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So, just started playing again and have been really looking forward to it, went by to my local store and saw a terminator set (GK) loved the look of the models and took it home, this is a few weeks later and after a post on dakka i've been playing with my grey knights and fair enough its fairly purifier heavy and has a vindicare and a psyfleman with my 3 friends who also play (Orkz, IG and DA) and whats ruining my experience is the amount of moaning and whining i get whilst playing, even if losing every-time purifying flame is cast i get a moan and a grumble about my army being the most OP thing in the universe and its just started to grind me to the point where i want to quit, i mean its not as though i use the knights in the worst way, the players i have simply don't change tactics and play to my strengths using small squads to try and outshoot my paladins (2 psycannons whilst in cover and shooting in heavy) or charging my purifiers with a damaged squad and moaning when there isn't much left. I don't know what you guys could suggest i just wanted to share with you my problem and wish some people would stop jumping on bandwagon that GK's are some sort of mutated blob of death that costs a single point
-Rant Over

Get new friends.

In all seriousness, try playing with people you don't know. Clearly your friends aren't interested in trying to win, they're more interested in losing to justify their opinion that GK are op (which they just aren't). If you play new people you'll get beaten a few times and win a few times, making it more fun for you.

Dude GK's aren't even that good.

Tell your friends to fix their lists and learn to play. The guard player, especially. Has he ever heard of Leman Russ Battle Tanks?

GK's may be cool, but they die to shooting just like regular marines.

 Griddlelol wrote:
Get new friends.

In all seriousness, try playing with people you don't know. Clearly your friends aren't interested in trying to win, they're more interested in losing to justify their opinion that GK are op (which they just aren't). If you play new people you'll get beaten a few times and win a few times, making it more fun for you.

This !

The thing I find funny is that GK are easy to counter if you know what kind of list you are up against, and if, over the course of several games, they still havn't grasped the concept, it's time for a breath of fresh air.

Another idea, would be trashing your own GK army with one of your friends figs. Just to prove a point.

 mayfist wrote:


Another idea, would be trashing your own GK army with one of your friends figs. Just to prove a point.

haha! That's an awesome idea. An army swap! It's good fun, and if you smash your GKs with their army it'll just look silly.

@Mayfist i've offered to do that! but the answer was they chose there armies to play with not to play with another set (funny isn't it)
and i have picked out and given my friends a weakness of my entire army and even thrown tactics at them, but still cries of cheese in everything i do -sigh- i think i need to inquire at my local venue

TheCaptain wrote:

Tell your friends to fix their lists and learn to play.

Hmm. Yeah, that sounded mean. I redact that.

mayfist wrote:
Another idea, would be trashing your own GK army with one of your friends figs. Just to prove a point.

I second this, a lot.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

WaywardKnight wrote:
@Mayfist i've offered to do that! but the answer was they chose there armies to play with not to play with another set (funny isn't it)
and i have picked out and given my friends a weakness of my entire army and even thrown tactics at them, but still cries of cheese in everything i do -sigh- i think i need to inquire at my local venue

So they refuse to validate their claims of cheese by accepting your proposal, and they refuse to adapt to the weaknesses you are TELLING them.

I still kinda fail how they struggle so much against a MEQ army, considering any decent armylist is written with MEQ in mind, since most of the armies in 40k end up being MEQ in the first place.

 TheCaptain wrote:

TheCaptain wrote:

Tell your friends to fix their lists and learn to play.

Hmm. Yeah, that sounded mean. I redact that.

possibly but maybe it's true

mayfist wrote:
Another idea, would be trashing your own GK army with one of your friends figs. Just to prove a point.

I second this, a lot.

motion passed

Edited out an irrelevant statement.

If you really like your friends you could try to phase out the GK by using allies. I tend to use a "fun list" against my good friends because they hate getting shot off the table. When I'm being competitive, I go back to my competitive list.

Automatically Appended Next Post:

WaywardKnight wrote:
@Mayfist i've offered to do that! but the answer was they chose there armies to play with not to play with another set (funny isn't it)
and i have picked out and given my friends a weakness of my entire army and even thrown tactics at them, but still cries of cheese in everything i do -sigh- i think i need to inquire at my local venue

So they refuse to validate their claims of cheese by accepting your proposal, and they refuse to adapt to the weaknesses you are TELLING them.

I still kinda fail how they struggle so much against a MEQ army, considering any decent armylist is written with MEQ in mind, since most of the armies in 40k end up being MEQ in the first place.

