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I have been playing 40K in my area for several years. I have played at the 3 local games stores in the area.
I am starting to realize that I just can't stand 90%ish of the 40K player base. The players are anti social, with
bad hygiene, obesity, and just plain nasty. One guy I thought was half way decent, is just too sore of a looser. He is fine
as long as he is winning, but as soon as things don't go his way he throws a hissy fit like a 5 year old.

I am not able to field my competitive builds against most of the player base. There are only 1-2 people that can really
hang with me if I take the gloves off. Usually, I find I have to take sub-optimal armies and let people win so they won't
get discouraged. I find no honor or pleasure in taking a machine gun to a knife fight. But I don't like playing that way. 40K is
a wargame, not barbies.....

Am I alone in this evaluation of most 40K players? I am considering getting out of the hobby because I can't stand to
spend any significant amount of time with the player base.

Across 3 stores, that sounds extremely bad. Poor store environments are often the result of clique behavior, maybe you should take a break from those stores and try to find some more mature people to game with.

dont let the door hit you on the way out

but seriously..thats just life.. if you are having problems with them find a different player base... i have people in my area that bother me but if you are legitimately not having fun then you should simply not play with those people maybe take a break from the hobby for a while and then join another player group to get the bad taste out of your mouth... you say you play competitive builds why not go to actual tourneys? fltry to find what works and if you cant make it work just stop playing! Life is too short to be actively participating in unenjoyable situations.. especially on your own time! thats just my 2 cents anyways

Could just be your area.

The player base where I live (Western Oregon) are generally well-mannered, clean, no more than slightly obese and pleasant to play with.

Some are hardcore players who bring alpha lists, some are more casual gamers. It's not hard to find a game at any level of competitiveness.

Sounds like you are a hardcore to-the-death competitive player, given your above statements. Have you considered going to some tournaments? Not sure if you have any local ones, as i have no idea where you are from, but there are some good regional or national ones.


** sidenote though**
You have described the local playerbase as antisocial and just plain nasty, but at the same time write off everyone who doesn't want to play 40K as a turned up to 11 competitive game as 'playing with barbies'. Could be that your local meta doesn't really go in for the optimised to-the-death competitive thing. Not all players do, after all.

I dominate the local tournaments. It is mostly the same players attending them....

I would love to travel to out of state tournaments, but can't justify the expense.

And I don't "write off anybody". I would gladly play toned down lists with the right people (if I have to).
I can't even find those folks....

I don't want to come across as arrogant, but I just don't see most 40K players as being my social equals.

Could be that they just don't enjoy the same style of play as you. If they're all "fluff bunnies" who don't like to bring super optimized lists and that's all you enjoy bringing, obviously there's going to be a bit of a clash. Could be that they view you as that WAAC guy who comes in and wipes everyone off the board, and so don't really want to play you, regardless of how true that may be. Could be that they are just jerks. I know that there's a gaming store about an hour away from where I live that's extremely cliquey, and the players are pretty unfriendly to "outsiders". I'm not sure why them being obese makes an impact on talking to them or playing a game with them, but bad hygiene is definately not ok.

I would parrot the above posters by saying that maybe it's time that you checked out the local tournament scene, or took a break from the hobby. In a tournament you don't necesariy have to really associate with the people there (though don't expect a good sportsmanship score if that's the case) and you'd be free to bring your most powerful lists and play against awesome players. The main problem here is that the lack of hygiene will still remain. In a recent tournament I played in, one of my opponants absolutely reeked. I could easily smell him from across the table, and this was only game two, with the games being only an hour long, so there was clearly no attempt to not be disgusting.

Something smells fishy in this thread.

NoArmorSave wrote:
I dominate the local tournaments.

There it is.

NoArmorSave wrote:
I have been playing 40K in my area for several years. I have played at the 3 local games stores in the area.
I am starting to realize that I just can't stand 90%ish of the 40K player base.

Also its not you its me...

Did you want advice?

Did you just want to complain?

Have you considered trying to help "up the game" of people in the community?

 DeathReaper wrote:
Something smells fishy in this thread.

NoArmorSave wrote:
I dominate the local tournaments.

There it is.

NoArmorSave wrote:
I have been playing 40K in my area for several years. I have played at the 3 local games stores in the area.
I am starting to realize that I just can't stand 90%ish of the 40K player base.

Also its not you its me...

Did you want advice?

Did you just want to complain?

I guess a bit of both. Venting and maybe some advice....

I find I get much better games on Vassal. More enjoyable and more challenging from a gameplay perspective.
But then where is the "social interaction"?


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 GimbleMuggernaught wrote:
Could be that they just don't enjoy the same style of play as you. If they're all "fluff bunnies" who don't like to bring super optimized lists and that's all you enjoy bringing, obviously there's going to be a bit of a clash. Could be that they view you as that WAAC guy who comes in and wipes everyone off the board, and so don't really want to play you, regardless of how true that may be. Could be that they are just jerks. I know that there's a gaming store about an hour away from where I live that's extremely cliquey, and the players are pretty unfriendly to "outsiders". I'm not sure why them being obese makes an impact on talking to them or playing a game with them, but bad hygiene is definately not ok.

