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k

That time of week again?

OK, you automatically have copyright over any of your own IP. You need to signify this on the work.
I would also seriously consider keeping a constant check on where you are at the moment. Consider it like a baby. You create it and develop it, occasionally looking to the future but mostly in the present. Too many people have this idea, then ask for all of this help with very little to base it off of so that after a few days, nothing happens.
Develop your own rules, as it is very unlikely anybody will pick it up. In addition, get a base before moving on to stuff such as models, art, etc.

Also, small skirmishes are most definitely not unique.

 Midnightdeathblade wrote:
Hey Dakka. I have been designing rules for a 28mm tabletop miniatures game for the past couple months. I've never done this before, so I have no clue as to how I can get it rolling. I dont want to go to much in detail (for as far as i can see, this sci-fi genre hasnt been converted into a minis game yet) but it is a small scaled, squad based combat game. Multiple alien races with special rules to each one. You can outfit your squad with various weponry and armors, and even do a multi race squad. My idea was that each model would be sold in a single pack (plastic) with a ton of extra weapons, armor, equipment in with it to customize the model further. (kinda like the SM captain, but with many more options) I would like to be able to get this rolling soon. But I need permission from a company, and I need a manufacturer/destributor that would be interested. (need some names here). Honestly, I think this would be very popular with at least 50% on the gaming community. But before I can get anything set in stone, I need a plan.

To sum up my questions:
-How should I go about getting permission for a popular video game company?
-If im not going to manufacture and distribute the models myself, what are some good companies to ask?
-How can I protect my interests if I submit my ideas to another company?
-Should I continue to develope rules, or should I leave that to a gaming company?
-Does this small scale game interest anyone without furhter info at the moment?

-How should I go about getting permission for a popular video game company?
Check out their website and see if there is a "legal" or "media" or other such link at the bottom of the page in very small writing to avoid any tom/dick or harry using it - this is usually a good place to start but don't expect to get permission on the cheap - particularly if it's a popular game which your post implies it is

-If im not going to manufacture and distribute the models myself, what are some good companies to ask?
You can good search some castors, you'll find plenty easily enough though these tend to be resin/metal rather than plastic. Honestly, unless you have loads of spare cash resin is the way to go as selling anything less than (and my information is roungh and most likely out of date) 10,000 units then Plastic is significantly more expensive.
As for distribution, you could contact some stores and see if they wish to stock it. you could also look for some whiolesalers who tend to have their own websites too and see if they want to distribute your idea

-How can I protect my interests if I submit my ideas to another company?
If your licencing the game from a computer game company it isn;t your idea, but it would be protected by them anyway so this isn't an issue.

-Should I continue to develope rules, or should I leave that to a gaming company?
It's your game, you develop the rules. I doubt a Computer company has any idea how to make a tabletop game work. Continue developing the rules if ther is a possbility to move the game outside the existing universe if they say no (and the most likely will) otherwise best to wait for now.

-Does this small scale game interest anyone without furhter info at the moment?
At the moment no - but then I know nothing about it other than it's based on a scifi computer game, there are plenty of scifi games around already.

I will say that, if I accepted everything you have put then you don;t want to make/market/distribute or come up with the rules for your game, so what exactly is your imput to this other than "wow, xxxx would make a great tabletop game"?

I don;t mean to snap your head off, but you need to think about what you bring to the table, from your first post I'm really not sure what it is that you yourself are doing in this "game".

Stranger83 wrote:

 Midnightdeathblade wrote:
Hey Dakka. I have been designing rules for a 28mm tabletop miniatures game for the past couple months. I've never done this before, so I have no clue as to how I can get it rolling. I dont want to go to much in detail (for as far as i can see, this sci-fi genre hasnt been converted into a minis game yet) but it is a small scaled, squad based combat game. Multiple alien races with special rules to each one. You can outfit your squad with various weponry and armors, and even do a multi race squad. My idea was that each model would be sold in a single pack (plastic) with a ton of extra weapons, armor, equipment in with it to customize the model further. (kinda like the SM captain, but with many more options) I would like to be able to get this rolling soon. But I need permission from a company, and I need a manufacturer/destributor that would be interested. (need some names here). Honestly, I think this would be very popular with at least 50% on the gaming community. But before I can get anything set in stone, I need a plan.

