Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

Hey all,

More of a lore question for those more steeped in the 40k universe than I; Why are Eldar and Dark Eldar considered "Battle Brothers"(the highest level of trust) when they ally in 6th edition? More importantly, if Eldar and Dark Eldar are battle brothers, why are, say, Space Wolves and Sisters of Battle NOT?!?

Cheers!

Not really a rules questiOn. Head over to 40k general and look at one of the hundred allies threads.

I think lots of us would agree that the allies list could use some revision... I think the thought process is that they might band together against some sort of powerful chaos force, since both sides are probably leary about creating a chaos diety.

The Craftworlders and Dark Eldar are like bickering cousins.
So, "family - even if they are dicks".

To the Eldar (all of them - craftworlders, DE, Exodites and Harlequins), ALL Eldar are family, and if one of them is in trouble - they will come to their assistance (for their own reasons).

DE allied with Iyanden in one major fluff battle because it "amused them to see their "cousins" playing with necromancy." (it is considered bad form to rouse the dead from their slumbers, however necessary it might be).

It's not at all uncommon for Corsair groups to consist of Eldar from both sides of the fence.

Interesting. I assumed since the DE Deity consumes CWE Souls and such, they might be a little on edge around eachother. I guess if you take away their Deities, they just have a difference in personal philosophy(as large as it may seem!).

Thanks!

Dark Eldar hardly worship She who thirsts...I would not call her a deity in the least. She will consume the souls of Dark Eldar all the same.

There is one major rule in the dark city, using psychic powers is forbidden. Accessing the warp invites Slaanesh, and would see most if not all of the dark eldar killed.

Craftworld Eldar cheat death by not actually dying, dark eldar cheat death by killing others in their stead.

They are still Eldar. They just have opposing viewpoints as how to avoid Slannesh.

An Eldar is still going to trust a Dark Eldar more then any other race.

Grey Templar wrote:They are still Eldar. They just have opposing viewpoints as how to avoid Slannesh.

An Eldar is still going to trust a Dark Eldar more then any other race.

Except Tau, apparently.

There's this pretty common misconception that Eldar and Dark Eldar universally hate each other.

I'm inclined to believe they're the high elves and dark elves of the universe, and in almost every other fiction featuring this dynamic, both races are mortal enemies.

In 40k, not so true. People have already mentioned that the Eldar view each other as family, family they don't get along with, but family nonetheless. I may not like listening to the political bickering at thanksgiving, but if my cousin's house is being invaded by self-righteous asshats in overcompensation armor, you can bet your head that I'm going to grab my pointy poison rifle and hop onto my space elf laser gun hover boat to help them out.

Incubi and Exarchs still don't get along well though. Ever since Incubi stole Exarch's girlfriend in high school, they just haven't been on speaking terms.

Dr. Serling wrote:Dark Eldar hardly worship She who thirsts...I would not call her a deity in the least. She will consume the souls of Dark Eldar all the same.

There is one major rule in the dark city, using psychic powers is forbidden. Accessing the warp invites Slaanesh, and would see most if not all of the dark eldar killed.

Craftworld Eldar cheat death by not actually dying, dark eldar cheat death by killing others in their stead.

Ahhhh, so that's why there are no DE psychers. Was wondering. Thought it was all because of the "atrophy" of being disconnected so long and focusing on physical pursuits. Makes sense.

Thanks for clarifying all!

As answered previously, DE and Eldar are Battle Brothers cause they are known to come to each other's aide from time to time. Also, keeping in mind that the rulebook is rather Imperium-centric, for soldiers of the Imperium, all Eldar are one and the same, since their intolerance of xenos does not allow them to notice the difference. Which is why Eldar are always described as "perfidious and capricious", because while a Craftworlder may help an Imperial colony, a Dark Eldar raiding force may raze that same colony to the ground. To the Imperium, who think they're all Eldar, it doesnt make sense to them and thus they think the Eldar are all wily and capricious as heck.

As for Space Marines and Sisters of Battle not being Battle Brothers? It's cause the Sisters of Battle are Sisters. Nah, I kid lol. I think it more has to do with the great gulf in belief between the Ecclesiarchy (whom worship and deify the Emperor) and the individual Space Marine cults (whose beliefs and reverence for the Emperor differs from Chapter to Chapter). Naturally, anyone not following the view of the Imperial Creed are considered heretics, so they view Space Marines with some level of suspicion.

battle brothers for eldar and DE doesn't make sense, but it is what it is.

the imperium is full of battle brothers, so I guess they figured more grey boxes on the grid were not necessary.

Who would you trust more, The guy you know is going to ram a Huskblade down your throat when he thinks your guard is down, or the guy that might fill you with bolter rounds after you are no longer needed?

Eldar and Dark Eldar aren't great friends. However, I think what it's trying to say is that when they do work together, the cast aside their differences until the battle is over as they are mature enough to know this is more important than whose fault She Who Thirsts is.

