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Hi Dakka,
I was considering taking some red corsairs allies for my Tau (So you're a pirate? Let's make a deal. You fight for the greater good, and you won't get any trouble from us.), and I saw Huron's Warlord ability. This raised a few questions.

1) When there is a warlord trait built into the character description, does that mean that they have that ability and can't roll on any of the tables again?

2) Does that mean that the character is your warlord and you can't nominate, say, a regular lord with LD 10 to be your warlord?
And how does this interact with two special characters in the army?

3) If I take Huron as an ally, will he still have his warlord trait, even though your warlord cannot be from the allied contingent.

4) Huron has the Master of Deception trait, saying "Nominate D3 infantry units in your army before deployment. These units gain the infiltrate special rule". Does this exclude bikes and jump/jetpack infantry? And can I nominate units from my main Tau contingent, as they are part of my "army", even though they are not counted as friendly units.

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

 DakkaHammer wrote:
Hi Dakka,
I was considering taking some red corsairs allies for my Tau (So you're a pirate? Let's make a deal. You fight for the greater good, and you won't get any trouble from us.), and I saw Huron's Warlord ability. This raised a few questions.

1) When there is a warlord trait built into the character description, does that mean that they have that ability and can't roll on any of the tables again?

2) Does that mean that the character is your warlord and you can't nominate, say, a regular lord with LD 10 to be your warlord?
And how does this interact with two special characters in the army?

3) If I take Huron as an ally, will he still have his warlord trait, even though your warlord cannot be from the allied contingent.

4) Huron has the Master of Deception trait, saying "Nominate D3 infantry units in your army before deployment. These units gain the infiltrate special rule". Does this exclude bikes and jump/jetpack infantry? And can I nominate units from my main Tau contingent, as they are part of my "army", even though they are not counted as friendly units.

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

1) Yes, as it says "Warlord Trait" and explains it earlier in the Codex, JUST after the Painting Gallery and JUST before the Army List bit.

2) No, that Trait only comes into play IF said Character is your warlord. 2 Special Characters doesn't change anything it just means that you get 2 "Warlords" to pick from.

3) He will have it, but you cannot use it as, as you said yourself, you cannot take a Warlord from your Allied Detachment.

4) I'd say yes, as it says Army, and the Tau are bought as part of your Army. Bikes are Excluded, but as for Jump/Jetpack Infantry... I'll leave that for someone else, as the brain juices have dried up...


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Also. I didn't get Ninja'ed...

THANK YOU TZEENTCH!!!

Thanks for the quick reply
So it appears my plans for infiltrating tau would work... if I could have a second warlord. Curses.

And is there a passage somewhere that elaborates on the character having to be your warlord for the trait to work, or are you just working off of common sense?


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Because as far as i can tell, you only have to be a warlord if you want to roll on a table. If you already have a trait then...

Common sense mainly...

And its called a WARLORD trait for a reason



And NP on the quick reply... I can't sleep and My internets being real slow... so... no videos to get me to sleep...

righto

Ok yeah, the more I think about it the more it makes sense that that would be RAI, and I will play it like that. But still, it's disappointing. Perhaps i would be better off with just a decked out lord rather than Huron, though he still looks like he'd be a beast in combat.

Its more disappointing that they didn't spell it out clearly in the codex about the warlord traits.

True, but making sense throughout the entire codex would be too much to ask.
I really hope the FAQ this soon. Because the way it is written (and interacts with the rulebook), you can have two warlord traits. Like some sort of botched system for giving an army bonus like Eldrad or Vulkan.

You can have two traits, but the rules only allow for one warlord.

Even if Huron was your warlord and Tau were the allies, you wouldn't get infiltrating Tau, as they are not battle brothers.

This dilemma can be summed up in a few brief sentences.

"Hey, you're pirates. Fight for the greater good and you won't get any trouble from us."


"'Kay," . . . . . . (3 seconds later)

"MAIM KILL BURN PILLAGE RAPE KILL MAIM BURN!!!"

"Aaieeeeee!!!"

A bit of a weak justification I know , but I like the Red Corsairs and the new chaos book looks fun.

Also, I just noticed that the chaos book says "when generating his warlord traits, a chaos warlord...". It says "traits" in plural.

 DakkaHammer wrote:
A bit of a weak justification I know , but I like the Red Corsairs and the new chaos book looks fun.

Also, I just noticed that the chaos book says "when generating his warlord traits, a chaos warlord...". It says "traits" in plural.

It does in fact say Traits, plural, but keep reading. You may either roll on the table in Codex: Chaos Space Marines or in the BRB when generating a Warlord's traits. The weakness here is that the entries for the fixed Warlord Traits are not explicitly spelled out.

aka; Abaddon has an entry that reads exactly like this

"Warlord Trait: Black Crusader"

That's it. Now I have been playing this as Abaddon never rolls for one and is always assumed to have the fixed trait of Black Crusader. Interestingly, though, the BRB indicates that whenever you select a model as your Warlord you should generate a trait on one of the three tables (or with one inside your codex). The language is even pretty strong here.

lol@grammar from GWS

"To determine which trait your Warlord has, you NEED choose which table to roll on at the start of the game. Roll on the table before your deploy your army (see page 121). Sometimes, a codex will present an alternative Warlord Traits table that you can choose to roll on instead."

