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Updated version.....

HORQ MALARIC
Captain of the Exorcists 5th Company, Caller of the Fires, the Burning Angel.
225 Points

WS.....BS.....S.....T.....W.....I.....A.....Ld.....Sv
..6........5.......4.....4......3.....5....3.....10......2+

Unit Composition:
1 (Unique).

Unit Type:
Infantry.

Wargear:
Terminator Armour.
Storm Shield.
Wrathful.
Digital Weapons.
Teleport Homer.
Psychic Hood.
Iron Halo

Special Rules:
And They Shall Know No Fear.
Combat Tactics.
Independent Character.
Chapter Tactics.
Psyker (Mastery Level 2, Pyromancy Psychic Discipline).
Preferred Enemy (Chaos Daemons).
Ritual Fervour.

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Wrathful: Wrathful is an axe whose very edge shimmers with radiant energies, whose very soul was cast from the embers of a dying sun. Wrathful is the bane of Daemons and Witches alike, it's keen edge able to cut through the fabric of reality as so to sunder the soul of it's foe. Coruscating waves of pure psychic force play out across it's head and this axe was specifically forged for the hands of Malaric, a potent psyker-commander of the Exorcists. The Wrathful is a force weapon with the following profile:

Weapon.......................................Range............STR.........AP..........Type
Wrathful............................................-...................+1.............2............Melee, Force, Unwieldy, Rending, Shred.

Chapter Tactics: If you include Malaric in your Space Marine army, then all units in your army exchange the Combat Tactics special rule for the Furious Charge universal special rule. Additionally, the Sergeants and Veteran Sergeants in your squads may be replaced with Codicier Librarians for an additional points cost of 30 points. If they are upgraded the Codicier must exchange his chainsword/combat blade with a Force Weapon and gains Psyker (Mastery Level 1). The Codicier may then select powers from the Pyromancy Psychic Discipline Table and then they may then take further upgrades as specified in the Sergeant's entry in the army list.

Ritual Fervour: Malaric and any unit he is with become subject to the Rage universal special rule for the remainder of the game once he or they have won a hand-to-hand combat against an enemy unit.

So for +30 points you get a scoring librarian, who would normally be, what, around 100? So for about 46 all up you get a 100 point model?

Maybe I'm missing something...

 motyak wrote:
So for +30 points you get a scoring librarian, who would normally be, what, around 100? So for about 46 all up you get a 100 point model?

Maybe I'm missing something...

That could do with fixing then. I just thought having it at the 100 a Librarian will normally cost would up the cost of squads to be a little steep. I could always design a separate profile for a Librarian upgrade, maybe to represent a Codicier? Right, that will be reworked sorry

What about the rest of him? Bad? Super bad? Awful?

I'd say he's pretty fair. Why is the axe only AP3 though? As has been noted, you have to fix the Librarian upgrade thingie, it's a bit silly as-is. Upgrading them to a Mastery Level 1 psyker with 1 wound and some options sounds like the right way to go.

 AlmightyWalrus wrote:
I'd say he's pretty fair. Why is the axe only AP3 though? As has been noted, you have to fix the Librarian upgrade thingie, it's a bit silly as-is. Upgrading them to a Mastery Level 1 psyker with 1 wound and some options sounds like the right way to go.

Why thank you Almighty. The force axe is AP3 because what I done was take the standard force axe from the rulebook and add Rending and Shred to the 'Type'.

As for your suggestions on the Librarian well well well, that's exactly what I was thinking. Might even give them 1 more Initiative to represent their third-eye prescience thing Librarians have going, heck, if he is in tune with the Warp surely he can see what an enemy is planning on doing and hit first Basically, rather than become actual Librarians for a deducted value of just 30 points hehe I'll have it so for 35 points, rather, they get upgraded to a Codicier or a junior/neophyte Libby if you will. Maybe they get a Force Weapon, Psychic Hood, +1 Wound, +1 Initiative, Psyker (Mastery Level 1) and Smite? to represent the hot-headed vicious nature of the young (young in Space Marine terms that is).

No Initiative, Psychic Hood or extra wound, that'd just be silly. 30 points for a Force Weapon and Psyker (M1) sounds pretty fair to me, possibly make it 25 points. Force Axes are AP2 though, that's why I asked.

 AlmightyWalrus wrote:
No Initiative, Psychic Hood or extra wound, that'd just be silly. 30 points for a Force Weapon and Psyker (M1) sounds pretty fair to me, possibly make it 25 points. Force Axes are AP2 though, that's why I asked.

Oh yes sorry, I didn't mean +1 Wound, I didn't read your post correctly No +1 Initiative, that's fine by me, I just thought it might make sense to represent the third-eye aspect of a Librarian. No Psychic Hood though? Are you sure? I thought all Librarians got one despite rank? I'll decide on a points cost when I have updated him.

Ah yes, they are AP2 ah that's it, I made it AP3 so it wasn't OP. Do you think I could bump it back up to AP2?