To sum up my questions:
-How should I go about getting permission for a popular video game company?
-If im not going to manufacture and distribute the models myself, what are some good companies to ask?
-How can I protect my interests if I submit my ideas to another company?
-Should I continue to develope rules, or should I leave that to a gaming company?
-Does this small scale game interest anyone without furhter info at the moment?

-How should I go about getting permission for a popular video game company?
Check out their website and see if there is a "legal" or "media" or other such link at the bottom of the page in very small writing to avoid any tom/dick or harry using it - this is usually a good place to start but don't expect to get permission on the cheap - particularly if it's a popular game which your post implies it is

-If im not going to manufacture and distribute the models myself, what are some good companies to ask?
You can good search some castors, you'll find plenty easily enough though these tend to be resin/metal rather than plastic. Honestly, unless you have loads of spare cash resin is the way to go as selling anything less than (and my information is roungh and most likely out of date) 10,000 units then Plastic is significantly more expensive.

-How can I protect my interests if I submit my ideas to another company?
If your licencing the game from a computer game company it isn;t your idea, but it would be protected by them anyway so this isn't an issue.

-Should I continue to develope rules, or should I leave that to a gaming company?
It's your game, you develop the rules. I doubt a Computer company has any idea how to make a tabletop game work. Continue developing the rules if ther is a possbility to move the game outside the existing universe if they say no (and the most likely will) otherwise best to wait for now.

-Does this small scale game interest anyone without furhter info at the moment?
At the moment no - but then I know nothing about it other than it's based on a scifi computer game, there are plenty of scifi games around already.

Automatically Appended Next Post:
-Should I continue to develope rules, or should I leave that to a gaming company?
It's your game, you develop the rules. I doubt a Computer company has any idea how to make a tabletop game work. Continue developing the rules if ther is a possbility to move the game outside the existing universe if they say no (and the most likely will) otherwise best to wait for now.


I ment a minitaure gaming company, my bad.

 Midnightdeathblade wrote:

Stranger83 wrote:

 Midnightdeathblade wrote:
Hey Dakka. I have been designing rules for a 28mm tabletop miniatures game for the past couple months. I've never done this before, so I have no clue as to how I can get it rolling. I dont want to go to much in detail (for as far as i can see, this sci-fi genre hasnt been converted into a minis game yet) but it is a small scaled, squad based combat game. Multiple alien races with special rules to each one. You can outfit your squad with various weponry and armors, and even do a multi race squad. My idea was that each model would be sold in a single pack (plastic) with a ton of extra weapons, armor, equipment in with it to customize the model further. (kinda like the SM captain, but with many more options) I would like to be able to get this rolling soon. But I need permission from a company, and I need a manufacturer/destributor that would be interested. (need some names here). Honestly, I think this would be very popular with at least 50% on the gaming community. But before I can get anything set in stone, I need a plan.

To sum up my questions:
-How should I go about getting permission for a popular video game company?
-If im not going to manufacture and distribute the models myself, what are some good companies to ask?
-How can I protect my interests if I submit my ideas to another company?
-Should I continue to develope rules, or should I leave that to a gaming company?
-Does this small scale game interest anyone without furhter info at the moment?

-How should I go about getting permission for a popular video game company?
Check out their website and see if there is a "legal" or "media" or other such link at the bottom of the page in very small writing to avoid any tom/dick or harry using it - this is usually a good place to start but don't expect to get permission on the cheap - particularly if it's a popular game which your post implies it is

-If im not going to manufacture and distribute the models myself, what are some good companies to ask?
You can good search some castors, you'll find plenty easily enough though these tend to be resin/metal rather than plastic. Honestly, unless you have loads of spare cash resin is the way to go as selling anything less than (and my information is roungh and most likely out of date) 10,000 units then Plastic is significantly more expensive.

