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So what are the Vanilla Marine assault options in 6th and their delivery mechanisms?

TH/SS Terminators: should still be viable, but their ability to infiltrate/outflank and assault after running with Shrike is gone. Is a Land Raider the best delivery system now? How survivable is a Land Raider in this edition and how successful will it be as a delivery mechanism given the rules changes? They're still very good in assault, but their delivery mechanism seems lacking in this edition and that was already their weak point.

Is a kitted out Captain with Bike Squad viable now? T5, FNP, very fast to get into assault, the new bike assault rules, etc. Can they be the unit to rely on now for assault? They're very points heavy, but the rules in this edition makes them very survivable and you can make them very killy. The question is are they worth the points?

What about Vanguard Veterans? Are they viable now with the rules changes to them? These I really have no clue how to rate.

I'm still undecided on where to go, but I know I want at least one counter-assault unit in my army. Just which one?

The assault unit you want depends on the list you are running. I, for example, use tactical terminators with a cyclone missile launcher for my gunline counter-assault.

But in general, if you want to kill something in assault, you can't go wrong with assault terminators.

Vanguards still aren't usable since on the turn they deep strike, they count as having used their jump packs. They're still overcosted for what they do too.

Like Armadeus said, it depends on your list. You can't just drop in a LR filled with TH/SS Termies into a single list and expect it to function properly.

Drop pods work well for dreads, landraiders are still best for terminators unless you have enough teleport homers and/or locator beacons on the field, vanguard work, assault marines in drop pod or on the field work, it's all about the list.

This all comes down to which Vanilla list you are running (Straight Ultra successors vs HQ's that replace combat tactics), but I'm feeling like assault Terminators got a decent boost in this edition because of the new assault rules.

With the new charge rules you could just take a squad of 10 Assault Terminators and equip most of them with TH/SS then just run them on foot. Sure it's 400 points, but still cheaper than 5 in a LR and I would argue that they're pretty survivable still against most incoming fire.

Hard to say which loadout to give the sgt with the challenge rules, the SS gives him a better chance to save against AP2, but most AP2 is I1 now anyways so dual LC's might be a better option.

Being able to charge 2D6 now means you can probably get stuck in to combat by T2 against anyone that doesn't build a wall against their table edge, and C:SM armies have things that can mess with that anyways.

Well here's how my current list looks. It's fairly shooty, and except for the home base watching units it's very mobile. I'm still not used to flyers so I'm trying out massed TL fire. I hope it works.

HQ:
Librarian (100)
-Null Zone, Gate of Infinity

Elites:
Terminator Assault Squad (400)
-7x TH/SS, 3x TL LC
Dreadnought (125)
-2x TL Autocannon
Dreadnought (125)
-2x TL Autocannon

Troops:
Tactical Squad (230)
-10x men, Flamer, combi-Flamer, LC
-Razorback, TL HB
Tactical Squad (225)
-10x men, melta, combi-melta, ML
-Razorback, TL HB
Tactical Squad (225)
-10x men, melta, combi-melta, ML
-Razorback, TL HB

Heavy Support:
TFC (100)
TFC (100)
Predator (120)
-Lascannon Sponsons

I think you have it broadly right.
I would only add that vanilla marines can do without assault and can just bring allies if they happen to be worried or for how the army wants to play.

MFletch wrote:I think you have it broadly right.
I would only add that vanilla marines can do without assault and can just bring allies if they happen to be worried or for how the army wants to play.

This is a good idea, if you don't mind allies. One example springs to mind:
Blood Angels - Librarian, Tactical Squad, Vanguard Squad
The Librarian can be used however you like, he's just there as a necessary HQ choice but can also give access to Shield which is always handy. The Tac squad can replace one of your existing ones so you're not losing out on their points. The Vanguard Squad are MUCH more viable than the vanilla variety thanks to Descent of Angels - just be bold. Drop them about 4-5" from your intended target, with only 1D6" scatter you're very unlikely to mishap onto them and you can use the circular Deep Strike deployment to get a little closer for the charge. You now have a fairly reliable immediate counter-attack unit, plus that Librarian, for around 300 points outlay.

You could do worse than Dark Angels too - Deathwing can give you the lovely TH/SS combo with firepower all wrapped up in one squad, and as Troops if you take Belial too. And since you have to take a HQ anyway, why not?

That's so expensive though, especially when Vanilla Marines already have 40 point TH/SS terminators available to them. I don't think it's worth the point cost. After all, I'm NOT trying to make an assault army. Just a single counter-assault force to protect my own guys from assault or threaten my enemies into more advantageous (for me) positions, or to draw fire from my firing platforms like the TFC. Besides, Belial and Deathwing don't really solve the big issue of "how do I get these into CC?" They only give you CML, which is good, but not enough to justify the points cost.

Ahhh, now you've mentioned you're looking for counter-assault...! Then yes - stick with the TH/SS Termies. In which respect, I'd argue that they don't even need a delivery system, but a Land Raider would be good if you're looking to protect most of your force with them. Granted that's another 250 points, but it can put out enough decent firepower of its own.

It's a moot point now, but the method of getting Deathwing into assault would of course be Deep Strike. It's free! And with Deathwing Assault, a little earlier than standard too. But, too unreliable to use for counter-attack purposes.

I play a deathwing army. Deathwing assault does not get termies into assault. Getting termies into assault depends on the enemy being kind.
The best bet is to teleport up/walk and then create a bubble where the enemy fears to tread whilst shooting missiles at them. This is probably more than enough for marines.

Termies are your most reliable option, IMO. I ran a biker CC command squad for a bit and was very hit or miss for a unit sooooo very expensive.