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With the slaanesh mark , the SG gains rending is this for melter and shooting attacks? This would obviously make its other weapons, or upgrades more valuable ie. phlegm with rending can take out terminators

Based on the rules wording for Rending (Warhammer 40,000 Rulebook, p. 41) its ranged attacks do not get Rending as the weapon profile lacks it. Specifically, see the second paragraph.

Tzeentch is correct, the rules state.

"If a model has the Rending special rule ... there is a chance that his close combat attacks will strike a critical blow" etc.

Having it on the model's profile only applies to melee attacks.

I.e. MoS on a SG is pointless

Not pointless, +3" run is a bonus

but it is near pointless.

 psyklone wrote:
I.e. MoS on a SG is pointless

You could pick similar things from the other Daemon variants and blast them the same, MoN on a SG is pointless because Slow and Purposeful is just a drawback for a unit that's already Relentless. MoT on a SG is pointless because they can't manifest psychic powers. MoK is pointless on a SG because he's not a chariot and doesn't get Hammer of Wrath hits, they all have things you wont benefit from at all times.

Some of the Daemons of X marks are certainly more useless than others. At least Daemon of Nurgle gives Shrouded, which can be quite useful if you can manage to obscure it in ruins or something (I doubt Aegis will work unless you model for advantage).

Daemon of Khorne - It's free and it can actually benefit from Furious Charge in emergencies.
Daemon of Tzeentch - Only benefits from the reroll saving throws of 1.
Daemon of Nurgle - Can benefit (in some cases, greatly) from Shrouded. Only disadvantage from Slow and Purposeful is not being able to fire Overwatch. Otherwise it actually is a even bigger positive if you use the Phlegm ordinance shot.
Daemon of Slaanesh - Benefits from the +3" run. That's it.

Actually if you run the Warp Sword on it, the rending could potentially be useful. (If for some reason you want it)

Mark of nurgle on it is very useful. I used it yesterday with a plague marine army as my daemon allies, and since the rhinos provided more then 25% coverage he had a 4+ cover save, combined with shrouded, my Soul grinder had a 2+


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Also had it combined with Phglem providing fire support.

zephel wrote:
Mark of nurgle on it is very useful. I used it yesterday with a plague marine army as my daemon allies, and since the rhinos provided more then 25% coverage he had a 4+ cover save, combined with shrouded, my Soul grinder had a 2+


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Also had it combined with Phglem providing fire support.

Cover for intervening models/units is a 5+ not a 4+. That still means that you can claim a 3+ save with your vehicle. Which is not too shabby.

Just to clear some stuff up. The warp sword gives you +1 attack you'd never actually use its profile as it has no benefit over the claw that you keep.

You also receive no benefit from furious charge as you will generally be S10. Unless your ccw gets blown off. But in 6th you are generally dead by then...

People seem to have missed the fact that the soulgrinder is no longer fleet, this is the main benefit of the Daemon of Slaanesh rule and the reason for its high cost.

Also the warpsword is master crafted so assuming you miss once with your weaponskill 3 to actually gives you +2 attacks when you use it instead of the claw, against marines and the like its just as deadly, also an extra weapon for the chart to target.
Not worth 25pts by any means but +2 attacks isn't awful for a walker.

TzeentchNet wrote:
Some of the Daemons of X marks are certainly more useless than others. At least Daemon of Nurgle gives Shrouded, which can be quite useful if you can manage to obscure it in ruins or something (I doubt Aegis will work unless you model for advantage).

Daemon of Khorne - It's free and it can actually benefit from Furious Charge in emergencies.
Daemon of Tzeentch - Only benefits from the reroll saving throws of 1.
Daemon of Nurgle - Can benefit (in some cases, greatly) from Shrouded. Only disadvantage from Slow and Purposeful is not being able to fire Overwatch. Otherwise it actually is a even bigger positive if you use the Phlegm ordinance shot.
Daemon of Slaanesh - Benefits from the +3" run. That's it.

Slaanesh also gives it Fleet.

 FlingitNow wrote:
Just to clear some stuff up. The warp sword gives you +1 attack you'd never actually use its profile as it has no benefit over the claw that you keep.

You also receive no benefit from furious charge as you will generally be S10. Unless your ccw gets blown off. But in 6th you are generally dead by then...

Iron Claw is a specialist weapon, so the only way to add +1 attacks to the Soul Grinder is take the Warpsword (also a specialist weapon, which must be used in pairs per the USR to gain the additional attack). The Warpsword is also master-crafted, so you are gaining a re-roll. With the Mark of Slaanesh, you gain rending on your CC attacks.

Jeff Tracy wrote:

 FlingitNow wrote:
Just to clear some stuff up. The warp sword gives you +1 attack you'd never actually use its profile as it has no benefit over the claw that you keep.

You also receive no benefit from furious charge as you will generally be S10. Unless your ccw gets blown off. But in 6th you are generally dead by then...

