LONDON – When the most famous flame in sports winds its way through the streets of London before entering the Olympic Stadium and providing the 2012 Games with one of its most iconic images, it will be seen as a touching gesture of symbolism, grace and a nod to the ancient world.

Yet while the torch relay began once again at the historic site of Olympia on May 10 and is an integral part of any Games, its modern incarnation comes laced with sinister undertones that can be traced back to Adolf Hitler's Nazi Party and the controversial 1936 Olympics in Berlin.

Many of those witnessing the final journey of the flame July 27 will have little idea that its origins do not lie in ancient Greece, and was instead formulated as a major part of the Nazis' plot to shift international opinion in their favor.

"There had been no such torch relays in the ancient Games or, for that matter, in any of the 10 modern Summer Olympics preceding the Berlin Games," wrote renowned author David Clay Large in his outstanding book, "Nazi Games: The Olympics of 1936," which was published in 2007. "The torch relay was one of but many ways in which the Nazi Games helped define the modern Olympic experience as we know it today."


[ Photos: Olympic torch relay ]



The torch relay would play a major role in the propaganda offensive backed by Hitler and orchestrated by Dr. Joseph Goebbels. In the lead-up to the Games, the Nazi Propaganda Ministry supported a relay of the Olympic flame that would not only provide spectacular footage for Olympia, the 1938 film that was used to promote the Nazi ideal ahead of World War II, but could also be used for significant political and public relations benefit.

The ancient Greeks had run relay races that involved flames as part of their worship to the Gods, but there had been no such symbolism in the modern Games. There had been a flame at Amsterdam in 1928 and Los Angeles in 1932, but it did not come from Olympia and there was no relay.

Yet ahead of Berlin, the Nazis wasted no opportunity to ensure the flame's journey was used to promote the party ethos. At the lighting ceremony in Greece, a German ambassador dedicated the torch to Hitler himself, while a band played the marching song of the Sturmabteilung, the Nazi Party army, according to Large.

"The Nazis used the Olympics to give the German public an exaggerated sense of national superiority that later was used in the service of military aggression," said Dr. Rafael Medoff, director of Holocaust Studies at the David S. Wyman Institute in Washington D.C. "The games also gave Hitler a way to soften his public image in order to allay the international community's concerns about his bigotry, violence and militarism."



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Goebbels, Hitler's propaganda chief, carefully orchestrated coverage of the torch's journey toward Berlin, which stretched through the Sudetenland, the region of Western Czechoslovakia that Germany wished to, and eventually would, annex.

Organization of the relay was left to Carl Diem, a leading German sports administrator and chief organizer of the Berlin Games who willed his extraordinary collection of memorabilia to a trust when he died in 1962. Yet Diem himself had a mixed past. He was a strong administrator and promoter of sports, and was not a Party member. Indeed, his wife's Jewish heritage led to him being regarded with suspicion by some Nazi higher-ups.

However, toward the end of the war he gave an impassioned speech exhorting young German soldiers to fight until the death even as the full force of the Allied machine closed in.

Walter Borgers, director of the Carl and Lies Diem Archive, spoke of Diem's passionate belief in the torch relay.

"He saw this as his life's work," Borgers said. "He decided to make the relay part of the ceremony. It was the best advertising campaign of all time."



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Diem and film director Leni Riefenstahl created much of the vision, but it was wholeheartedly embraced by Hitler and the Nazis. On the last part of the relay through Germany, only blue-eyed blond males were selected and the torch led Hitler and other senior party members into the Olympic stadium.

The imagery was powerful and the PR spin was, sadly, effective in persuading many observers that the Nazi regime was strong, but not brutal.

"To a significant extent, these Nazi deceptions worked," Medoff said. "The New York Times reported to its readers that the Germans displayed 'good will' and 'flawless hospitality.' The Associated Press predicted that the games would help 'assure peace' in Europe."

The truth of course, was very different and within three years the entire continent was at war. Yet when hostilities finally ceased and the Games restarted in London in 1948, the torch relay was considered an element worth keeping.

Over the past 10 weeks, about 8,000 people will have carried the torch through 1,019 cities, towns and villages en route to London. How many know of the relay's murky origin is anyone's guess.

Jihadin wrote:Also reenforced that the US flagged is never dipped to another foriegn leader

The quote was "no earthly king".