-How can I protect my interests if I submit my ideas to another company?
If your licencing the game from a computer game company it isn;t your idea, but it would be protected by them anyway so this isn't an issue.

-Should I continue to develope rules, or should I leave that to a gaming company?
It's your game, you develop the rules. I doubt a Computer company has any idea how to make a tabletop game work. Continue developing the rules if ther is a possbility to move the game outside the existing universe if they say no (and the most likely will) otherwise best to wait for now.

-Does this small scale game interest anyone without furhter info at the moment?
At the moment no - but then I know nothing about it other than it's based on a scifi computer game, there are plenty of scifi games around already.

Automatically Appended Next Post:
-Should I continue to develope rules, or should I leave that to a gaming company?
It's your game, you develop the rules. I doubt a Computer company has any idea how to make a tabletop game work. Continue developing the rules if ther is a possbility to move the game outside the existing universe if they say no (and the most likely will) otherwise best to wait for now.


I ment a minitaure gaming company, my bad.

Miniature gaming company? So they already make the tabletop game themselves?

Are you saying that it's a company that make miniatures but don't have a game/back story to it? In that case you might have more luck as you essentially arn't using their IP, your just saying "we recommend you use these models" which would give them extra custom too. If they have their own game/universe then how is your game any different to what already exists - your first post implied that this was unique.

 Midnightdeathblade wrote:
Hey Dakka. I have been designing rules for a 28mm tabletop miniatures game for the past couple months. I've never done this before, so I have no clue as to how I can get it rolling. I dont want to go to much in detail (for as far as i can see, this sci-fi genre hasnt been converted into a minis game yet) but it is a small scaled, squad based combat game. Multiple alien races with special rules to each one. You can outfit your squad with various weponry and armors, and even do a multi race squad. My idea was that each model would be sold in a single pack (plastic) with a ton of extra weapons, armor, equipment in with it to customize the model further. (kinda like the SM captain, but with many more options) I would like to be able to get this rolling soon. But I need permission from a company, and I need a manufacturer/destributor that would be interested. (need some names here). Honestly, I think this would be very popular with at least 50% on the gaming community. But before I can get anything set in stone, I need a plan.

To sum up my questions:
-How should I go about getting permission for a popular video game company?
-If im not going to manufacture and distribute the models myself, what are some good companies to ask?
-How can I protect my interests if I submit my ideas to another company?
-Should I continue to develope rules, or should I leave that to a gaming company?
-Does this small scale game interest anyone without furhter info at the moment?

I'll answer your fifth question.

No one will pick up a broad idea of your rules. Miniature wargames are small companies (even good o' GW is a small-ish company) and won't have the power to push the idea of a game. They're not like book publishers. Develop the game and see what you can do with it.

Basically, make the game you want to make. With my wargame, it's still in the beginning stages, but it's look more and more like a game that I would love.

BlapBlapBlap wrote:That time of week again?

>_< Yes, yes it is...


So OP, I don't think Bioware is going to give you the rights to make a game in the Mass Effect Universe, BUT game design advice is always helpful.

Midnightdeathblade wrote:To sum up my questions
-How should I go about getting permission for a popular video game company?

Contact said video game company, most of them have home offices somewhere in the world, and many of the larger companies have contact us pages. If you're doing Mass Effect, you'll want to contact them here (Note I'm only assuming Bioware, because out of the "famous sci-fi video games" on the market that don't have minis for the most part, Mass Effect is the only one that fits into the Op's idea.

-If im not going to manufacture and distribute the models myself, what are some good companies to ask?

This I can't help you with, most of the companies to in-house model production and I can't think of any company that does production for other people.

-How can I protect my interests if I submit my ideas to another company?