Definitely bump it to AP2, as that's what every other axe is.

As for the Librarian upgrade, look to the new CSM book. Thousand Sons pay 58 points for a ML1, 1 wound Sorcerer with no psychic hood and is forced to a single Psychic table. That's probably a little too much, so maybe make it a 40 point upgrade to give any Sergeant the Psyker special rule with ML1, and they must exchange one Melee weapon for a Force Weapon. They can either choose one Librarian power, or generate one at the start of the game as normal.

I'd also say Adamantium Will probably is a better special rule to fit the Exorcists over Furious Charge.

 MasterSlowPoke wrote:
Definitely bump it to AP2, as that's what every other axe is.

As for the Librarian upgrade, look to the new CSM book. Thousand Sons pay 58 points for a ML1, 1 wound Sorcerer with no psychic hood and is forced to a single Psychic table. That's probably a little too much, so maybe make it a 40 point upgrade to give any Sergeant the Psyker special rule with ML1, and they must exchange one Melee weapon for a Force Weapon.

Alright then, up to AP2 it goes.

Well to be honest, that's because they are Thousand Sons, people who were trained from their very birth (literally) to be amazing psykers. People who have lived since the 30th Millennium. People who are the worshippers of the god of sorcery. Do Sorcerers actually get Psychic Hoods though? In the 5th ed 'dex they didn't so it's more a matter of they don't have access to the thing rather than not being allowed to have it in the upgrade. My Librarian upgrade represents a junior, a newbie to the school of Marine psykers. How about 35 points for Psyker (Mastery Level 1) and they must exchange their chainsword/combat blade for a force weapon (of any type of course) and then a Psychic Hood, or 40 points rather. It's just... with them being Librarians I would definitely see them as having Psychic Hoods regardless of where they stand in both rank and role.

EDIT: Okay, just updated Wrathful and his Chapter Tactics. Thoughts?


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Opinions? Anybody?

I'd specify which tables they can take powers from

 motyak wrote:
I'd specify which tables they can take powers from

Ah yes thank you. Definitely the Space Marine table, but maybe I'll just limit the power(s) to Smite, seeing as they're as junior as they are, I think that Smite would probably be the first thing they would learn to master and control.

After a little thought, and after flicking through my 40k rulebook because I forgot about the Psychic Disciplines within, I've changed his Psychic Powers and gave him access to the Pyromancy Discipline only.

So long as regular SM librarians can take Pyromancy, I play guard so I have no idea who can take what

I'd drop the hoods on Sergeant upgrades. Why? That much psychic coverage means they can shut down psychic powers across the table. Let's consider psychic heavy armies such as Thousand sons, Eldar and Grey Knights.
For a relatively small cost, they can be denied their abilities quite easily.

Also, GKs are all psykers and don't get hoods (except Libbies), as well as the aforementioned Thousand Sons, which I think you'll agree isn't unfeasible for them to have a way of shutting down enemy psykers. For those reasons, I would remove the hoods on libby upgrade sergeants.

Otherwise, I think you've done a good job. You seem convinced that you make bad rules, whereas I've seen you do quite well. No idea is going to be perfect off the bat, which is why we have this section of the forum and playtesting.

motyak wrote:So long as regular SM librarians can take Pyromancy, I play guard so I have no idea who can take what

Yeh they can. I made sure to grab my White Dwarf that had the tables and who could take what, and guess what! Space Marines can take Pyromancy so yes I did make sure beforehand.

liquidjoshi wrote:I'd drop the hoods on Sergeant upgrades. Why? That much psychic coverage means they can shut down psychic powers across the table. Let's consider psychic heavy armies such as Thousand sons, Eldar and Grey Knights.
For a relatively small cost, they can be denied their abilities quite easily.

Also, GKs are all psykers and don't get hoods (except Libbies), as well as the aforementioned Thousand Sons, which I think you'll agree isn't unfeasible for them to have a way of shutting down enemy psykers. For those reasons, I would remove the hoods on libby upgrade sergeants.

Otherwise, I think you've done a good job. You seem convinced that you make bad rules, whereas I've seen you do quite well. No idea is going to be perfect off the bat, which is why we have this section of the forum and playtesting.

Hmm, well, when you put it like that I guess I can't refuse

I'll remove the Psychic Hoods and then reduce the cost to what, 30 points? Sorted.

Thanks for the compliment liquid. Since you helped me the first time round I've always sought your opinion and advice, I guess it's a custom now hehe If I was to reflect, to be honest that first character I made and posted was a total and complete mess, complete and utter overkill and massively OP so yes he was poorly made and very badly wrote in terms of rules. The second character progressed more, although from the start he was still OP. One post after that and he was perfectly in-tune, fairly received and balanced. Now when it comes to this third character (at least I think he's the third ) I feel he's not too bad, he did need improving on that Librarian upgrade that came with his Chapter Tactics but aside from that he is again well-received.