WaywardKnight wrote:
i think the main problem one of them has is that he relies on boyz taking out my purifiers and trying to outshoot them (whilst they are in cover and using the heavy 4 psycannon setting) and boyz, not being the best shooters don't do brilliantly and then assault what is considered the anti horde unit of the GK's i just generally think i can't win this argument

Well, you can win. Unfortunately, it's not going to be the way you like. I mean this nicely now, but it sounds like your friends might not fully grasp how to play 40k. You might have to play like you're teaching them (take point handicaps, go a little easier on them, and let them take back a move if it's dumb.) Charging purifiers with boyz is asking to lose.

Good luck with them; some are just too stubborn to be dealt with through logic.

Sadly i think your war is going to be the way forward, but i can see what will happen is that when i get a loss they will rub it in to no end, but as soon as i take a win it will be back to the cheese i think i will end up finishing up 2k of GK's and moving onto something they see as more "equal"

GK has been fotm for years now and is definitely on the upper end of powerful codices. If you don't wanna deal with people getting irritated by it, avoid playing powerful fotm armies. I'm not justifying their behavior, just saying it's not abnormal and while it seems fair on the surface to expect everyone to be cheery about whatever you field, reality does not agree. Otherwise, you wouldn't have this issue. The best you could do is swap armies for a game with them but you'd probably just end up finding out just how powerful GK are.

TLDR; Deal with it, that's the downside of playing top-tier codices.

It seems to be that your mates, are not very good friends either... I mean, I used to play with a very good friend of mine, but he got super competitive. Also, his monthly 40k budget was close to my yearly budget, and as you can guess playing wasn't all that fun any more.

Another solution, which is what worked for me, was simply telling him. His waac style of play was ruining my 40k experience, and also damaging our time together, as friends.

We had a little talk, he understood what I was on about, and we worked it out.

Talking to your friends, telling them what's on your mind is probably the best solution from what I've gathered.

I''ll go ahead and talk to them about it tomorrow (touched upon but they just get defensive) i think one of the main factors is the fact that if there's a common enemy its much easier to blame that than your playing style or miniatures but thanks for the advice again!

 60mm wrote:
GK has been fotm for years now and is definitely on the upper end of powerful codices. If you don't wanna deal with people getting irritated by it, avoid playing powerful fotm armies. I'm not justifying their behavior, just saying it's not abnormal and while it seems fair on the surface to expect everyone to be cheery about whatever you field, reality does not agree. Otherwise, you wouldn't have this issue. The best you could do is swap armies for a game with them but you'd probably just end up finding out just how powerful GK are.

TLDR; Deal with it, that's the downside of playing top-tier codices.

I really disagree with your statement. He shouldn't be take a verbal bashing for playing a army he likes, that's ridiculous. Remember these people are suppose to be his friends.

And to the OP, seriously, try talking to your friends, don't give in to there close minded Bs.

Like I said, I don't support their behavior. It's childish. Just saying he should know that he isn't going to stop running into that behavior playing GK. If he goes to a LGS, he'll probably encounter the same thing.

 60mm wrote:
GK has been fotm for years now and is definitely on the upper end of powerful codices.

It's up there, but so is IG. His friends obviously don't complain about that codex to the same extent despite it's highly competitive nature.

What confuses me is when my freinds play against eachother he doesn't complain about the blast templates taking chunks of his boyz out (generally before i would in a game by far) i just feel a tad annoyed after dropping in the regions of 60-100 on my army that i get prejudice.

 Griddlelol wrote:

 60mm wrote:
GK has been fotm for years now and is definitely on the upper end of powerful codices.

It's up there, but so is IG. His friends obviously don't complain about that codex to the same extent despite it's highly competitive nature.

I'd guess the issue here is the fact that they are 17. IG is extremely expensive to build powerful lists with, where-as GK certainly do not have this issue. It's easy to forget how poor 17 year olds are until your recall being one. :-/

 60mm wrote:

I'd guess the issue here is the fact that they are 17. IG is extremely expensive to build powerful lists with, where-as GK certainly do not have this issue. It's easy to forget how poor 17 year olds are until your recall being one. :-/

I didn't know the age of OP. Yeah IG is quite expensive, but can trash GK when built, even as just a TAC list. It's horrible what they can do if they tailor.

I've got no experience with Orks, they're not common at all in my local meta, only 1 player who rarely shows up.

You could always use them as "counts as" to show that it's their tactics rather than their codices. Or as I said before, play different people.

Im a chaos player, (converting to tau) and ive played two games against grey knights both at 2000pts and and i lost both

One i enjoyed quite a bit, the other i hated immensely!

the differnce was the players, the first game was fun and friendly and having never played grey knights before i enjoyed the challenge.
Yes there were some cheesy rules and special things but hey its whatever.

