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My flgs runs with Death from the Skies. Quite a few players are running air power.
So my question is are there any anti-air options for Necrons? Even the fluff anti-air unit the Obolisk does not have sky fire and hopping for your opponent to roll a one is not a viable strategy.

The FW Artillery with the S9 Gauss weapon. They can take anything once you upgrade to IWND and will fire enough shots to cause distress. I'm surprised you're having lots of Planes though. They hardly show up at my store at the moment.

Entire codex lacks skyfire, now.
Even our own planes.
If you don't have access to Sentry Pylons the best you can do is tons of Warriors and hope you can roll lots of sixes twice in a row.
>:[

Pyrothem wrote:
My flgs runs with Death from the Skies. Quite a few players are running air power.
So my question is are there any anti-air options for Necrons? Even the fluff anti-air unit the Obolisk does not have sky fire and hopping for your opponent to roll a one is not a viable strategy.

Our best anti-air option is to ignore them, flyers can't do enough damage to us to warrant spending points to counter them, and outside of a few off cases they can't claim objectives. If they are spending enough points to get formations and what not, you'll be 400 or 500 points up in the ground fight.

I am going to echo what has been already been said about flyers. Just ignore them.

If you actually start losing to flyers and are looking into AA, use Tomb Blades. Lots of em. They can get around the jink save.

Against air targets, since tomb blades have twin-linked and ignore cover, they are as effective as the equivalent amount of immortals shooting at a skimmer vehicle, which isn't awesome but they will plink away at hull points and give you the ability to focus all your fire on any particularly troublesome flyers and delete them.

Plus, tomb blades have the maneuverability to keep in the blind side of zooming flyers and deny them chances at shooting back. And tomb blades can go about playing the mission while the flyers in the air are lagging behind on points.

And tomb blades are by no means dedicated anti-air so you aren't weakening your list at all by running lots of them. They are the true swiss army knife in the codex.

I'm going to back track a page or 2 and talk about my experience with the sentry star. Warning wall of text.

I've run 6 variants of the sentrystar at 6 different tournaments in my area, ranging from 1 day/3 game events to 2 day/6 games, all using the ITC faq, and ignoring the draft faq(when it came out).

My first run was after I was flipping through a friends copy of imperial armour, and realized the pylons could put out a ton of hurt if they could be kept alive. With this in mind, I scrolled through the internets for ideas.
My first list, and the most effective; was a CAD and a royal court
3 Pylons with the beam
Overlord, nemesor Zahndrek(warlord for traits), Orikan, Szeras, Obyron
2 units of 6 immortals
and 3 units of 4 wraiths(whip coils).

Up to this point no one in my meta had even seen these pylons, nevermind knew how they worked. (First turn always took forever because of explanations)
I tabled an eldar scat bike spam list on my first of 3 games.
Forced a concede against drop pod wulfen(Bottom of turn 1 he drop pods around me, top of turn 2 I teleport away and using Zahndrek for relentless, start drawing lines through his now footslogging wolves. When he got close again, I used my second teleport to go back and repeat)
Lost by a point to a demi company. This loss should have been a win but I made a bad tactical call turn 5 and went for killing things instead of sitting on an objective, I handed the win over, and went from 1st to 6th or something similar.

After various other tournaments I've dropped the wraiths, and replaced them with 2 retribution phalanxes, I've stripped down the Royal court and replaced with a conclave(mostly because I enjoy playing it.)
I've even included 2 10 man units of Praetorians to see how they would do.

The first list I tried with the wraiths was by far the most effective. 12 Wraiths allowed me to tie up units and provide a bubble around the sentry star leaving me to kill at my leisure, they are durable enough not to crumble but will usually die after I've handled everything else in my opponents list, leaving me to mop up whatever is left.

Unfortunately, in my meta, the sentry star is no longer viable. When I started playing it, I could easily tank wounds with the characters and go from there. But lately in a 20 person tournament, there will be at least 6 people playing Eldar with enough ranged D that my last game against 1 I was tabled turn 2. And I would always have to play against at least 1 of these lists.
Demi Company also tends to run a train on this list if played by an aggressive player. There is simply too many things to kill, and you tend to lose the objective game.
Having a single unit that costs as much as a sentry star does no longer works around here.

