Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

===HQ===
Crowe

Xenos Inquisitor
-Rad Grenede
-Psycho grenade (needed 2nd HQ to open up double FOC)

===Troops===

Purifier X 5
-Psycannon X2
-Halberd X2
-Hammer on knight
--Razorback
---Psybolt ammo

Purifier X 5
-Psycannon X2
-Halberd X2
-Hammer on knight
--Razorback
---Psybolt ammo

Purifier X 5
-Psycannon X2
-Halberd X2
-Hammer on knight
--Razorback
---Psybolt ammo

Purifier X 5
-Psycannon X2
-Halberd X2
-Hammer on knight
--Rhino

Purifier X 5
-Psycannon X2
-Halberd X2
-Hammer on knight
--Rhino

===Fast Attack===
Storm Raven
-Psybolt
-hurricane bolters
-assault cannon
-typhoon

===Heavy Support===

Dreadnought
-psybolt
-Autocannon
-Autocannon

Dreadnought
-psybolt
-Autocannon
-Autocannon

Dreadnought
-psybolt
-Autocannon
-Autocannon

Dreadnought
-psybolt
-Autocannon
-Autocannon


===Total 2000/2000===

======================================
======================================
One purifier squad starts in Stormraven with Inquistor. Crowe hops in Rhino and either hides/attacks enemy depending on mission.


I got the Xeno Inq just to open up for 4th dread. Please feel free to critique or offer suggestions. Not sure if I want to run the 4 dreads but they have always done great in games.

Not sure about the typoon on the raven, seems overpriced and not too useful. Remember zooming you can only fire 4 weps, so both sponsons, the assault cannon and pop a mindstrike if you're fighting horde, or sponsons, ass cannon on infantry and potms a multimelta onto a tank. Would definately go for the MM over the typhoon, gives it anti tank and with those mindstrikes doesn't really loose anything, mindstrikes are stronger than frag and MM is better than krak. With those 25pts you could master craft all the hammers or something.

Yeah, I'd go for the MM over the typhoon also. Gives you an out against land raiders and bastions (you'll be seeing a lot of bastions over time).

Now here's a thought. Get rid of the Inq and typhoon to get more bodies. Now instead of the 4th dread, get a bastion with quad-guns instead. Now you have an AV14 bunker that's better equiped to deal with flyers.

I had not really thought about taking the bastion but that's actually a good idea and drops a dread off the list. The Inq felt very out of place.

With having 2 Psycannons in each unit if Purifiers, is there really a need to have Razorbacks? I know being able to deliever the Purifiers out of the vehicle and have it still be a threat with the Heavy Bolter is nice, but does it help that much?

Also agree the Typhoon is not really the best option when you can get the TL Multi-Melta for free.

Also, with Challenges being in the game, it is very easy for another armies capt or HQ choice punk out your Knight of the Flame with his Daemon Hammer before he even gets to swing. Why not find room to give some of them a Warding Staff? Instead of insta dying to a power weapon you have a 2++ that can keep your 5 man groups rolling strong. Just give the Hammer to a different guy. Just a thought.

Yeah, I like the warding staves also. I usually give it to half of my purifiers (round down). There are some slight changes though. Now with challenges being commonplace, the stave is extra useful in combat. However, as you can no longer take any saves from Perils, the stave no longer protects you from that in assault.

Razorbacks, meh. S6 isn't that mega awesome. Also, you need to get your dudes out to dish out double psycannon death. Keep them inside the Rhino (Rhino acts as a mobile bunker) and they are immune to small arms fire.

The single Stormraven is a single target, while it is durable, it is still going to attract attention.

Played my first match with this list last night and it was a success. It does need some changes though and I like the comments above. I played against an Eldar army spamming scatter lasers. The dreads just rained down hull points all over the place and popped all the transports easily. He had no skyfire so the raven was left alone the entire match.

After playing I agree that the heavy bolter razors seem to not do so well. I will switch to Rhino's and see if I can afford a few staves as well.

I pretty much relied on shooting and only got into CC once all game, and that was my purifier/Inquisitor squad against a single dire avenger.