Publish the rules in some manner. If you can get the rules out in some format, no one can claim it as theirs because you have a proven date and time stamped on to that ruleset. Also you probably would want to "re-create" the races, special abilities, and equipment names if you're currently using a company's IP as the details for your game, since they could push around a little bit of weight and get you into some legal trouble. If you go to them with a skeleton that can have their stuff skinned on top of it, they might be more receptive to the idea AND they don't have much legal recourse for IP violations.

-Should I continue to develope rules, or should I leave that to a gaming company?

Continue to develop the rules until you get things sold. There's no point in stopping development if you want to get this game made, unless of course you're in it for a cash grab.

-Does this small scale game interest anyone without furhter info at the moment?

Absolutely not, small scale skirmish games are a dime a dozen. If you never set foot out of GW, you may not know this, but there is a skirmish game for everyone to satisfy their itch, unless you can provide something interesting about the game, then I've got no interest.


Now OP, I have some questions for you...

1 - Why do you want to make this game, and be brutally honest here?

2 - Why should we have another small scale skirmish game in an already flooded market? What does your game bring to the table that other games don't? And don't say the fluff and background, because you don't own that.

3 - Have you done any playtesting on this? Are you willing to let people playtest the rules? Even if they're in Beta, everything can be tweaked and tested and perfected, this is why games come out with new editions, errata, and faqs.

4 - Are you open to constructive criticism and being able to handle dealing with people that might be verbally trashing what you've done?

5 - What will you do if the game company rejects your idea?

 Alfndrate wrote:

BlapBlapBlap wrote:That time of week again?

>_< Yes, yes it is...


So OP, I don't think Bioware is going to give you the rights to make a game in the Mass Effect Universe, BUT game design advice is always helpful.

Midnightdeathblade wrote:To sum up my questions
-How should I go about getting permission for a popular video game company?

Contact said video game company, most of them have home offices somewhere in the world, and many of the larger companies have contact us pages. If you're doing Mass Effect, you'll want to contact them here (Note I'm only assuming Bioware, because out of the "famous sci-fi video games" on the market that don't have minis for the most part, Mass Effect is the only one that fits into the Op's idea.

-If im not going to manufacture and distribute the models myself, what are some good companies to ask?

This I can't help you with, most of the companies to in-house model production and I can't think of any company that does production for other people.

-How can I protect my interests if I submit my ideas to another company?

Publish the rules in some manner. If you can get the rules out in some format, no one can claim it as theirs because you have a proven date and time stamped on to that ruleset. Also you probably would want to "re-create" the races, special abilities, and equipment names if you're currently using a company's IP as the details for your game, since they could push around a little bit of weight and get you into some legal trouble. If you go to them with a skeleton that can have their stuff skinned on top of it, they might be more receptive to the idea AND they don't have much legal recourse for IP violations.

-Should I continue to develope rules, or should I leave that to a gaming company?

Continue to develop the rules until you get things sold. There's no point in stopping development if you want to get this game made, unless of course you're in it for a cash grab.

-Does this small scale game interest anyone without furhter info at the moment?

Absolutely not, small scale skirmish games are a dime a dozen. If you never set foot out of GW, you may not know this, but there is a skirmish game for everyone to satisfy their itch, unless you can provide something interesting about the game, then I've got no interest.


Now OP, I have some questions for you...

1 - Why do you want to make this game, and be brutally honest here?

2 - Why should we have another small scale skirmish game in an already flooded market? What does your game bring to the table that other games don't? And don't say the fluff and background, because you don't own that.

3 - Have you done any playtesting on this? Are you willing to let people playtest the rules? Even if they're in Beta, everything can be tweaked and tested and perfected, this is why games come out with new editions, errata, and faqs.

4 - Are you open to constructive criticism and being able to handle dealing with people that might be verbally trashing what you've done?

5 - What will you do if the game company rejects your idea?