It was fun while it lasted though

^
... why Szeras?

 skoffs wrote:
^
... why Szeras?

Exactly my question. That's a spot that could be for a Destroyer Lord instead!

Thanks for the advice. I will just take the ghost ark out and fill the points with Tomb Blades. The damn things get dropped melta popped or blast weapons take out the warriors inside on turn 1.5 or 2 every damn game.

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:

 skoffs wrote:
^
... why Szeras?

Exactly my question. That's a spot that could be for a Destroyer Lord instead!

Also, since the Overlord has the veil, the list is missing a solar staff which is critical to fighting alpha strike lists or gunline lists.

And of course a chronometron, also missing, would have helped against the ranged D problem.

farshot9 wrote:
I'm going to back track a page or 2 and talk about my experience with the sentry star. Warning wall of text.

I've run 6 variants of the sentrystar at 6 different tournaments in my area, ranging from 1 day/3 game events to 2 day/6 games, all using the ITC faq, and ignoring the draft faq(when it came out).

My first run was after I was flipping through a friends copy of imperial armour, and realized the pylons could put out a ton of hurt if they could be kept alive. With this in mind, I scrolled through the internets for ideas.
My first list, and the most effective; was a CAD and a royal court
3 Pylons with the beam
Overlord, nemesor Zahndrek(warlord for traits), Orikan, Szeras, Obyron
2 units of 6 immortals
and 3 units of 4 wraiths(whip coils).

Up to this point no one in my meta had even seen these pylons, nevermind knew how they worked. (First turn always took forever because of explanations)
I tabled an eldar scat bike spam list on my first of 3 games.
Forced a concede against drop pod wulfen(Bottom of turn 1 he drop pods around me, top of turn 2 I teleport away and using Zahndrek for relentless, start drawing lines through his now footslogging wolves. When he got close again, I used my second teleport to go back and repeat)
Lost by a point to a demi company. This loss should have been a win but I made a bad tactical call turn 5 and went for killing things instead of sitting on an objective, I handed the win over, and went from 1st to 6th or something similar.

After various other tournaments I've dropped the wraiths, and replaced them with 2 retribution phalanxes, I've stripped down the Royal court and replaced with a conclave(mostly because I enjoy playing it.)
I've even included 2 10 man units of Praetorians to see how they would do.

The first list I tried with the wraiths was by far the most effective. 12 Wraiths allowed me to tie up units and provide a bubble around the sentry star leaving me to kill at my leisure, they are durable enough not to crumble but will usually die after I've handled everything else in my opponents list, leaving me to mop up whatever is left.

Unfortunately, in my meta, the sentry star is no longer viable. When I started playing it, I could easily tank wounds with the characters and go from there. But lately in a 20 person tournament, there will be at least 6 people playing Eldar with enough ranged D that my last game against 1 I was tabled turn 2. And I would always have to play against at least 1 of these lists.
Demi Company also tends to run a train on this list if played by an aggressive player. There is simply too many things to kill, and you tend to lose the objective game.
Having a single unit that costs as much as a sentry star does no longer works around here.

It was fun while it lasted though

Thanks for that, man! I've actually been playing 40k long enough that i'm just always hungry for something that behaves VERY differently. As such, even with the major competitive nerfs, I decided to go for it, and try a Pylonstar. At the absolute worst I might take one or two as back-field pieces in friendlier games without the Deathstar element. I just had a Forgeworld order ready to go, holidays and birthday coming up, and a desire to try something weird. :-p

Farshot9,

I wonder how useful you found running Zandrekh over Anrakyr? I am testing out lists with one or the other and both.

The big downside of not having Anrakyr is losing the relentless on turn one and the possibility of a turn one alpha strike, which is a big deal in and of itself but is especially a big deal when going against psychic deathstars.

That loss would need to be offset by the gain Zandrekh provides the list, especially in the ability to steal USR (Counter Attack, Furious Charge, Stealth, Hit & Run, Tank Hunter, and Split Fire). Hit & Run and Split Fire are especially useful to the pylon star and Tank Hunter can be very useful in certain matchups. Hit & Run basically reads roll a die. If you roll a 1 or a 2 you get to leave combat without blowing one of your teleports. On average it gives you one more 'teleport'.

