to meet the troop requirement.

Just hope you don't face Thousand Sons because their AP 3 will make Sternguard Vets look like chumps.

Sternguards got quite a buff in 6th ed. But 6th ed is an edition where vehicles are chumps.

Nobody does drop pod melta suicide anymore (that is so 5th ed; where vehicles were gods). IMHO, the best way to use sternguards are in mid range shooting - they should never be assaulted. And should be prepped with countercharge units.

With the advent of flying MC, TDA, and nerfed assaults, Sternguards are best played in the midfield - and i seriously dont think they need combi weaps.

-Moving and shooting AP4 rounds at 30" and rapid at 15" is just gold due to focus fire (thus diminishing the use of Dragonfire but not utterly useless)

-Hellfire rounds are better than ever - everyone will be trying to bring MC baddies and you would be wounding them on a 2+. See that Flying DP you just downed? it's gonna die this turn.

-Vengeance rounds got REALLY SCARY. remember what people used to do against vengeance rounds in 5th ed? they just stayed in cover. With focus fire and nerfed cover saves, vengeance rounds just got deadlier.

The ultimate problem with sternguard is, well, for a unit that is good at holding the line, they cant score. And Pedro kantor doesnt really help in this department - not when you still need to fill those mandatory Troop slots and pedro himself @ 175 points is a huge crock.

Protip: One squad is enough, play them like elites.

I love sternguard and all, and they are my favorite unit, but my only problem is that they die like regular marines. when I ran all of them with a combi-melta/plasma in a rhino, it was a major blow to lose even one to enemy fire.

I know they are supposed to be drop pod only, but I like to try and use them as front line troopers all the same.

I don't know about you guys but I can't be happier with my sternguard vets... they have never let me down...

Freman Bloodglaive wrote:Sternguard with Divination would be very nice.

Guess which school Codex Marines don't get.

Technically you could take an Allied Psyker, but I don't find that a particularly inspiring option.

How to use my bikes in 6th edition? That I'm still working on.

Blood Angels can! Even the primaris power is worth having. Bikes in 6th, lay them out there and beast mode with them. Again, better for Blood Angels with their access to FNP.

Sternguard with Lysander are pretty good.

Sternguard are great, especially with Kantor/Lysander and even Vulkan with the correct set up (Combi-Melta/Flamer)
Though those character aren't necessary.

I personally think that all of one kind of combi is a waste.