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I really hope that GW would just finally make a codex for the three main Ordos of the Inquisition. What does the populace say?

They already have...Codex: Daemon Hunters (which was classy and has since been replaced by the horrific Codex: Grey Knights) and Codex: Witch Hunters. The only one left unreleased is Codex: Alien Hunters.

NO I KNOW THIS, but I mean a combined codex!

There's a lot of debate about the best way to implement the forces of the Inquisition.

At the moment, the Grey Knight codex covers all three main Ordos, but it doesn't cover them well. It covers the Ordo Malleus pretty well, and with the new Allies rule you can include Inquisitors and their warbands in any Imperial army. And you have access to Inquisitors from the Ordo Hereticus and the Ordo Xenos.

You can always take an Inquisitor in a SM army, and model the SM as Deathwatch. But it is a work-around. What you really want is a unit or two of Deathwatch marines, with preferred enemy: xenos, and access to funky wargear ala Sternguard.

HUH

 Hadarac wrote:
HUH

What I'm saying is that you can represent all three Ordos of the Inquisition on the tabletop using the Grey Knights codex and the allies rules.

A seperate codex just for the Inquisition would probably be quite empty, or quite massive. You could easily make the Deathwatch a full marine codex, as you (obviously) can with the Grey Knights, and there'd be Inquisitorial Stormtrooper forces as well. You could either include each of those forces in an Inquisition codex, or you could give each of them a separate codex. If you cram them into a single codex, it'd be too big and clunky. If you made them two separate codexes, well, that entirely defeats the purpose of trying to create a single Inquisition codex in the first place.

Personally, I think a Deathwatch codex would be cool. They certainly deserve their own codex more than Dark Angels do.

You could write one. I'm thinking about putting together a team to write unofficial codexes that haven't been written by GW.

 Kaldor wrote:


Personally, I think a Deathwatch codex would be cool. They certainly deserve their own codex more than Dark Angels do.

Probably not for a while...and if it does, I hope that Ward isn't the one who gets to write it.

The bite is, only the Ordo Malleus really has a standing army. The Grey Knights.

The Ordo Xenos has the Deathwatch, but they are NOT an army. They are a pool of Astartes the Ordo sends on infiltration, sabotage, and assassination missions.

When the Inquisition needs to attack a large target, they call in the Imperial Guard or Space Marines. Doesn't matter what Ordo they are from.


Sure, all the Ordos have Inquisitorial soldiers. but they are not an army to go and take the fight to the enemy. They are security forces for the Inquisition's bases and personal security details.

Sorry, but an Inquisition Codex just doesn't work.

 Grey Templar wrote:
The bite is, only the Ordo Malleus really has a standing army. The Grey Knights.

The Ordo Xenos has the Deathwatch, but they are NOT an army. They are a pool of Astartes the Ordo sends on infiltration, sabotage, and assassination missions.

When the Inquisition needs to attack a large target, they call in the Imperial Guard or Space Marines. Doesn't matter what Ordo they are from.


Sure, all the Ordos have Inquisitorial soldiers. but they are not an army to go and take the fight to the enemy. They are security forces for the Inquisition's bases and personal security details.

Sorry, but an Inquisition Codex just doesn't work.

Functionally, the Deathwatch is no different to any other chapter.

I think the only viable way to include the Forces of the Inquisition is, other than using Codex: Grey Knights, is if GW were to release a WD supplement allowing for the usage of Inquisitorial warbands and Chambers Militant as Allies supplement.
Would make perfect sense, as the size of a WD Allies update would be suitable, as opposed to a full Codex, and the Primary detachment can represent the forces the Inquisitors have requisitioned.

 Inquisitor Ehrenstein wrote:
You could write one. I'm thinking about putting together a team to write unofficial codexes that haven't been written by GW.

I want in on this

 redkommando wrote:

 Inquisitor Ehrenstein wrote:
You could write one. I'm thinking about putting together a team to write unofficial codexes that haven't been written by GW.

I want in on this

Ditto, would be more than happy to help out

Start off with three highly customizable Inquisitors, one for each division. Like, crazy customizable. Modifiable statlines, huge array of equipment, etc.
Wargear and psychic power options should be the same, regardless of division. But give them different special rules (not too many) that would make sense for their specific division.