Like said they are not great friends but... let's face it, they're far better than other, less advanced races. Besides Dark Eldars like Eldars were right before the fall and craftworld Eldars are trying to be what they once wear long before corruption that lead into birth of Slaanesh. So basically Eldars are not that different. Craft worlds eldars try to be what they were during height of the Eldar age, Dark Eldars continue the hedonistic and sadistic life that lead the Fall and exocordites try to live without too much technology avoid corruption and live like ancient ancestors of Eldars... All tstill are near immortal tricky pointy ears thta mon-keighhs never un derstand.

and that Dark City rule of no psychers als include never taking psychers alive as captives or slaves. Baron Sathonyx captured Eldar Farseer and brought Farseer in Dark City, which was even closer call to city's destruction than Imperial Raid. Which lead city wide manhunt and Sathonyx becoming a outcast and slowly raising into lord of the Hellions.

Lokas wrote:There's this pretty common misconception that Eldar and Dark Eldar universally hate each other.

I'm inclined to believe they're the high elves and dark elves of the universe, and in almost every other fiction featuring this dynamic, both races are mortal enemies.

In 40k, not so true. People have already mentioned that the Eldar view each other as family, family they don't get along with, but family nonetheless. I may not like listening to the political bickering at thanksgiving, but if my cousin's house is being invaded by self-righteous asshats in overcompensation armor, you can bet your head that I'm going to grab my pointy poison rifle and hop onto my space elf laser gun hover boat to help them out.

Incubi and Exarchs still don't get along well though. Ever since Incubi stole Exarch's girlfriend in high school, they just haven't been on speaking terms.

I think this pretty much sums it up. I didn't get it at first, but I think it talks about it in the 6th Edition rulebook fluff. Eldar are going for the preservation of all Eldar, Dark Eldar included. Perhaps it's a little like these two:

I look at it rather like the ethnic mismatch sitcoms that became popular in the late 80's; it's probably not the best idea, but if you put a laugh track with it, it's no worse than the rest of what's on television.

I like it, because as it's been said, it's a cool way to meld both Eldar and Dark Eldar codex options to field a Corsair force.

ZakFaire wrote:Interesting. I assumed since the DE Deity consumes CWE Souls and such, they might be a little on edge around eachother. I guess if you take away their Deities, they just have a difference in personal philosophy(as large as it may seem!).

Thanks!

DE worship the same deity that the craftworlders do. They do not worship slannesh.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

heckler wrote:battle brothers for eldar and DE doesn't make sense, but it is what it is.

the imperium is full of battle brothers, so I guess they figured more grey boxes on the grid were not necessary.

it makes perfect sense if you read the current codexes. Both sets of eldar are arragonat bunches who believe that eldar are the rightful rulers of the galaxy. They think each other are strange but certainly less strange than all the other non eldar out there. If they are going to ally with anyone it is going to be with each other.

Besides the fact that they would work together, they have the worst allies chart in the game besides Tyranids. So that could definitely be a reason they're BB and not of convenience.

ZakFaire wrote:

Dr. Serling wrote:Dark Eldar hardly worship She who thirsts...I would not call her a deity in the least. She will consume the souls of Dark Eldar all the same.

There is one major rule in the dark city, using psychic powers is forbidden. Accessing the warp invites Slaanesh, and would see most if not all of the dark eldar killed.

Craftworld Eldar cheat death by not actually dying, dark eldar cheat death by killing others in their stead.

Ahhhh, so that's why there are no DE psychers. Was wondering. Thought it was all because of the "atrophy" of being disconnected so long and focusing on physical pursuits. Makes sense.

Thanks for clarifying all!

There are Dark Eldar warlocks, they just tend to lead short lives because of the denizens of the Warp or assasins sent by the Tyrant Asdrubael Vect. According to "Path of the Renegade" Dark Eldar are taught how to suppress their natural psychic talents.

Exergy wrote:

ZakFaire wrote:Interesting. I assumed since the DE Deity consumes CWE Souls and such, they might be a little on edge around eachother. I guess if you take away their Deities, they just have a difference in personal philosophy(as large as it may seem!).

Thanks!

DE worship the same deity that the craftworlders do. They do not worship slannesh.

According to the newest fluff, they do not worship Eldar deities. Instead, there are some quasi-deity characters called "the Dark Muses", who were Dark Eldar that were very good at certain aspects of killing others.

Drunkspleen wrote:It's not at all uncommon for Corsair groups to consist of Eldar from both sides of the fence.

This. Don't forget that the Craftworld Eldar are not the only force depicted by the rules in Codex: Eldar - you also have Corsairs, Exodites, pirates, and renegades, all of whom ally with the Dark Eldar freely yet still use Codex: Eldar for their rules.