I wouldn't take a stave on Purifier units tbh. See, Purifiers are better at shooting, as you have double psycannons. If you are in assault and making saves with the stave like no tomorrow, then you're not free from combat. It then becomes a question of who is tying up who. I would either lose the Puriifers in assault so I can shoot the enemy unit next turn, or charge with everything I've got.

Really, a stave is warranted on a dedicated close combat unit i.e Paladins or Terminators. They are meant to be smashing stuff up in combat. You do not want your shooting unit locked in combat.

mercer wrote:I wouldn't take a stave on Purifier units tbh. See, Purifiers are better at shooting, as you have double psycannons. If you are in assault and making saves with the stave like no tomorrow, then you're not free from combat. It then becomes a question of who is tying up who. I would either lose the Puriifers in assault so I can shoot the enemy unit next turn, or charge with everything I've got.

Really, a stave is warranted on a dedicated close combat unit i.e Paladins or Terminators. They are meant to be smashing stuff up in combat. You do not want your shooting unit locked in combat.

Sorry, but I don't agree. While I also prefer to shoot with my purifiers rather than to assault with them, realistically, this is never really the case. Because in probably 90% of the battles, there is almost always combat involved. Either your enemy, if he is more assaulty, will want to assault you or if your enemy is less assaulty (i.e. guards, tau, MSU), you will want to assault them. But even those less assaulty armies will usually have deadly HQ's.

Another good thing about staves is now you can make your warding stave into a tanking character. Now you can allocate all the power weapon wounds to him rather than have to spread it around like you did in 5E (use Look Out Sir to pass the regular wounds to others). It makes those 5-man purifiers units slightly more durable to armies with power weapons.

Then if you prefer to shoot with Purifiers why do you want them stuck in combat? I never said combat isn't going to happen, but you either want your Purifiers free to shoot or you want the enemy unit to be free to shoot at. Plus I believe it's 25 points a stave, that's for a single wound model btw.

And, yes, you can do that with staves. As I said previously, it becomes who is tying up who. You do not want your shooting unit engaged in pro long combat. If you keep the enemy tied up in combat, then your shooting units are not shooting at them.

Let the Purifiers die or survive, not tie things up in combat.

Yeah rhinos are far better than razorbacks. Also want is your plan against neurons with 6-7 fliers at this point level?

I'd drop the inquisitor you don't need the 2nd force org. Drop some psyrifle dreads for atleast another stormraven and quadgun. If you want a 2nd hq take coteaz with divination and he make a psycannon squad lethal.

But you need a way to deal with fliers in 6th ed.

Neurons I reckon someone is using a andriod phone, as mine does the same auto correct when I type Necrons.

Yeah got me there...

So modified list to look like this.


===HQ===
Crowe


===Troops===

Purifier X 5
-Psycannon X2
-Halberd X2
-Hammer on knight
--Rhino

Purifier X 5
-Psycannon X2
-Halberd X2
-Hammer on knight
--Rhino

Purifier X 5
-Psycannon X2
-Halberd X2
-Hammer on knight
--Rhino

Purifier X 5
-Psycannon X2
-Halberd X2
-Hammer on knight
--Rhino

Purifier X 5
-Psycannon X1
-Halberd X2
-Hammer on knight
--Rhino

===Fast Attack===
Storm Raven
-Psybolt
-hurricane bolters
-assault cannon
-MM

Storm Raven
-Psybolt
-hurricane bolters
-assault cannon
-MM
===Heavy Support===

Dreadnought
-psybolt
-Autocannon
-Autocannon

Dreadnought
-psybolt
-Autocannon
-Autocannon


===Total 1865/2000===

I have enough left over for a 3rd dread or a battlement, thoughts?

Third Dreadnought

I'd probably go with battlement, but as you have nothing really to man it a 3rd Dread is nearly as good against fliers as a Bs2 quadgun and much better against everything else... But you could fit in a basic Inquis to fire it, but he'd probably die before he got the chance...

mercer wrote:Then if you prefer to shoot with Purifiers why do you want them stuck in combat? I never said combat isn't going to happen, but you either want your Purifiers free to shoot or you want the enemy unit to be free to shoot at. Plus I believe it's 25 points a stave, that's for a single wound model btw.