More unique and specialized henchmen for elites/troops. Throw in the assassins, and add in the two temples that don't already have codex representation. Inquisitional stormtroopers for troops as well.

Coke out daemonhosts, make them their own elite option. if an inquisitional army contains daemonhosts, it becomes desperate allies with Grey Knights, as opposed to blood brothers.

For heavy support and fast attack, you could play with some pretty cool/unique tech that would otherwise be heavily under wraps. Heavily specialized infantry with lots of exotic weaponry.

Blood Brothers with Grey Knights, Witch Hunters, Imperial Guard, and Vanilla Marines. Allies of convenience with other Space Marine Chapters.

Each Ordo could be represented through allies.

A short list of units to at least give a taste of something that doesn't require a whole codex.

Xenos)
HQ: Inquisitor with tons of equip/abilities/ect DWKT Librarian, Troops: Henchmen/Stormtroopers/Deathwatch kill team, Elites: DWKT Termies? Xenos Unit?, FA: Unique Xenos thing?, HS: Unique Xenos thing?

Hereticus)
HQ: Inquisitor with tons of equip/abilities/ect Sister Superior, Troops: Henchmen/Stormtroopers/Sisters units, Elites: Sisters Units, FA: Sisters units, HS: Sisters units.

Mallus)
Well the Grey Knights already have a codex but you get the idea.

There's all kinds of pros and cons to something like this, but I think in order for something like this to work there would have to be a few changes to the main rules (and the number of "regular" codexes).

 Tadashi wrote:

 Kaldor wrote:


Personally, I think a Deathwatch codex would be cool. They certainly deserve their own codex more than Dark Angels do.

Probably not for a while...and if it does, I hope that Ward isn't the one who gets to write it.

I highly doubt they'd ever see more than an entry for other marine codices. They don't run in big groups like other marines.

But really though, things like the Inquisition and Deathwatch are too small for the size of game that 40k has grown into. With every edition, army sizes tend to get bigger and bigger, as does the overall scale of the game. The thing about the Inquisition and Deathwatch, however, is that they're not something you'd see acting at such a scale for combat operations.

The approach towards the game has pretty much relegated really cool elements like the Inquisition and Deathwatch to the sidelines, sadly.
As a person who gets most of their enjoyment of 40k's fluff from the Inquisition, it kind of sucks, but it's the truth.

Why don't they make it that you can only take the Inquisition as Allies?
That way they will still go with the fluff and people can use them on the table top.

They might just do that, 6th is still pretty new.

 Kaldor wrote:
There's a lot of debate about the best way to implement the forces of the Inquisition.

At the moment, the Grey Knight codex covers all three main Ordos, but it doesn't cover them well. It covers the Ordo Malleus pretty well, and with the new Allies rule you can include Inquisitors and their warbands in any Imperial army. And you have access to Inquisitors from the Ordo Hereticus and the Ordo Xenos.

You can always take an Inquisitor in a SM army, and model the SM as Deathwatch. But it is a work-around. What you really want is a unit or two of Deathwatch marines, with preferred enemy: xenos, and access to funky wargear ala Sternguard.

And this would almost work. Except you have to bring GKs as troops. That's right, you cannot have Ordo Xenos or Ordo Hereticus Inquisitor without Grey Knights. Only Inquisitor that can get rid of GKs is Coteaz.... and he is from Ordo Malleus.

I want a separate Inquisition WD mini-dex that I can use for my allied inquisitors without touching the horrible thing that is the Grey Knight codex. Oh, and give those Inquisitors access to Iron halo and/or refractor field. It is absurd that they don't have them.

A inquisition dex would be good - there are so many cool possibilities of troops and wargear. However I'd rather see An Adeptus Mechanicus one first!

good point re having to have GK's - not good.

I did include a customisable Inqusitor entry in my draft SOB codex - which reminds me to put up the udpated version

http://www.mediafire.com/view/?zrn20gpv98p2zzg

I don't think an Inquisition Codex that aims to incorporate elements from all Orders would work very well. It'd just be a very cramped book with lots of units - out of which a player won't even consider using 50% just because they're from a different Ordo - and next to no fluff or cool stories because there were no pages left. Eww.