The first was OTT, but it wasn't that bad. Second went well and the third is pretty much good to go I think. Now go forth and playtest!

Also, don't worry about asking me for help. It's a pleasure to, especially when things go as well as this one

 liquidjoshi wrote:
The first was OTT, but it wasn't that bad. Second went well and the third is pretty much good to go I think. Now go forth and playtest!

Also, don't worry about asking me for help. It's a pleasure to, especially when things go as well as this one

Haha I'll proxy a model for a playtest when the army is done. Waiting on the new crimbo Space Marine Megaforce really whilst at the moment I'm working on conversions of the individual members of his Command Squad. The AoBR Space Marine Captain, Grey Knight Castellan Crowe, and the DV Dark Angels Company Master, in one squad!? what could possibly happen!?

Ugh, not the Crowe model. God, is that a hideous piece...

Oh, forgot to say, far better name this time.

 liquidjoshi wrote:
Ugh, not the Crowe model. God, is that a hideous piece...

Oh, forgot to say, far better name this time.

I'm rather fond of him really. I'm mixing Grey Knight pieces with Space Marine pieces, although not to an enormous extent. Hence the use of Crowe, there's something about the Blade of Antwyr.... it draws me in

Thank you, thank you My homebrew Chapter (or Chapters rather) all have their own individual names in terms of style, like Dark Angels are almost religious-like, Space Wolves are more akin to vikings, Ultramarines to Romans, Blood Angels to renaissance Italians and such. Mine are often complicated and long-winded which is what I loooooove about them, I think they have character. Exorcists on the other hand are simpler than my own, but I like the name all the same.

Simple is often better. If you can't pronounce it easily, it's not a good name.

 liquidjoshi wrote:
Simple is often better. If you can't pronounce it easily, it's not a good name.

I could pronounce the names since well, I made them. It's others who had difficulty

Yes, but that's the problem, isn't it?

It isn't a strict rule, but it's a good one to keep to. People will make judgements about your characters from it, consciously or not. I know I do. The fact of the matter is, most people will just skim past a character if they can't pronounce the name easily. It's a good way of separating the wheat from the chaff.

Oh, and is your avatar from Killzone by any chance?

 liquidjoshi wrote:
Yes, but that's the problem, isn't it?

It isn't a strict rule, but it's a good one to keep to. People will make judgements about your characters from it, consciously or not. I know I do. The fact of the matter is, most people will just skim past a character if they can't pronounce the name easily. It's a good way of separating the wheat from the chaff.

Oh, and is your avatar from Killzone by any chance?

True, true. I must admit I do the same. I think you just automatically do it, unconsciously or consciously. It's just how the human mind works. I also have a feeling this small talk may be straying of the topic a little don't want to be getting in trouble with the man now do we

And yes, yes it is. Killzone is by far one of the greatest if not the greatest original series to Playstation.

Timesplitters has that title my friend. And We're not massively off topic, but let's pull it back:

He's good, and you can pronounce the name. Good job.

 liquidjoshi wrote:
Timesplitters has that title my friend. And We're not massively off topic, but let's pull it back:

He's good, and you can pronounce the name. Good job.

You know, I hear that often but I never really played it.

Thank you for your compliments overall liquid.


Can anybody else offer anything more to the table?

Nope, all my issues have been resolved, (level of upgrade, psychic discipline, psychic hood). Well done on making a good character. That is hard enough as it is, but making a good character who can also upgrade members of your army is usually a recipe for disaster, yet this guy works.

As joshi said, go forth and playtest and enjoy.

 motyak wrote:
Nope, all my issues have been resolved, (level of upgrade, psychic discipline, psychic hood). Well done on making a good character. That is hard enough as it is, but making a good character who can also upgrade members of your army is usually a recipe for disaster, yet this guy works.

As joshi said, go forth and playtest and enjoy.

Thank you for that motyak! I have finally succeeded hehe.

I'm not 100%, but don't the Exorcists hate psykers? I just remember from a short story where an Exorcist in the Deathwatch thinks the Librarian, even though he's being careful and emperor-fearing and all that, is still cursed for messing with powers he should leave alone Lore is what you make of it and all, of course.

codemonkey wrote:
I'm not 100%, but don't the Exorcists hate psykers? I just remember from a short story where an Exorcist in the Deathwatch thinks the Librarian, even though he's being careful and emperor-fearing and all that, is still cursed for messing with powers he should leave alone

Spoiler:

and nearly kills him when he almost succumbs to perils

Lore is what you make of it and all, of course.

Ah well you are possibly right, but also possibly wrong. Exorcists are Space Marines so regardless, they will have Librarians. They excel in fighting Daemons and were supposedly descended from the Grey Knights and made as some Codex Chapter to combat Daemons, it was basically an experiment that turned out right. So, I'd have thought they would have an even larger cadre of Librarians and a more developed and favourable Librarius, especially seeing as one of their Orisons (the Broken Tower) is dedicated almost mainly to Psykers.