1 - Why do you want to make this game, and be brutally honest here?
This, probably the most important question. I too am working on my own game, have been for awhile now and almost at a stage to start letting the general public know more about it. For me it started from a short story I wrote, which evolved into a larger story, which evolved into a whole world and after a while I thought "this world would make a good game" so I started to make one and found the whole process hugely entertaining. The game is pretty much a combination of everything I like in other games with the stuff I don't like taken out - even if the game is a massive flop I'll still have a game that I love (and the few friends I've had playtest it with me) So my answer to this question would be "because I loved the universe that I built for it" If your answer here is "because I want to make some money" then designing your own game might not be for you.

Wow, I guess I really havent thought this through very much. I think I need to start from scratch and try making something really unique. Or my best attempt to. I wasnt aware there were so many small scale skirmish games on the market.

 Midnightdeathblade wrote:
Wow, I guess I really havent thought this through very much. I think I need to start from scratch and try making something really unique. Or my best attempt to. I wasnt aware there were so many small scale skirmish games on the market.

O.o

You need to venture down to the various other game boards down past the Warmchine boards, tons of small scale games!

Don't be so quick to discount licensing existing properties. It isn't nearly as hard as one might think (look to other small companies playing with big IP like Predastore and Knight Models).

One of the more difficult things is figuring out who to actually talk to regarding a potential license. The owner is often not always obvious, as there are a lot of intricacies between developers, publishers and creators which can take some time to sort through. Also, keep in mind that a license will often be limited. Marvel, for example licenses out to dozens of different companies to create things like board games, video games, miniature games and all the rest. Since they have little specific investment - provided you don't dump on their setting by attempting to write your own changes into it - the terms can be quite agreeable (10% of a sale is better than 100% of no product at all after all).

Following that, jumping right into plastics with no background is probably the wrong way to go. You can work with various contractors to do things like art, design, tooling, manufacture and distribution - but in order to do that and not get buried under everything, you need a working knowledge of how things are done and a significantly large pile of money which you can burn through for the initial release of figures.

Metal and resin are significantly easier to get working in. Again, you will have many of the same moving parts as you would with plastic - but the initial outlay is significantly less (one metal mold for plastic production would be able to pay for an full line in plastic or resin). The specifics of who to deal with will vary, different companies do different parts. Generally you would be dealing with freelance sculptors and artists initially. Contract casters are fairly common as well - though you will want to schedule with them if you are planning large releases as they often have several clients...with some of them paying real money. I would recommend dealing with distribution in house...at least initially. You can generally "warehouse" in a garage or spare room and ship to distributors or direct to customers after hours.

Not sure which ideas you would be talking about protecting when talking to other companies. Original work will be protected, you can help to prevent "leaked" information from artists with an NDA - though there is little use in the IMO, as the noise it generates is always good for business. If you are talking about something more abstract...unfortunately, there isn't much to protect there. Not sure what you are looking at, but saying "Wouldn't it be cool if there was a Everquest Wargame?" isn't really protectable, as there are probably dozens of people who have said the own thing...including many of the developers.

So...the rules thing... Many computer games are actually built on the bones of PnP and tabletop games. If you look at their pedigrees and the underlying math calculations you find a lot of designers from regular game companies in the 80s and 90s were pressed into computer game development in the 90s and 00s. The process is the same, the only difference is that the computer can perform a hundred different calculations and comparisons without having to flip open a rulebook. With that in mind - they could develop the rules if they wanted to. Most companies have no interest in developing PnP or tabletop games though as the market size isn't significant enough for it to be worth their effort. So - yes, continue to develop your rules...in reality that is what you seem to be bringing to the table. Even if you don't use a licensed property, the rules can be used with generic figures and generic themes or you can create your own universe.