And, yes, you can do that with staves. As I said previously, it becomes who is tying up who. You do not want your shooting unit engaged in pro long combat. If you keep the enemy tied up in combat, then your shooting units are not shooting at them.

Let the Purifiers die or survive, not tie things up in combat.

Because theory doesn't always translate into practice. Yes, ideally you really don't want them locked into combat. They will get into combat and let me give you some reasons why.

- Psycannons get shot up and killed. Now how much damage with your stormbolters do when Cleansing Flame is much better against a mob and force weapons against smaller MEQ units.

- when going up against MSU units. Assaulting them (if in range) will produce better results than shooting them, not to mention that it protects your fragile 5-man units against enemy shooting.

- to contest an objective. Assault enemy troop on his objective and challenge the sargeant if possible to lock down the squad.

- to stop enemy HQ's/uber characters from rampaging through your army. What happens with a flyrant, necron Overlord, St. Celestine and other assaulty HQ's get into your deployment zone? They will wipe out those 5-man purifier units with ease....unless you have a warding stave to stop them dead in their tracks (at least for a few turns).

- if your stave makes just 1 save against an attack where you normally don't get a save, then you have just made back the cost for it already. Any additional power weapon saves it makes is an added bonus.

- the Way of the Water Warriors. The grey knights are not just a shooty army. Rather, they are a reactive army. Shoot the more assaulty army. Shoot and then assault the more shooty army. A warding stave gives you more flexibility to play a reactionary force.


Now I am not saying the warding stave is mandatory on purifiers, but I have found them useful enough to include 1 or 2 in my purifier lists.



@Melchiour:

I like the mobility of your revised lists with dual ravens. However, the only thing that bothers me are the troop choices. Honestly, I feel that it isn't enough given the emphasis of 6E on objectives-based missions. Now some may think I'm crazy for saying this, especially when you have 5 units of purifiers, but let me tell you why I feel this way.

In a purifier list, unlike in other lists, your troops are your main offense. Unlike other armies which uses MSU troops just to hold objectives and other more killy but sacrificial non-scoring units as the bulk of their offense (think deathstar armies or armies like necrons which have very good support units), in a purifier list, you need to put your scoring units in harm's way to actually fight the enemy. Thus, against certain armies (esp. the deathstar ones or shooty Tau), I find that even 25 scoring bodies is not enough, and that's even with 2 warding staves in my army. You really need more bodies.

Also, another thing you have to consider is that with 2 flyers, you lose firepower until turn 2 or maybe even turn 3.

This is a list that I am considering:


Crowe

5x5 Purifiers - 2x Psycannons, halberds, 2 staves, 3 hammers, rhinos (possibly with dozers+searchlights)
1x5 Strike squad - 1x psycannon, rhino

Stormraven - "the works" - TL-AC, TL-MM, Hurricane, Psybolt

3x Psyflemans

It's not theory, dude, it's fact. You do not want to be engaged in prolong combat. Your army is a shooting, not assault.

A stave is used to deal with big tough stuff i.e Hammernators. You do not want to be engaged with these for a long time, as you want to shoot them to kill them.

Cleansing flame is really only used for hordes. Two rounds of combat and a horde will be gone.No need for stave in that situation.

The only *fact* that is for sure is that things never always go as you planned. Yes, ideally, you always want to shoot with your purifiers and never want to assault with them. Hate to break it to you buddy, but idealistic isn't realistic. The fact is that in most games, and especially against the more competent players, they do get into assault.

Now it's ok not to equip them with warding staves. You can just write off the unit that gets assaulted by almost any other non-MSU unit. All I am saying is that, in my opinion, 1 or 2 warding staves in my purifier army is usually worth it. The lives that it saves easily pays back for its costs. It also lets you stand up to some of the more assaulty units/enemy HQ's where you normally would have to write off the unit as dead.

Hey, dude, each to their own and all that. If you like warding staves on your Purifiers, that's cool. Personally I am not a fan of them for reasons mentioned. The only time I would take a stave would be on Terminators or Paladins.