The flag of the United States had also not been displayed above the stadium before the opening. The United States' flag bearer, Ralph Rose, refused to dip the flag to Edward VII of the United Kingdom in the royal box. However, the flag was later dipped in the collective greeting of the royal family. Martin Sheridan, Irish American Athletic Club member and American team captain, is apocryphally believed to have supported Rose by explaining "This flag dips to no earthly king." It is claimed that his statement exemplified both American and Irish defiance of the British monarchy. However, research has shown that this quotation by Sheridan was first reported in 1952, some 24 years after his death.[5][6]

SoloFalcon1138 wrote:The torch relay started in Amsterdam 4 years before its "Nazi origins". And the tradition hails from ancient Greece...

Jihadin wrote:

The quote was "no earthly king".

The flag of the United States had also not been displayed above the stadium before the opening. The United States' flag bearer, Ralph Rose, refused to dip the flag to Edward VII of the United Kingdom in the royal box. However, the flag was later dipped in the collective greeting of the royal family. Martin Sheridan, Irish American Athletic Club member and American team captain, is apocryphally believed to have supported Rose by explaining "This flag dips to no earthly king." It is claimed that his statement exemplified both American and Irish defiance of the British monarchy. However, research has shown that this quotation by Sheridan was first reported in 1952, some 24 years after his death.[5][6]

Of course it was used to give "Fox Uniform" to Hitler to.

In cse any wondering about the US Flag
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Flag_Code

hotsauceman1 wrote:

Jihadin wrote:

The quote was "no earthly king".

The flag of the United States had also not been displayed above the stadium before the opening. The United States' flag bearer, Ralph Rose, refused to dip the flag to Edward VII of the United Kingdom in the royal box. However, the flag was later dipped in the collective greeting of the royal family. Martin Sheridan, Irish American Athletic Club member and American team captain, is apocryphally believed to have supported Rose by explaining "This flag dips to no earthly king." It is claimed that his statement exemplified both American and Irish defiance of the British monarchy. However, research has shown that this quotation by Sheridan was first reported in 1952, some 24 years after his death.[5][6]

Of course it was used to give "Fox Uniform" to Hitler to.

In cse any wondering about the US Flag
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Flag_Code

It was a jerk move on the bearers part, this isnt the U.S. bowing to another nation, its use showing respect for royalty.

hotsauceman1 wrote:I fail to understand how it is disrespectful, maybe if its on american soil. Besides these arent even monarchs that rule the country with iron fists.

See George Washington and the American Revolution. Thats where he lost his arm to a redcoat commander and proceeded to then beat the 2nd Liverpool Lowlanders silly with it. I'll never forget when he, Daniel Boone, and Davey Crockett stormed the beaches of Dover, pulling hand grenade pins with his teeth and firing a cannon converted from an alligator right into Westminster. America, back when men were men and women got the vapors.

youbedead wrote:

hotsauceman1 wrote:

Jihadin wrote:

The quote was "no earthly king".

The flag of the United States had also not been displayed above the stadium before the opening. The United States' flag bearer, Ralph Rose, refused to dip the flag to Edward VII of the United Kingdom in the royal box. However, the flag was later dipped in the collective greeting of the royal family. Martin Sheridan, Irish American Athletic Club member and American team captain, is apocryphally believed to have supported Rose by explaining "This flag dips to no earthly king." It is claimed that his statement exemplified both American and Irish defiance of the British monarchy. However, research has shown that this quotation by Sheridan was first reported in 1952, some 24 years after his death.[5][6]

Of course it was used to give "Fox Uniform" to Hitler to.

In cse any wondering about the US Flag
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Flag_Code

It was a jerk move on the bearers part, this isnt the U.S. bowing to another nation, its use showing respect for royalty.

Then do it with something other then the US flag, to dip it to a monarch is to show greater disrespect to the flag and all it stand for then any thing else, I'd rather see someone wipe their arse with it then that.

Spoiler:

In my mind there is a fine line between respecting your countries flag and looking like a dick in the eyes of every other nation.

youbedead wrote:

hotsauceman1 wrote:

Jihadin wrote:

The quote was "no earthly king".

The flag of the United States had also not been displayed above the stadium before the opening. The United States' flag bearer, Ralph Rose, refused to dip the flag to Edward VII of the United Kingdom in the royal box. However, the flag was later dipped in the collective greeting of the royal family. Martin Sheridan, Irish American Athletic Club member and American team captain, is apocryphally believed to have supported Rose by explaining "This flag dips to no earthly king." It is claimed that his statement exemplified both American and Irish defiance of the British monarchy. However, research has shown that this quotation by Sheridan was first reported in 1952, some 24 years after his death.[5][6]

Of course it was used to give "Fox Uniform" to Hitler to.