Does it interest me? No - not really. Not so much because your game wouldn't be interesting...but rather because there is no there there. We have no clue what you are planning on licensing, how you are doing your rules, what scale, how the miniatures will look... As others have said there are 100s of rules available with many thousands that have gone out of print during the course of gaming history. Many of those are quite excellent already, so you will need to find a way to set your product apart. Otherwise there isn't anything for people to bite into and chew on.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Midnightdeathblade wrote:
Wow, I guess I really havent thought this through very much. I think I need to start from scratch and try making something really unique. Or my best attempt to. I wasnt aware there were so many small scale skirmish games on the market.

http://www.wargamevault.com/

So i should post some rules?

 Midnightdeathblade wrote:
So i should post some rules?

Entirely up to you...

Stranger83 wrote:


1 - Why do you want to make this game, and be brutally honest here?
This, probably the most important question. I too am working on my own game, have been for awhile now and almost at a stage to start letting the general public know more about it. For me it started from a short story I wrote, which evolved into a larger story, which evolved into a whole world and after a while I thought "this world would make a good game" so I started to make one and found the whole process hugely entertaining. The game is pretty much a combination of everything I like in other games with the stuff I don't like taken out - even if the game is a massive flop I'll still have a game that I love (and the few friends I've had playtest it with me) So my answer to this question would be "because I loved the universe that I built for it" If your answer here is "because I want to make some money" then designing your own game might not be for you.

This exactly. This is by nature an intensely creative project. You have to love it, or it will crush your will, and even if you love it, it may crush your will anyhow. Developing a product and getting a business rolling is difficult and stressful, even if your livelihood is not dependent on it.

Back in college I developed a game, built it up, made a product out of it, and ran what was essentially a (very) small business that was constantly in the red. I did it because I loved it, because I was passionate about it, and because I wanted to share it with others.

I got great satisfaction out of the enjoyment that others had with what I created, but over the years there were times when I felt like it was a stone around my neck; when I hated it and wanted to get as far away from it as possible. And financially, it was wretched. Oh my God was it wretched . It was run not for profit (genius!) but we basically never met costs and I personally bankrolled the business.

I have no regrets about it, but I will never - do - it - again...ever, unless I was magically independently wealthy with nothing to do but find ways to fill my time, but there's the problem right? The practical realities are harsh.

In terms of advice, I would say that you should start by introducing the game to your friends. See how it goes. See how people like it. Have fun with it before you make a business out of it. In terms of models and casting, get in touch with people who sculpt or commission custom miniatures and/or do their own casting. Try it out with a few models. See how it goes. See what you think of the process before you make an emotional and financial investment you may regret.

I know Sean_Obrien does things like this pretty regularly. Sean, do you have any advice?

Edit: SEAN! Darnit, I really need to read the whole thread before I reply.

Those sorts of details might scare him off before he even gets started.

1. Put minis on table.

2. Make up rules as you go along.

3. Write them down. Alter them as you go along to reflect new situations.

4. Write them down, proof read and edit for clarity.

5. Playtest.

6. Give them to someone else to read. Have them make notes.

7. Have them playtest.

8. Edit some more.

9. You have now written a wargame.

What you do with it after that - illustrations, setting, miniatures, presentation, marketing - is up to you, your budget and your ambition. Quite a lot of games currently leading the market are highly imperfect, but sales are driven by a combination of miniatures lines and setting.

Discerning veterans tend to learn, eventually, that some of the very best games have neither, but will allow you to import the setting and miniatures from manufacturers that do that better than they do rules.

R.

 Midnightdeathblade wrote:
-How should I go about getting permission for a popular video game company?

Don't. Unless you already have an established reputation, a product ready to demonstrate, and a good business plan your chances of getting permission are nonexistent.

-If im not going to manufacture and distribute the models myself, what are some good companies to ask?

None of the above. If you're asking questions like this on a forum you don't have enough of a business plan to even consider asking to hire people to make models for you.

-How can I protect my interests if I submit my ideas to another company?

Get a lawyer who specializes in IP law.

-Should I continue to develope rules, or should I leave that to a gaming company?

If you aren't making the models and you aren't making the rules just what exactly are you doing?

-Does this small scale game interest anyone without furhter info at the moment?

Nope.