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As much as I love Khador, they seem like an odd choice for the army to go up against Menoth for the Warmachine 2 player boxed set. I would have thought Cygnar would have been a better choice to go up against Menoth. To me Cygnar seems more of the poster child for Warmachine and Menoth a more balanced pairing against them. Cygnar vs. Khador would have probably worked too.

For the Hordes 2 player boxed set, the pairing also doesn't seem right to me. I would have thought that Everblight should be put up against Trollbloods. Or Skorne vs. Everblight. Or Skorne vs. Circle. I don't think Circle vs. Everblight gives you a sense of what's available playstyle wise.

Then again I'm not that experienced with MKII... mechanics or fluff...

What do you think influenced the pairings that they have? At first I thought they were using armies that aren't as popular; that maybe putting them in the starter would help market them better.... but we have like 3 or 4 Menoth players where I'm at plus 4 hours north, where I game sometimes, there's 2 or 3 Menoth players there. Khador also seems to have a good following too from what I've experienced. These players played their armies prior to the 2 player starter. For Hordes it might make a little more sense. I normally see either Skorne or Trollbloods being played alot. Then again maybe its just the areas that I frequent that are influencing my opinion.

I think giving a good gameplay matchup was the priority. For the Warmachine box, Kreoss & Sorscha are pretty good mirrors, who have a simple feat, and some depth in the movement tricks or anti-magic tricks they can do. I think the reason Cygnar didn't feature was that they don't have heavy infantry, and for Cryx, the debuff game can maybe be frustrating for rookie players. The Hordes one is a bit more puzzling. Lylith makes sense as the Legion warlock, since she's fairly simple to use with a straightforward feat, but the Circle force is going to be harder to figure out for rookies, and also based around hit & run. We'll see how it works out.

When you factor in the Warcasters and the actual models involved, the Warmachine starter does seem to make sense. I had never thought of that. I was generalizing the factions.

I agree about the Circle possibly being a little tricky to play. I've played them since Mk I and have yet to be successful with them. Then again my lists kind of suck.

Isn't Menoth pushing north into Khador land right now fluffwise? that might have something to do with it, Cygnar isnt doing anything except getting beat up on every line and Cryx are difficult to learn

I'm way behind on my fluff. I didn't realize Menoth were making their way into Khador areas. I've got a lot to catch up on. Cryx are tricky. They're who I'm going to try next.

The 2 player starters seem to be comprised of a normal or altered battlegroup with no arc nodes, and a plastic, 5 man, medium based, multiwound unit. this virtually set the warmachine factions in stone. The hordes box could've been legion vs. any other faction and I'm not really sure why circle got the push. If I were to guess, the tooling and design for skinwalkers was made for plastic, but they came out in a time PP was having bad trouble with their plastic production.

Plastic infantry.

 malfred wrote:
Plastic infantry.

Plastic Medium Based Infantry. Khador and Menoth have it, Cygnar, Cryx and Retribution don't.

 AduroT wrote:

 malfred wrote:
Plastic infantry.

Plastic Medium Based Infantry. Khador and Menoth have it, Cygnar, Cryx and Retribution don't.

Cygnar doesn't have any medium-based infantry, do they? Plastic-wise, they're getting plastic stormblade/stormguard troops later this year from what I had seen on another thread

Cygnar has no in-faction medium infantry at all. They can get it from Mercs but that's it.

Retribution likewise has the same limitation and I don't think they have access through Mercs but I may be wrong there.

Fluff wise, Circle seems to be doing the most of the Hordes factions to contain and control Legion and it's doings.

Circle are tricky to use but to be fair 5 PLASTIC skinwalkers. Nuff said

vedreag wrote:
...and Cryx are difficult to learn

Really? for battleboxes I always thought cryx was dead simple. put crippling grasp on the opponents big heavy and then pummel the caster with everything else.

Don't get me wrong, I love my Cryx and maybe it is just because they work with my personal playstyle really well, but I think they are one of the easier forces to use. I have had a much harder time getting results from my Cygnar.

 AduroT wrote:

 malfred wrote:
Plastic infantry.

Plastic Medium Based Infantry. Khador and Menoth have it, Cygnar, Cryx and Retribution don't.

Actually, just to make a point, Cryx does. Two separate units in-fact.

http://battlecollege.wikispaces.com/mkiiBloodgorgers
http://battlecollege.wikispaces.com/mkiiBlackOgrun

Point stands about Cygnar and Ret though.

Isnt Keross from Khador lands ? or am i confused with Cygnar.. thought it was Khador though.


Also Lylith nearly killed Balduor or however its spelled in the fuff.

http://privateerpressforums.com/showthread.php?46788-Hordes-vs-Hordes-Visual-thread

pics of it

 Teufelhunde wrote:

 AduroT wrote:

 malfred wrote:
Plastic infantry.

Plastic Medium Based Infantry. Khador and Menoth have it, Cygnar, Cryx and Retribution don't.

Actually, just to make a point, Cryx does. Two separate units in-fact.

http://battlecollege.wikispaces.com/mkiiBloodgorgers
http://battlecollege.wikispaces.com/mkiiBlackOgrun

Point stands about Cygnar and Ret though.

Yeah, thought about the Black Ogrun later though, but the Bloodgorgers are the wrong type. I should have qualified my statement with medium based multi-wound infantry. The 3/5 units. Eitherway neither of those two units are plastic.

I almost got the two-player army deal they had at GenCon, but it didn't have Cygnar in it (I didn't really care what the other army would be) so I didn't buy it. I keep thinking about starting up but they keep making me stop. I blame PP, of course, for my clay feet.