What I do think would work is the following combo:
- Codex Grey Knights
- Codex Sisters of Battle
- Codex Inquisition

The first two would be proper Codex books focusing on their respective armies, so only Grey Knights / only Ecclesiarchy. The third one, however, would be a White Dwarf Minidex that features Inquisitors, Inquisition Storm Troopers and updated Deathwatch Kill Team rules ... as an add-on for any existing Imperial army (GK, SoB, SM, IG). Not a lot of different minis and clearly not a standalone army (except for special Killteam games), so there'd be enough space left for some cool fluff and fancy pictures. As an added bonus, anyone can pick Inquisition stuff from this list to add it to their existing army.

Kaldor wrote:Functionally, the Deathwatch is no different to any other chapter.

It is, outside of FFG's little world. Judging by the small textbox in the 6E rulebook, GW seems to stick with its initial idea of ad-hoc teams operating under Inquisition jurisdiction, as opposed to a standing army with their own starship fleets and armoured formations doing as they want. I have to say I like that a lot more, too. Their small size makes the Deathwatch more unique than if they'd be just another Chapter of "Space Marines, but BETTER". We already have that.

 Kaldor wrote:

 Grey Templar wrote:
The bite is, only the Ordo Malleus really has a standing army. The Grey Knights.

The Ordo Xenos has the Deathwatch, but they are NOT an army. They are a pool of Astartes the Ordo sends on infiltration, sabotage, and assassination missions.

When the Inquisition needs to attack a large target, they call in the Imperial Guard or Space Marines. Doesn't matter what Ordo they are from.


Sure, all the Ordos have Inquisitorial soldiers. but they are not an army to go and take the fight to the enemy. They are security forces for the Inquisition's bases and personal security details.

Sorry, but an Inquisition Codex just doesn't work.

Functionally, the Deathwatch is no different to any other chapter.

No, on paper they are a Chapter. In practice they are only deployed in small groups to aid other imperial forces/carry out Spec Ops missions for the Inquisition.

So they really wouldn't make a fluffworthy codex.

 Hadarac wrote:
I really hope that GW would just finally make a codex for the three main Ordos of the Inquisition. What does the populace say?

Probably never going to happen. The reason that we never saw the expected Codex: Xenoshunters is that by then they realized that the Inquisition codex books were a failure. Some of us loved the flexibility of the books and the ability to craft a great army that was unique and interesting even if it didn't dominate the table top. I also feel that the Grey Knights incarnation in the Daemonhunters codex was by far the best. Their early appearance made them so overpriced that they were very weak against any army that was chaos. In the Daemonhunters codex they were potent against daemons, but chaos was given bonuses to counter balance these abilities somewhat so that the overall cost of the grey knights troops themselves was effectively balanced enough that they could be played in any game without being hamstrung. Now the new GK codex has just made them ludicrously powerful against every one. The old fluff had the grey knights only coming out if there was a REAL daemon threat, now they are just built up as "super space marines". They do it better, faster, with more fire power *and* are even more powerful against chaos forces.

Given how the books generally failed, though, I don't ever expect to see any kind of codex that is geared towards the inquisition. I'd love to see such an entity, but the likelihood is so improbable that I would be tempted to say it was impossible...GW opinions could change on the subject though, so I will stick with highly, highly improbable.

Skriker

Skriker wrote:In the Daemonhunters codex they were potent against daemons, but chaos was given bonuses to counter balance these abilities somewhat

That was pretty cool in that the Codex even offered something to players fighting against DH, effectively balancing the game in that both armies were boosted.
The WH Codex had something similar with special "Renegade Psyker", "Apostate Cardinal", "Traitor Guard" and "Mutant" units that a WH opponent could use. Here it was less due to a balance issue but more because it was just damn fluffy and intrigueing.

Shame that this idea seems to have been dropped.