Iron Claw is a specialist weapon, so the only way to add +1 attacks to the Soul Grinder is take the Warpsword (also a specialist weapon, which must be used in pairs per the USR to gain the additional attack). The Warpsword is also master-crafted, so you are gaining a re-roll. With the Mark of Slaanesh, you gain rending on your CC attacks.

thats not true they have to be the same weapon like lighting claws

 ApostleofthPLague wrote:

Jeff Tracy wrote:

 FlingitNow wrote:
Just to clear some stuff up. The warp sword gives you +1 attack you'd never actually use its profile as it has no benefit over the claw that you keep.

You also receive no benefit from furious charge as you will generally be S10. Unless your ccw gets blown off. But in 6th you are generally dead by then...

Iron Claw is a specialist weapon, so the only way to add +1 attacks to the Soul Grinder is take the Warpsword (also a specialist weapon, which must be used in pairs per the USR to gain the additional attack). The Warpsword is also master-crafted, so you are gaining a re-roll. With the Mark of Slaanesh, you gain rending on your CC attacks.

thats not true they have to be the same weapon like lighting claws

That's not true. Read the rules for Specialist Weapons again. That changed going in to 6th.

 ApostleofthPLague wrote:
thats not true they have to be the same weapon like lighting claws

That's the last edition. Any two Specialist weapons will grant a bonus attack, they don't have to be the same, just both have to be Specialist.

that makes me happy thanks guys

I thought intervening models, en mass or just sticking a giant LR in front of, caused things to become obscured as if in terrain / being hid by a building =/

Ie having your SG hid behind a LR and several taller models like Forge Fiends.. Would that not make him obscured??

Probably, but you'd have to look yourself!

TzeentchNet wrote:
Some of the Daemons of X marks are certainly more useless than others. At least Daemon of Nurgle gives Shrouded, which can be quite useful if you can manage to obscure it in ruins or something (I doubt Aegis will work unless you model for advantage).

Daemon of Khorne - It's free and it can actually benefit from Furious Charge in emergencies.
Daemon of Tzeentch - Only benefits from the reroll saving throws of 1.
Daemon of Nurgle - Can benefit (in some cases, greatly) from Shrouded. Only disadvantage from Slow and Purposeful is not being able to fire Overwatch. Otherwise it actually is a even bigger positive if you use the Phlegm ordinance shot.
Daemon of Slaanesh - Benefits from the +3" run. That's it.

As has been mentioned Slaanesh gives you +3" run and fleet -meaning your average run is around 7" and fleet gives you re-rolls to charge

In addition Nurgle mark means no overwatch and no sweeping advance, so it takes away from the grinder in combat significantly.

Tzeentch is ok but at least it is cheap.

Khorne does very little, unless you lose your Powerfist Furious charge does nothing, but at least it is free.

Reroll Run as ewll, so your average Run is much higher than usual.

Reroll gives an average of 4.25 rather than 3.5 hardly massive difference the +3" makes the real difference. But MoN is too good not take. Soulgrinders with a 3+ or even a 2+ save are ridiculously good.

 psyklone wrote:
I.e. MoS on a SG is pointless

Yup, nurgle or go home.

FlingitNow wrote:Reroll gives an average of 4.25 rather than 3.5 hardly massive difference the +3" makes the real difference. But MoN is too good not take. Soulgrinders with a 3+ or even a 2+ save are ridiculously good.

tgf wrote:

 psyklone wrote:
I.e. MoS on a SG is pointless

Yup, nurgle or go home.

I have to disagree here, MoN is only good on a grinder if you want a back field sitting grinder shooting plegm and using skyfire, otherwise nurgle is far worse than just about every other mark. Now if why you want out of the grinder is back field fire support, and you play on tables where you can consistently set up in terrain, nurgle is great. If you want your grinder moving forward MoS is very good (As Noted previously having an average 7" run, with a range of 4-9" is very good, fleet for getting better charges is also key.

If i wanted a close combat MC id go for the DP any day, so grinders kinda made to sit back and fire

 ApostleofthPLague wrote:
If i wanted a close combat MC id go for the DP any day, so grinders kinda made to sit back and fire

Yup. weak WS, low I, they do way more damage with phlem.

Except a DP costs more (cost of DP+ Greater Daemon if you want it as a heavy, and unless you are planning to run a GD, it eats an HQ slot.), and is a lot less durable. Not saying they are great in CC, but there are plenty of cases where they are better than DPs, a forward moving Torrent + Slaanesh soul grinder is flexible (can shoot, ignores cover against hordes, can tarpit things...) In my experience (having used Grinders since last edition when plegm was cheaper, and not ordinance) plegm really does not do that much damage, as people spread out, get cover etc. IT is not bad, but I like the options of Slaanesh. Not saying Nurgle is bad, but presenting it as the only option is a mistake.

I don't think any of the marks are pointless. Khorne is free so always an option. Tzeentch is nice to reroll 1's, Mk Ngl shrouded and slaanesh 3+ run and fleet is nice ( I suppose the rending could help if you lost your claw - unlikely). I have painted my grinders up for nurgle, but that is my preference

My grinders are all painted red because before they crapped on the fluff in this edition grinders were loyal to the forge first and foremost and no chaos god came before the forge. I will be greening them up or selling my entire demon army as I really dislike the direction this codex took them.