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I tried to put all the information in the title. My FLGS is starting an escalation league for fantasy, and I figured I'd join it. I've been playing 40k for years, but I haven't learned to play fantasy until now. Well, I haven't learned to play fantasy yet. I have a battalion box of lizardmen and I'm getting ready to assemble them, and I'm wondering if I should assemble the saurus warriors with spears or not? 1 point per model, lets me attack with an extra rank on turns I didnt charge. Is this worth it? I guess there's no reason to buy spears for the guys in the front rank? Thanks for taking the time to read this and help a fantasy beginner

Ehh spears are sort of ok on saurus, but sword and board makes them harder to crack with a nifty wardsave

And weapon upgrades are for the whole regiment

Yeah, you can't buy spears for only part of them. I don't think they are worth trading a shield for, esp if you have to pay for it.

I'm looking at the rulebook entry for spear, and it doesnt say anything about being 2 handed... can I not use a spear and a shield? or is the wardsave gotten some other way? In the lizardman codex it just says "additional equipment - spear - 1 pt per model", it doesn't say I have to exchange the shield for it.

And my second question. How should I organize 20 saurus? 4 ranks of 5, 2 ranks of 10? pros and cons? Yeah sorry for the noob questions, I'm still trying to get a grasp on things that are different from 40k.

Hand Weapon+Shield=Parry Save

Gives you a +6 Ward save in CC. Even high S attacks wont budge that save

For 20, I'd say go for ranks of 5-6 models. 10 model wide is only for hordes which requires 30 or more models

You have to read a bit earlier in the BRB on Hand Weapons and Shields.

You only get that parry bonus if you're using that combination. If you're using a "Special Weapon" you have to use that. A spear is a special weapon (cuz it's not a hand weapon). You get the armor bonus. You don't get the parry save.

A 6+ ward is still something. Not only that but spears cost nearly 10% more for the unit.

It's not terrible either way. They are a little killier with spears, and big groups of them, they are more defensive with shields and cheaper.

With 20 saurus, 5 wide gives you 20 attacks, and 5 ablative wounds. I liked 24 better, 6 wide.
Or 18 wide without spears.

The 6+ parry is nice, but you don't get it against impact hits, stomps or breathe, so it's not as good as a real ward save.

-Matt

thanks for the replies everybody. I'll go read the rulebook before I ask too many questions.

HawaiiMatt, why would you want to take a unit 18 wide? a lot of them wont be able to attack?

 Phragonist wrote:
thanks for the replies everybody. I'll go read the rulebook before I ask too many questions.

HawaiiMatt, why would you want to take a unit 18 wide? a lot of them wont be able to attack?

Lizardmen have 25mm bases. Most armies use 20mm bases and run in ranks of 5. 6 25mm models per rank will therefore assure you the maximum possible numbers of attacks vs. the average enemy unit.Vs. other 25mm armies, you still run the basic number of models in the first rank aka 5.

Spears can be good, but hand weapon and shield may be morr worth it. Parry save, and scaly skin is damn good, and can be tough to fight for average strength enemies.

I see a lot of 6x4 blocks. Run them side by side with some cold one cavalry. Running a unit 18 wide is a bad idea. Even 10 wide is a stretch for many, unless its a horde based army, or a simply is utilizing a horde unit, which Lizardmen do not need. That mnay wide means more of your infantry will be chargable by multiple enemy units, and you will get markedly less attacks and more deaths.

When you up the points level you will likely want to go 40 sword n shield w slann flanked by 2 units of skink n krok or 2 units of 20 saurus spearman 5 by 4, skink squads and you really really want salamanders. They are amazinggggggg!!!!

Next question about the battalion. Should I assemble skinks with blowpipes or javelins? and why?

 Phragonist wrote:
thanks for the replies everybody. I'll go read the rulebook before I ask too many questions.

HawaiiMatt, why would you want to take a unit 18 wide? a lot of them wont be able to attack?

I meant unit of 18, 6 wide 3 deep.

-Matt

 Phragonist wrote:
Should I assemble skinks with blowpipes or javelins? and why?

I like blowpipes, so many shots

Though you'll be hitting on 7's sometimes

Spears in general arn't a good choice in Fantasy at the moment. On Saurus they arn't too bad due to Saurus having Str4, I think all other spear units are str3 base.

Durability is the most important thing for an infantry unit, and spears reduce that by taking away parry saves.


In the grand scheme, Saurus can really be armed to your personal taste IMO. Lizardmen have access to plenty of nice magic to make Saurus more durable, the loss of parry isn't huge compared to that.

I have both Saurus armed with spears and Saurus armed with hand weapon/shield, and the majority of the time I just prefer the hand weapon/shield. There are times the spears are better, but in general I think hand weapon/shield will come in more handy, especially at saving points.

Skinks with blowguns are awesome. Especially as a starting Lizardmen player, I would definitely go that route.

Personally I think you are better off with the sword and shield combo a majority of the time, due to the fact that you need to be charged in order to really get the full effect of the extra rank and with the Sword and shield combo, you have a slightly greater surivialibilty with the 6+ Parry save. Also it kind of hinders their movement a little if you keep them at a slow crawl, and with Saurus you really need to keep grinding and try to be the first one to charge in order to deny the opponents charge bonuses that they would get (But still sad that you most likely will always be striking last, even before Dwarves and Skeletons due to I1). Other than that, stick with the Sword and Shield Combo, I have units last much longer in games because of it.

And I have to say you did pick a good army to play. LIzardmen have the best infantry in terms of large blocks, the Saurus, although they are not as good as a Chaos Warrior point-for-point, you can field a lot more of Saurus and get a large block of them as I stated before, which is their major strength. And with their Cold-Blooded Rule, you are at most making your Leadership a good Majority of the time.

Sorry to get off topic a bit, but I wanted to help you the best I can since you are starting this army.

thanks for the info everybody. much appreciated