Did you find that Zandrekh was boosting the pylon star with juicy USRs a lot in your match-ups?

No, but seriously, I want to know:
What was Szeras bringing that contributed to the Sentry-Star?

Sorry for the delay, I was out all day.

Szeras didn't actually last very long, he was one of the first changes I made to this list, I should have clarified. The line of thinking I had on including him though was for guaranteed 4+++ reanimate against instant death if and when I decided to split the characters from the pylons. As well as providing 4+++ reanimate to the squads of immortals used to bubble wrap against turn 1 charges.
This did turn out to be pretty pointless so he got axed on the first rewrite.

Having Zahndrek as opposed to Anrakyr for relentless does cost you the first turn, but I found that granting the characters all of the other special rules helps if you do get charged, but more importantly, his choice of warlord trait gives you a lot more flexability than anrakyr. Especially for maelstrom style games


Automatically Appended Next Post:
@col_impact.
Having hit and run never actually came up in any of my games. But it was one of the reasons for including him.

Not bringing a solar staff was actually deliberate. I wanted my opponents to be afraid of the star and focus fire it as much as possible so I could tank wounds with the characters, leaving the rest of my army untouched. I was always concerned that running a single unit that expensive would leave me without enough of an army to play objectives after 2 turns, if what little else I had was drawing fire.

This plan worked surprisingly well until the meta started including so much ranged D the immature said the dick jokes were getting old.

As for the 5++, I can't pass 5 up saves. It just doesn't happen. 3 up and 4 up I can't fail, I'm infamous for it around here. But I fail 5++ so dependably that I never bothered to include it.

The rest of the army SHOULD be touched though. Wraiths are meant to be distractions.

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
Wraiths are meant to be distractions.

I wish more Necron players understood this.
(... just so long as our opponents don't catch on)

I'm actually thinking of running the Sentrystar in a CAD (with the bare minimum on HQs, so Orikan, Anrakyr, and a D-Lord with the Veil), along with a Canoptek Harvest, and Riptide Wing.

In that scenario, i'd absolutely love my opponent to be firing at the Wraiths as dying for me is their sole purpose. :-p

NewTruthNeomaxim wrote:
I'm actually thinking of running the Sentrystar in a CAD (with the bare minimum on HQs, so Orikan, Anrakyr, and a D-Lord with the Veil)

Did you forget to include Obyron in that list?
(if CAD HQ = D.Lord, that means you still need to fill the Lord slot in the Royal Court's requirement)

[Everyone else is talking about it so I thought I'd give it a shot]:
Question, though-
Is it worth giving the Pylons Sep.Scarabs?

I actually meant Obyron instead of Orikan. :-) I'm usually not a Necron player.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
As to your question about Scarabs... I would say no. Its a hefty point sink, and if the Pylons are already taking wounds, they're probably not living long enough to get much out of some IWND rolls.

NewTruthNeomaxim wrote:
I actually meant Obyron instead of Orikan. :-) I'm usually not a Necron player.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
As to your question about Scarabs... I would say no. Its a hefty point sink, and if the Pylons are already taking wounds, they're probably not living long enough to get much out of some IWND rolls.

I disagree. When you're deciding to throw the wounds on them, it gives them a chance to start regenerating. Same reason I'd use a Phylactery on all the HQ'S I can.

NewTruthNeomaxim wrote:
I actually meant Obyron instead of Orikan. :-) I'm usually not a Necron player.

Well, just FYI, if you're taking a Royal Court in a CAD you need a total of four HQs minimum:
1 of any kind to fulfill the CAD requirement.
Then for the Royal Court requirements you'll need,
1x Overlord
1-3x Lord
1-3x Cryptek

So a setup of
- Destroyer Lord (CAD)
- Anrakyr (RC Overlord)
- Obyron (RC Lord)
- Orikan (RC Cryptek)
works out perfectly fine and has the benefit of being somewhat effective (some would argue Zahndrekh would be better to take instead of Anrakyr, but if you want the Alpha Strike you'd need Anrakyr).

