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I'm not 100% but I thought at one point I had read something about a SM Chapters that had taken so many combat losses that the survivors were absorbed into another chapter to quickly reinforce them.

Is there a fluff precedent for this or am I just making this up?

I know this would happen with Imperial Guard, not too sure about marines though. I guess it could happen.

Not that I know of. The Crimson Fists didn't get absorbed anyways

I would think it would depend on their lineage. For example they arent going to merge away one of the original nine even if there is only a couple members left. But a lesser chapter could probably be merged back into a chapter from the same lineage

I could see the High Lords asking a particularly hurt Chapter to become the training cadre for a new founding. Say they are less than Company strength and rebuilding would take centuries, makes sense to let them be useful instead. You'd also need assign the new Chapter less resources if the old guys still have a stocked armory.

I'm not sure about fluff or being absorbed but I know that if they are unable to retrieve the geneseed they are unable to refill their numbers. eventually it could make the chapter dwendle.

There's a bit of fluff in The First Heretic that points to the fact that the Ultramarines "absorbed" the remnants of the II and XI Legions after the death/betrayal/heresy of their Primarchs. This is quite possibly why the Ultramarines were such a massive Legion compared to the others.

It would make sense that it would happen. If a Chapter was reduced to numbers as low as one company and they were, for whatever reason, unable to build back numbers it would be pointless for them to carry on.

The crimson fists were just barely over company strength after the oopsies with the fortress monastary. (it still cracks me up that almost an entire chapter of the emperors finest could be killed off by one booboo with a missile).

Deathwatch in that case. The question is how few Space Marines does it takes before critical mass is reached? I guess under 50.

I know the Blood Angels in James Swallow's books are getting a tithe from successor Chapters to replenish their numbers after massive losses.

If anything, they'd have to share a Founding. But it's probably more likely if there's too few (and no means of replenishing their numbers), they'd go on one last crusade, to the last man. It feels like what they'd do.

So what about a situation like this.

Following the events of the Badab war, the High Lords of Terra become concerned with the ramifications of having a chapter like the Carcharodons on the loose. A chapter with almost no records that operates beyond the scope of the Imperium with the potential to show up just about anywhere with little to know warning.

In an effort to instill a more codex adherent influence as well as introduce a known element within their ranks, the High Lords have decreed that the Carcharodons are to take on the remains of a chapter devastated by heavy combat in defence of the Imperium. Note we're talking about 40 to 50 marines left and no spaceships or vehicles of any kind.

Would that be a plausible scenario?

I'm not sure, maybe if it is a chapter from the same geneseed-originators, but mostly I would go for Deathwatch, since that seems to be the graveyard of chapters going down and losing everything.

it is definitly possable, although very unlikely.

Most of the time, a remnant chapter will join the Deathwatch as Blackshields. Or die in a heroic last stand.

CrowSplat wrote:
So what about a situation like this.

Following the events of the Badab war, the High Lords of Terra become concerned with the ramifications of having a chapter like the Carcharodons on the loose. A chapter with almost no records that operates beyond the scope of the Imperium with the potential to show up just about anywhere with little to know warning.

In an effort to instill a more codex adherent influence as well as introduce a known element within their ranks, the High Lords have decreed that the Carcharodons are to take on the remains of a chapter devastated by heavy combat in defence of the Imperium. Note we're talking about 40 to 50 marines left and no spaceships or vehicles of any kind.

Would that be a plausible scenario?

Pretty sure the Carcharodons would just point blank ignore such a decree.

The Astral Claws absorbed the remnants of the Tiger Claws, one of their own descendant chapters. They weren't actually meant to though - they did it on the hush-hush.

I am ninety percent sure I have read of other chapters that are essentially functionally extinct due to inability to restore geneseed enough to rebuild a chapter merging with other chapters, or at least joining with them in operational terms, although not necessarily repainting armour, adopting the other chpater's rules etc...

Another very likely option is to join the Deathwatch.

Some chapters just gradually become extinct or go out in a blaze of glory...

I wouldn't involve the Carcharadons. They have established fluff and something like this would potentially step on the fluffs toes.