 Fafnir wrote:
Start off with three highly customizable Inquisitors, one for each division. Like, crazy customizable. Modifiable statlines, huge array of equipment, etc.
Wargear and psychic power options should be the same, regardless of division. But give them different special rules (not too many) that would make sense for their specific division.

Like a lot of what you wrote, but why would the psychic power options be the same? Just seeing the original Daemonhunter and Witchhunter books showed how differently both forces approached psychic abilities within their area of expertise. Why would they all work exactly same way instead? A psyker trained to fight daemonic incursions and issues is going to develop different powers and uses for them and a psyker trained to fight masses of xenos forces that are not made up from the stuff of chaos. I would see a malleus psyker with powers to take away daemonic saves, and to affect deep striking daemons while the Xenos, if trained against tyranids, might have a power that could distrupt the hive him in an instinctive unit, and a combination of area effect less damaging powers and concetrated power ranged powers to take out the monstrous 'nids. Witchhunters, might be different with greater defenses against other psychic powers or powers to try and limit the psychic abilities of other power users. Given their completely different target opponents the same psychic power kit out makes no sense...

Skriker

There's a lot of talk about codex-suppliments being released SPECIFICALLY to add allies.

The talk has ranged from factions like:
Demiurg
Kroot
Ork Mercs
Ad Mech
Inquisition
Eldar Corsairs

and so on.

Inquisiton will likely never have a full dex; simply because it'd be too redundant with what we already have.

Imo there should be a new Codex Imperialis to cover the fluff/lore of all non-Space Marine/IG/SoB forces and institutions in the Imperium.

Inquisitors + retinue choices, Assassins, and Tech-Priests should all be HQ choices available to any Imperial force. Rules/stats for them are given via White Dwarf and later made available in any IG/Space Marine/SoB codex at the back.

GK codex was a mess as it made it appear that they were the only forces used by the Inquisition, when 6th Ed Rulebook clearly brought back the 3 Ordo Militants.

Don't have the link, but in the rumors board there is a new product list for June 2013 and onward, and there are a number of models that would indicate an Allies book is in the works. A few of the models were labeled "Imperial Agents", and included a new assassin. I'm hoping that the Allies book becomes a reality and that inquisitors and their stormtroopers (and other agents/henchmen) can be fielded without the need for Corteaz and the Grey Knights. I would finally be able to use those old metal stormtroopers and Inquisitor I bought waaay back in 3rd edition before I took a hiatus.

To further support the Allies book theory, there were also "Cabal" models and a "Cult Hybrid" conversion kit for those long awaited Genestealer cults (which would finally give 'Nids an ally). Its believed that Harlequins will be rolled into the Allies book as well.

 Skriker wrote:

 Fafnir wrote:
Start off with three highly customizable Inquisitors, one for each division. Like, crazy customizable. Modifiable statlines, huge array of equipment, etc.
Wargear and psychic power options should be the same, regardless of division. But give them different special rules (not too many) that would make sense for their specific division.

Like a lot of what you wrote, but why would the psychic power options be the same? Just seeing the original Daemonhunter and Witchhunter books showed how differently both forces approached psychic abilities within their area of expertise. Why would they all work exactly same way instead? A psyker trained to fight daemonic incursions and issues is going to develop different powers and uses for them and a psyker trained to fight masses of xenos forces that are not made up from the stuff of chaos. I would see a malleus psyker with powers to take away daemonic saves, and to affect deep striking daemons while the Xenos, if trained against tyranids, might have a power that could distrupt the hive him in an instinctive unit, and a combination of area effect less damaging powers and concetrated power ranged powers to take out the monstrous 'nids. Witchhunters, might be different with greater defenses against other psychic powers or powers to try and limit the psychic abilities of other power users. Given their completely different target opponents the same psychic power kit out makes no sense...

Skriker

Because giving you a suite of powers to choose from that aren't restricted by order would allow you to customize your Inquisitor to fit whatever order and specialization you wanted. Although there are three major Orders of the Inquisition, it's not like Inquisitors are wholly restricted to one.
Additionally, you wouldn't have to make as many powers, which means it would be easier to balance, and you wouldn't have to worry about creating multiple versions of what is essentially the same power for a different order.

From a gameplay standpoint, it's just better.