Nowhere whatsoever does it explicitly state that Huron, Abaddon, Ahriman or any of the others should not roll on these tables. It only says that they have Warlord Trait: X.

This can be broken down in two ways, IMHO:

1) You can roll on whatever table you want as per the BRB, but the specific unit entry in the codex then takes that result and modifies it to reflect the Warlord Trait: entry in that character's special rules (Codex specific > BRB general).

2) You start with a fixed trait and can roll on the table again and have a warlord with two traits, provided you don't get dupes (aka Abaddon rolling Black Crusader).



Edit: In asking a friend, I explained the question like this

The BRB stipulates that you NEED to roll on a table for your Warlord's trait (whether that table is in the rulebook or in the codex).

There is no language anywhere that you are limited to only one trait (such that I am aware) with one vital exception.


Pg. 111 BRB:

"Warlord Traits:
To determine which trait (SINGULAR) your Warlord has, you need choose which table to roll on at the start of the game. . . . ."

To address point 4) that you made, yes you can nominate jump/jetpack infantry, they unit type entry in the BRB says they are whatever the unit was before with either Jump or Jetpack added in front, Infantry are still infantry when you strap a jump pack to them, Dreadknights are still MC after you strap a teleportation pack to them and make them JMC.

 DakkaHammer wrote:
A bit of a weak justification I know , but I like the Red Corsairs and the new chaos book looks fun.

Also, I just noticed that the chaos book says "when generating his warlord traits, a chaos warlord...". It says "traits" in plural.

Minibump. I'm thinking I might start a new thread with the question prompted by this fine fellow.

This one question about Warlord Trait just keeps popping up over and over again.

Too bad, that CSM doesn't have any battle-brothers that would benefit from this Warlord trait.
Daemons have to deploy with their deepstrike thing & no one else likes them enough.

Umm... about that whole infantry thing your wrong. Jump Infantry are completely different from Infantry.

Example, you cannot put rapters in a Rhino. Why because a rhino can only hold infantry. There are transports that specify that you can put Jump infantry in them, for example the stormwhater that is the transport flyer for the SMs

jegsar wrote:
Umm... about that whole infantry thing your wrong. Jump Infantry are completely different from Infantry.

Example, you cannot put rapters in a Rhino. Why because a rhino can only hold infantry. There are transports that specify that you can put Jump infantry in them, for example the stormwhater that is the transport flyer for the SMs

Wrong. In 6th Jump is a subset of Infantry. The reason Jump Infantry can't embark is because the embarkation rules specifically forbid it.

jegsar wrote:
Umm... about that whole infantry thing your wrong. Jump Infantry are completely different from Infantry.

Example, you cannot put rapters in a Rhino. Why because a rhino can only hold infantry. There are transports that specify that you can put Jump infantry in them, for example the stormwhater that is the transport flyer for the SMs

Wrong, you cannot put anything with BULKY into a Rhino. Raptors have bukly as do Terminators and obliterators.

Thnaks Boneblade, though which question is that? I seem to have raised a few.

And so are you saying you think the first case you stated is true then? Based on page 111 of the RB.

 Bloodhorror wrote:

jegsar wrote:
Umm... about that whole infantry thing your wrong. Jump Infantry are completely different from Infantry.

Example, you cannot put rapters in a Rhino. Why because a rhino can only hold infantry. There are transports that specify that you can put Jump infantry in them, for example the stormwhater that is the transport flyer for the SMs

Wrong, you cannot put anything with BULKY into a Rhino. Raptors have bukly as do Terminators and obliterators.

Where does it say that bulky models cannot go in a transport? Most of the units that have bulky cannot go into one, some units that have effective bulky such as fenrisian wolves on characters can and I am sure that there are some examples of bulky models that can go into a rhino.

Terminators have a rule that dis-allows them from being put into rhinos, the bulky rule is just a rule that states how many spaces the model takes.

 liturgies of blood wrote:

 Bloodhorror wrote:

jegsar wrote:
Umm... about that whole infantry thing your wrong. Jump Infantry are completely different from Infantry.

Example, you cannot put rapters in a Rhino. Why because a rhino can only hold infantry. There are transports that specify that you can put Jump infantry in them, for example the stormwhater that is the transport flyer for the SMs

Wrong, you cannot put anything with BULKY into a Rhino. Raptors have bukly as do Terminators and obliterators.

Where does it say that bulky models cannot go in a transport? Most of the units that have bulky cannot go into one, some units that have effective bulky such as fenrisian wolves on characters can and I am sure that there are some examples of bulky models that can go into a rhino.

Ogryns

Page 54 of the chaos codex states that bulky etc may not embark a rhino