Plus the Decree from the High Lords is 100% implausable. They would never have a matter of such specific material come to their attention. they have to organize great crusades. The fate of a single Chapter and the reckless nature of another are below their concern. And even if it wasn't, forcing a reckless chapter to absorb a remnant chapter because they are reckless makes about as much sense as me going to the Grocery Store because I need some red paint.

The High Lords are also involved in creating new chapters. I assume that was the point the OP was making. But the last three posters has soundly bashed it in that dying chapters in general ends up at the Deathwatch, or in a blaze of glory. Of course the High Lords is involved in the general running of the IOM. Which is much more than just war. It's all the boring boring stuff you don't wanna know anything about. Just think of this 7-8 guys is needed for every frontline soldier and that's just the military.

I don't know if I would go so far as to say half a dozen pages and one named personality is established fluff.

And maybe the High Lords are a bit too high up on the totem pole but an inquisitor might want to keep an eye on the situation.

Here they are at Lexicanum http://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/Space_Sharks#.UODxLXfJb5Q read an weep.

 Beaviz81 wrote:
Here they are at Lexicanum http://wh40k.lexicanum.com/wiki/Space_Sharks#.UODxLXfJb5Q read an weep.

Unconfirmed as the same chapter by any source. Although likely, still purely speculation.

If you ask advice and then disregard it, why ask advice?

I disregarded irrelevant information. The 40k community at large has widely accepted that the Carcharodons are an updated Space Shark chapter but the official fluff for the Carcharodons merely points to that as a theory.

Really we have gw's "forging the narrative" concept to thank. These things are left open so that players can run with the ideas they like and disregard the ones they don't.

You will also find that with 40k fluff, a strong implication is as good as confirmation. GW may as well have come out and said "For all those interested, the Space Sharks changed their name to The Characaradons"

Now you are free to disregard this, you should just put a disclaimer out there for your fluff if it is going against the grain of the generally accepted narrative.

Take a quick guess at what Characaradon mean in Latin. Edited - Mannahnin It's a chapter known by two names. Shark and Characaradon is the same. It's the bloody Latin name for the species.

Yes as cited in IA 10. Carcharadons Astra (High Gothic) and Space Sharks (Low Gothic) are just different ways of referring to the same chapter.
Basically the more recent publication updated the look, iconography, and known information on this chapter (as they have many others over time) and gave them a thick varnish of "Grimdark".

 thenoobbomb wrote:
Not that I know of. The Crimson Fists didn't get absorbed anyways

To expand on this, the lore of the Fists states there are only two options for them after nearly being wiped out. A suicide mission where they do as much damage to the enemies of man as they can before dying to the last man, or attempting to rebuild. It doesn't seem SM chapters get absorbed into others (barring the hints and what not about loyalists from the traitor legions forming the original cadres of some chapters like Blood Ravens or Gray Knights.)

 Darth Bob wrote:
There's a bit of fluff in The First Heretic that points to the fact that the Ultramarines "absorbed" the remnants of the II and XI Legions after the death/betrayal/heresy of their Primarchs. This is quite possibly why the Ultramarines were such a massive Legion compared to the others.

That's just Word Bearers making excuses. The Ultramarines have been stated outright to have the best recruitment and training, replenishing numbers and increasing ranks faster than any other legion, hence their enormous size. They also have the purest current stock of geneseed, which they wouldn't have if they were from three different Primarchs.

 Zakiriel wrote:
Yes as cited in IA 10. Carcharadons Astra (High Gothic) and Space Sharks (Low Gothic) are just different ways of referring to the same chapter.
Basically the more recent publication updated the look, iconography, and known information on this chapter (as they have many others over time) and gave them a thick varnish of "Grimdark".

Do you have a page reference where this is explicitly stated? The only thing I have seen was that it was suspected but not confirmed.

@LordofHats: Thanks for that information. That's pretty much what I was looking for.

I do not think they get adsorbed, they go out in a blaze of glory or rebuild.

@ Crowsplat

As requested I have the reference from IA10. Page 13 Blood in the Dark Waters

They Identified their chapter as that of the Carcharodon Astra, using the ancient form (or Space Sharks to give their name a more modern rendition in Low Gothic), and formally requested their acceptance and permission to enter the war zone and draw blood.