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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2012/10/31 13:26:51
Subject: Need help defeating Space Marines with Missile Launchers and Plasma Cannons
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Nurgle Predator Driver with an Infestation
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Okay so here is what I have in my army:
HQ:
Daemon Prince: Wings, Power Armour, Axe of Blinding Fury, Daemon of Khorne
Kharn the Betrayer
Troops:
Chaos Space Marine
(these are moot because I am going to be using 35 Cultists with 3 flamers and Mark of Khorne once they are all painted)
Elite:
6x Khorne Berzerkers: All Chain Axes, Icon of Wraith, champion has power fist, combi-melta, gift of mutation
Terminators: Reaper Autocannon, combi-melta, -plasma, -bolter, Mark of Nurgle, Icon of Despair, Champion has Power fist
1x Helbrute: Power fist and Multi-Melta
Fast Attack:
5x Raptors: 2 flamers, Mark of Khorne, Icon of Wraith. Champion with pair of lightning clawas and gift of mutation
Heavy Support:
7x Havocs: 2 Missile launcher, 2 LasCannons, Mark of Tzeentch, Icon of Flame. Champion has Power Fist and bolt gun
2x Rhinos: Berzerker transport and CSM transport
Now I know most of these unit are not maxed out to their full potention, but I was getting destroyed by all his artillery fire. The Missile launchers and plasma cannons were tearing me apart. Anyone have any good tactic ideas or maybe army changes I should make. I'm thinking of adding Warp Talons and Plague Marines and a 3rd Rhino.
I also have another Helbrute and 10 Chaos Chosen from Dark Vengeance box, so they only come with certain gear.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2012/10/31 15:03:33
Subject: Need help defeating Space Marines with Missile Launchers and Plasma Cannons
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Jovial Plaguebearer of Nurgle
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Doesn't Kharn make berzerkers troops?
Warp talons are possibly helpful, but the fact that SM squads will only fail an initiative check 1/3rd of the time makes this unlikely.
I am assuming you are deep striking your terminators, if you can't deep strike them out of LOS of the plasma you will probably want to run the first turn rather than stay in the tight blast susceptible, formation.
Keep the raptors behind the rhinos so they dont get shot up.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2012/10/31 16:37:31
Subject: Re:Need help defeating Space Marines with Missile Launchers and Plasma Cannons
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Nurgle Predator Driver with an Infestation
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Yes, Kharn does make them troops, so they are my 2nd troop choice
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2012/10/31 16:45:18
Subject: Need help defeating Space Marines with Missile Launchers and Plasma Cannons
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Junior Officer with Laspistol
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I'm no expert on chaos, but looking at your list I immediately see huge weaknesses that I'd exploit. I don't know what your tactics are, but your list is pretty weak so it might cause you some problems.
1) Far too many points spent on CC based HQ choices. Take Khan or the Demon Prince, not both.
2) Not enough troops. Cultists wont fix that, you just don't have enough scoring units and so can easily be shot up to lose by default.
3) Not enough AV value. In 6th edition, I recommend going all out mech, or no mech. Hybrid lists tend to get eaten alive by glances.
There also seems to be silly points spent in places. Powerfist on Havocs? Is he really going to get the points back? Combi-melta on berzerkers? Are they ever going to shoot at a tank stopping them from charging infantry? There are other things like this that I'm sure chaos players would pick up on.
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Star Trek taught me so much. Like, how you should accept people, whether they be black, white, Klingon or even female...
FAQs |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2012/10/31 20:44:58
Subject: Need help defeating Space Marines with Missile Launchers and Plasma Cannons
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Gore-Soaked Lunatic Witchhunter
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Your biggest problem with this list is that it's entirely based on slow units that start on the ground, meaning that you have to slog through his fire to get anywhere you can be effective. Find a Dreadclaw pod if you have access to Forge World stuff, if you don't more Heldrakes, Raptors, and/or a Deep Strike contingent (Terminators/allied Daemons) would be helpful.