The other game i played the guy was a dick, double or triple checking EVERYTHING i did, and anytime i killed any of his knights he bitched about it!
and he thought it was just out of this world that my demon prince ( who cost over 300 points to play him how i did) killed his terminator warlord dude and two other guys (black mace)
It seems to me some of the problem other players have with grey knights player are the attitudes of the people with the armies.
Just as mentioned above about your friend not focusing on winning but on losing so they could complain about grey knights being OP, im sure there are several player
who use grey knights and just expect to win, and when they dont they get bad attitudes.
So yeah all around i think it really has to do with the attitude of the players whether its the knights player or otherwise.

Keeping in mind that we do not know the lists that the OP and his friends are using beyond what he says that he is using. He specifically mentioned a vindicare assassin, psyfleman, and lots of purifiers. I will assume then that he is taking crowe to make the purifiers scoring. These are the units (sans transports) that form the backbone of classic purifier spam. Against Tyranids and Orks that do not tailor to be as point efficient as possible this kind of list is brutal. IG less so, but if he takes a weaker list issues could easily arise.

To the OP. If you can try to change up your list a little. I am not saying do not try to win, but rather try a slightly different list build.

Hey nightwolf, i have 2 squads of purifers only and a squad of termi's so its not a huge spam, i do take crowe to make them scoring (would be silly to have only 1 scoring unit) but its not as though i'm taking solely purifers, on the dread i have used because of the model i had laying around but it isn't in anyway a hardcore list made to tear apart everything but the best list i could come up with that would be without purposefully making my army weaker i'm going to mix it up taking some strike squads or proxy purg squads and see how it goes thanks for all the advice again guys!
EDIT:
To put my forces as standing i play with
HQ
Castellan Crowe
Elites
Vindicare Assassin
Troops
5x Purifiers 2 Psycannons 2 halberd 1 hammer
5x Purifiers 2 Psycannons 2 halberd 1 hammer
5x GKT 1 Psycannon 3 halberds 1 hammer
Heavy Support
Psyfleman 2xTLAC w/Psybolt ammo
I could understand if i was running this but say dropping the vindi adding another psyfleman and dropping the terminators for another paladin squad and upgrading the other 2, but i simply don't see this list as a huge problem (alot of foot slogging involved)

Your friends are demonstrating the classic traits of scrubs. The problem is the refusal to learn. If this persists in the face of you telling them how to kill you, it's probably not fixable because they're fundamentally bad gamers. The army is beatable, especially by Guard. If they refuse to admit otherwise, they're bad and should feel bad. Your list is frankly nothing super competitive either so their complaints are without merit.

 GreyHamster wrote:
Your friends are demonstrating the classic traits of scrubs. The problem is the refusal to learn. If this persists in the face of you telling them how to kill you, it's probably not fixable because they're fundamentally bad gamers. The army is beatable, especially by Guard. If they refuse to admit otherwise, they're bad and should feel bad. Your list is frankly nothing super competitive either so their complaints are without merit.

This pretty much sums it up....

 GreyHamster wrote:
Your friends are demonstrating the classic traits of scrubs. The problem is the refusal to learn. If this persists in the face of you telling them how to kill you, it's probably not fixable because they're fundamentally bad gamers. The army is beatable, especially by Guard. If they refuse to admit otherwise, they're bad and should feel bad. Your list is frankly nothing super competitive either so their complaints are without merit.

Well said, and I may I suggest advertising in your local club or hobby shop for new plaers? That did wonders for me when my gaming group went and died

I totally understand how you feel man, I get crap at my LGS just for saying the words "Grey Knights". But honestly, I haven't won a single game on my own since I started 2 years ago with my GKs. (I've won a couple when playing 2 vs 2, but that's it) My friends are the only ones who don't complain about my "op army of death" when we play.

I learn a lot though from every loss, and my list is constantly changing. I did, however, handicap myself in my lists since I saw a lot of whiny tourney players complaining about Inquisitor heavy and Purifier spam lists (all purifiers, one HQ). So I refused to add in any Inquisitors, and I won't run more than 1/3 of my army as the same type or set up. Its a bitch to play at times, but now when I lose, it's only due to Victory Points from Objectives, and only against Eldar who can jump 48" across the board at the end of the last turn to contest my held objectives. (I dont visit my LGS a lot anymore due to the animosity, and Im playing an Eldar friend while the other is finishing his Tyranids)

I wish they would put a warning label on the GK codex to warn people about the inherent grief that comes with owning the army.

I still would have bought it though.

you don't appear to be playing psy-spam so i am thinking your friends are the problem. I have a friend that whines my armies are too good even when he wins. There are always going to be people that just bitch to hear their thoughts aloud.

whipthorn wrote:


I wish they would put a warning label on the GK codex to warn people about the inherent grief that comes with owning the army.

They do, it says: "By Matthew Ward"