In cse any wondering about the US Flag
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Flag_Code

It was a jerk move on the bearers part, this isnt the U.S. bowing to another nation, its use showing respect for royalty.

Then do it with something other then the US flag, to dip it to a monarch is to show greater disrespect to the flag and all it stand for then any thing else, I'd rather see someone wipe their arse with it then that.

Spoiler:

Ma55ter_fett wrote:

youbedead wrote:

hotsauceman1 wrote:

Jihadin wrote:

The quote was "no earthly king".

The flag of the United States had also not been displayed above the stadium before the opening. The United States' flag bearer, Ralph Rose, refused to dip the flag to Edward VII of the United Kingdom in the royal box. However, the flag was later dipped in the collective greeting of the royal family. Martin Sheridan, Irish American Athletic Club member and American team captain, is apocryphally believed to have supported Rose by explaining "This flag dips to no earthly king." It is claimed that his statement exemplified both American and Irish defiance of the British monarchy. However, research has shown that this quotation by Sheridan was first reported in 1952, some 24 years after his death.[5][6]

Of course it was used to give "Fox Uniform" to Hitler to.

In cse any wondering about the US Flag
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Flag_Code

It was a jerk move on the bearers part, this isnt the U.S. bowing to another nation, its use showing respect for royalty.

Then do it with something other then the US flag, to dip it to a monarch is to show greater disrespect to the flag and all it stand for then any thing else, I'd rather see someone wipe their arse with it then that.

Don't look!

Spoiler:

In my mind there is a fine line between respecting your countries flag and looking like a dick in the eyes of every other nation.

Spoiler:

youbedead wrote:I don't think that he was being a dick, he was making a political statement. The equivalent to burning the flag to show distaste with the US, by refusing to 'bow to an earthly king' you show that no one no matter their title or position is higher than the values that that flag represents. It is far more disrespectful to assume it is mandatory that any nations falg should be dipped to you, as it states that you believe yourself higher then those countries and the values that those countries represent

Jihadin wrote:Supreme Court defended the Freedom of Speech of...misuse of te US Flag. I help defend the constitution giving anyone the right to misuse the flag. If anyone feel the need to misuse the flag then thank a soldier for defending your constitutional right

youbedead wrote:

Ma55ter_fett wrote:

youbedead wrote:

hotsauceman1 wrote:

Jihadin wrote:

The quote was "no earthly king".

The flag of the United States had also not been displayed above the stadium before the opening. The United States' flag bearer, Ralph Rose, refused to dip the flag to Edward VII of the United Kingdom in the royal box. However, the flag was later dipped in the collective greeting of the royal family. Martin Sheridan, Irish American Athletic Club member and American team captain, is apocryphally believed to have supported Rose by explaining "This flag dips to no earthly king." It is claimed that his statement exemplified both American and Irish defiance of the British monarchy. However, research has shown that this quotation by Sheridan was first reported in 1952, some 24 years after his death.[5][6]

Of course it was used to give "Fox Uniform" to Hitler to.

In cse any wondering about the US Flag
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Flag_Code

It was a jerk move on the bearers part, this isnt the U.S. bowing to another nation, its use showing respect for royalty.

Then do it with something other then the US flag, to dip it to a monarch is to show greater disrespect to the flag and all it stand for then any thing else, I'd rather see someone wipe their arse with it then that.

Don't look!

Spoiler:

In my mind there is a fine line between respecting your countries flag and looking like a dick in the eyes of every other nation.

Spoiler:

I don't think that he was being a dick, he was making a political statement. The equivalent to burning the flag to show distaste with the US, by refusing to 'bow to an earthly king' you show that no one no matter their title or position is higher than the values that that flag represents. It is far more disrespectful to assume it is mandatory that any nations falg should be dipped to you, as it states that you believe yourself higher then those countries and the values that those countries represent

don't believe that any of the supreme court members are veterans, or that any veterans have actively defended my freedoms during my lifetime. If anything american foreign policy aggression has endangered my freedoms while faking "protecting me" more than anything else I can really think of.

Ma55ter_fett wrote:

In my mind there is a fine line between respecting your countries flag and looking like a dick in the eyes of every other nation.