Make sure you try and make the terrain reasonable, too. I have a couple of friends who were stuck being unable to scratch a Tau army since they didn't use any terrain and had to walk through a ridiculous amount of firepower to accomplish anything.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2012/11/01 18:47:05
Subject: Re:Need help defeating Space Marines with Missile Launchers and Plasma Cannons
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Nurgle Predator Driver with an Infestation
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I usually don't deepstrike my terminators in because there are no more personal icons, and I don't want them to mishap. I am going to add some warp talons and probably either make them 10man squad or add 10 more to my raptors. I am going to look into allied daemons for deep strike as well.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2012/11/01 20:57:54
Subject: Re:Need help defeating Space Marines with Missile Launchers and Plasma Cannons
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Malicious Mutant Scum
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you got alot of points dumped into useless upgrades (or less competitive upgrades) cut the icon of despair, the mark tzeentch and icon and stuff it doesnt do anything helpfull
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2012/11/01 20:58:22
Dream Crush |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2012/11/03 02:35:15
Subject: Need help defeating Space Marines with Missile Launchers and Plasma Cannons
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Regular Dakkanaut
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There is little reason to go with Khonre with Axe of Fury with the Daemon Prince. He does not really need the extra attacks from Rage, and the loss of 1 WS means that suddenly people hit you at 4+ in melee, instead of 5+. The axe is GREAT for a Chaos lord, but for a a DP it's a liability.
The Black Mace is a much better choice, since it gets a ton of attacks but also wrecks hordes with it's toughness test wounds, and most importantly, you can add the much more useful mark of Tzeenech or Nurgle, to make the daemon more survivable in shooting phase. Remember that MC's attacks are always AP2, so the Black Mace's weakness is negated.
Also, more troops is good. You can do ok with three, but you might want to add some more bezerkers in that squad. Ideally, you want 4 troops at 1500. By NO means should you ever drop that CSM squad for a squad of Cultists, run them both, along with the bezerkers. If you only run two troops in 1500pts, you'll lose simply because you can't capture enough objectives.
Finally, terminators are much better as deep strikers, like many people say. Give 4 of em combi-meltas, a chain fist, power axes and a heavy flamer, and they can take out or severely damage valuable units on the turn they deep strike, and then propably survive the charge to kill the occupants. Drop the icon and switch them to Tzeemech for better results tough. Since they are not 2 wound units, a better invl is much more useful that T5. Chaos termies can be ok as footslogging bodyguard units for a lord, but they generally dont have a really good firepower/cost ratio, so they dont really work as tough shooters. That's what Obliterators are for.
Other than that, I would probably drop the Havok Power Fist or something to upgrade those missile launchers to Lascannons, simply because they are fairly cheap for chaos, and that +1S +1AP really add up. You should not be using them against troops anyways, and you'll definitely should never be in melee.
Generally, you seem to have a LOT of largely useless upgrades. You dont really need all chainaxes, unless you are tailor listing against Eldar or something. Even then its overkill. Against Space Marine armies they are useless.
Also, an interesting tip, try replacing the dual LCs on the Raptor Champ with a power fist and LC... the LC still gets the +1A since they are both specialist weapons, but now you can switch to powerfists after the inevitable duel to slaughter the rest of the squad, or have a shot against tanks and terminators. Again though, there are way too few bodies in that squad. Remember the champion does not really participate in combat first round, since he's dueling, so you dont get to slaughter the opponent's squad on the charge. Either given them more bodies, or make them a cheap suicide unit, at which point you might wanna switch the champ to a cheap Power Sword.
Finally, in an all comers list, you'll want to replace most of those flamers with meltaguns, as you have very little antitank, though against your specific enemy this might be less of an issue.
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2000pts Mech
1000pts Daemonzilla
1500pts Kan Wall
1500pts Driegowing |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2012/11/03 02:50:38
Subject: Re:Need help defeating Space Marines with Missile Launchers and Plasma Cannons
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Battleship Captain
Oregon
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Bodies before upgrades.
And PLEASE remove MoTz from the havocs unless its on there for fluff reasons. A 6++ for a unit that should always be in cover if not behind an aegis line is a waste. MoTz is best used on models that have an innate inv save.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2012/11/04 20:59:07
Subject: Re:Need help defeating Space Marines with Missile Launchers and Plasma Cannons
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Nurgle Predator Driver with an Infestation
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Quick question on berzerkers and Kharne, if I bring another squad of berzerkers that kharne is not part of do they still count as troops?
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2012/11/04 21:32:29
Subject: Need help defeating Space Marines with Missile Launchers and Plasma Cannons
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Lord of the Fleet
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Yes, any unit of Berzekers is a Troops choice if the army contains Kharn. Apart from that I don't get at all why you have MoT and Icon of Flame on your Havocs. A 6++ is absolute jack on units which should be in cover, and none of the weapons in the unit bar the Champion's Boltgun can be affected by the IoF.
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