Don't forget an extra regular Lord carrying the Solar Staff.

I was just talking about minimum requirements as far as formation and detachment goes, as his setup he had posted would have been illegal otherwise.
...
Though, yes, highly suggested that you take the Sun Staff.

Then i'd probably run a cheaper Lord w/Staff in the stead of Orikan, who I suppose only tends to earn his points in the later stages of the game when he can hulk-out?

NewTruthNeomaxim wrote:
Then i'd probably run a cheaper Lord w/Staff in the stead of Orikan, who I suppose only tends to earn his points in the later stages of the game when he can hulk-out?

Orikan makes your characters immune to small arms fire. Zahndrekh and any character with the Nightmare Shroud is 2+ rerolling against anything that's not AP2 which is basically invincible, and even in ITC where that rerolls into a 4+ you're going 2+ -> 4+ -> 4+ (maybe reroll if you brought a rez orb). That's huge, it doubles your survivability. And even 3+ gets a solid boost out of it.

However - it is possible to run without him. If you have a Solar Staff and a couple Orbs, you're pretty darn tough coming out of the Alpha Strike. It lets you shuffle points a little bit (a base Cryptek with Solar is only 80), but in the long run he's a very solid character to add to any Star. Remember he does nothing to help the survivability of the Pylons themselves, as they don't have Reanimation, and if you split the characters apart after deep striking, his effectiveness is somewhat mitigated.

That makes a ton of sense, but at least in our meta i've put a lot of thought into weighting my threats in such a way where anything less than a top-tier opponent feels confused by where they should be putting their shots.

Its a calculated risk, but I feel like trying to run this alongside Riptide Wing benefits from not making the Sentry-star feel like the one and only thing worthy of eradication.

Edit: A small added perk is running it at majority toughness 7, what with all those T values spread all over the place, and only the Pylons having three models with it. I mean, at that point even Oberyn is tanking at T7 with a 2+, and LOS if the volume of shots taken gets sketchy for his meager wounds.

The min load-out for the Sentry Star is really

Anrakyr or Zandrekh for 12" relentless bubble.
Obyron
Lord or Cryptek with Veil


The optional but very potent add-ons are:
Cryptek with solar staff and chronometron
Upgrading the Lord to a Destroyer Lord

The Destroyer Lord doesn't do much for the Sentry Star per se except making Anrakyr's tachyon arrow auto-hit (as opposed to hit on 2+) and making the Star auto-wound (as opposed to wound on 2+). He is mostly included to be able to strategically break off from the Sentry Star (eg counter-assault a unit that is threatening an assault next turn or breaking off and wreaking havoc on units nearby that his warscythe and T6 can handle easily). Also his T6 makes it easier to keep the entire Sentry Star majority toughness 7 which benefits the unit if its assaulted.

As your Sentry Star grows in size you are going to get more mileage out of these inclusions:
Orikan
Res Orbs
a Nightmare Shroud on an Overlord or the Destroyer Lord

col_impact wrote:
The min load-out for the Sentry Star is really

Anrakyr or Zandrekh for 12" relentless bubble.
Obyron
Lord or Cryptek with Veil


The optional but very potent add-ons are:
Cryptek with solar staff and chronometron
Upgrading the Lord to a Destroyer Lord

This gets tricky, in that Anrakyr/Zahndrekh + Obyron + Cryptek = Royal Court, but a Destroyer Lord can never be part of a Royal Court.
(easily rectified, however, as to get Pylons in the first place you have to be using a CAD, so he can just be the designated HQ from that. The above is merely a clarification for new players who might not realize that they can't simply replace the Lord in the RC with a Destroyer Lord.)

I ended up going with 9 regular destroyers, 2 heavies and a lord to start. I figured I can always get another 3 heavies if I really want em later. Thanks for the feedback!

Looks like you can still use the Eternity Gate of a Monolith on the turn it arrives by Deep Strike as long as it is in the Living Tomb formation.

Just mentioning it because I recall people in this thread (myself included) lamenting the loss of the ability of the Monolith to Deep Strike in and immediately use the Eternity Gate on the turn it arrives.