I would parrot the above posters by saying that maybe it's time that you checked out the local tournament scene, or took a break from the hobby. In a tournament you don't necesariy have to really associate with the people there (though don't expect a good sportsmanship score if that's the case) and you'd be free to bring your most powerful lists and play against awesome players. The main problem here is that the lack of hygiene will still remain. In a recent tournament I played in, one of my opponants absolutely reeked. I could easily smell him from across the table, and this was only game two, with the games being only an hour long, so there was clearly no attempt to not be disgusting.

" In a recent tournament I played in, one of my opponants absolutely reeked."

Oh God..... Why do those creatures have to infest what is one of the coolest games on the face of the planet. They ruin it for everyone.
I hate being around people like that. It drives me crazy.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
It would be interesting to create a webpage called "The People of Game Stores". In the same manner as http://www.peopleofwalmart.com/

Oh God..... Why do those creatures have to infest what is one of the coolest games on the face of the planet. They ruin it for everyone.

I ask myself this every time I step outside my house and have to deal with humanity in general.

Sometimes, being an elitist bastard is tough.

NoArmorSave wrote:
I have been playing 40K in my area for several years. I have played at the 3 local games stores in the area.
I am starting to realize that I just can't stand 90%ish of the 40K player base. The players are anti social, with
bad hygiene, obesity, and just plain nasty. One guy I thought was half way decent, is just too sore of a looser. He is fine
as long as he is winning, but as soon as things don't go his way he throws a hissy fit like a 5 year old.

I am not able to field my competitive builds against most of the player base. There are only 1-2 people that can really
hang with me if I take the gloves off. Usually, I find I have to take sub-optimal armies and let people win so they won't
get discouraged. I find no honor or pleasure in taking a machine gun to a knife fight. But I don't like playing that way. 40K is
a wargame, not barbies.....

Am I alone in this evaluation of most 40K players? I am considering getting out of the hobby because I can't stand to
spend any significant amount of time with the player base.

ya youre pretty far off. it's designed to be a casual fun game to just relax and have fun with friends. the game is poorly designed, easy to break and doesnt support min/max mentality very well.

saying people cant "hang with you" makes you sound immature especially since youre talking about a broken toy soldier game. if you want to be competitive about something then try to win gold demon or take up competitive sports.

NoArmorSave wrote:
I dominate the local tournaments. It is mostly the same players attending them....

I would love to travel to out of state tournaments, but can't justify the expense.

And I don't "write off anybody". I would gladly play toned down lists with the right people (if I have to).
I can't even find those folks....

I don't want to come across as arrogant, but I just don't see most 40K players as being my social equals.

I was kind of supporting you until I read this..... I guess wargaming has different meaning to different people. Some like the painting, some are fluff bunnies, some like to club baby seals. From reading that you beat face at your local tourney I would suggest you move on to state tournaments, especially you seem to be that kind of player who likes to win. But then you can't justify the expense....

Well I would like to play with you, and show up with an awesome WAAC army, but I can't justify the expense...

You are in a situation where your enjoyment of the game is reduced by your lack of funds. Just like me wanting a beat face army to compete with you but lack for funds. Since 40k is a social hobby, you either have adapt to your social group for find another hobby that you can justify the expense with.

Here's to us in making more money to justify our expense in the future!

NoArmorSave wrote:
I don't want to come across as arrogant, but I just don't see most 40K players as being my social equals.

You had the same experience at three different stores? If you want to find the common factor in those three experiences, look in the mirror. With that kind of attitude, why would anyone want to play with you?

NoArmorSave wrote:
I have been playing 40K in my area for several years. I have played at the 3 local games stores in the area.
I am starting to realize that I just can't stand 90%ish of the 40K player base. The players are anti social, with
bad hygiene, obesity, and just plain nasty. One guy I thought was half way decent, is just too sore of a looser. He is fine
as long as he is winning, but as soon as things don't go his way he throws a hissy fit like a 5 year old.

I am not able to field my competitive builds against most of the player base. There are only 1-2 people that can really
hang with me if I take the gloves off. Usually, I find I have to take sub-optimal armies and let people win so they won't
get discouraged. I find no honor or pleasure in taking a machine gun to a knife fight. But I don't like playing that way. 40K is
a wargame, not barbies.....

Am I alone in this evaluation of most 40K players? I am considering getting out of the hobby because I can't stand to
spend any significant amount of time with the player base.

Congratulations, you have reminded me of why I dislike die hard players. I can understand the bit about unwashed players very well, but it seems you would suffer from toning down your own style somewhat either.

People play this game as a hobby. It has to be enjoyable and being constantly tabled by a WAAC player isnt the definition of fun, people like to win every once in a while. Why cant you stand those people? You have anwsered it, because you have to play a certain list and let them win. You also dont like losing, so imagine losing against you every time if its true that you 'dominate local tournaments'.
And it would be a lot nicer if you could say 90% of YOUR LOCAL 40k player base. My area has a decent variation of players, from kids to even fathers and everything in between. Sometimes youre just unlucky with the people you encounter, but generalizing like that just makes you sound like the bad guy. There are always some people who carry the negative stereotype, but you have to accept the good with the bad, thats life.

Just remember that 40k is a game. When you can no longer find it enjoyable it might be time to move on. Just wait a few years to return to those stores, try starting your own club or try to get some of your more competitive friends involved

it happens. Part of the reason i never got into 40k back in 5th was because i never found a playerbase to get me into it. I wasnt going to just grab a hobby i knew next to nothing about other than the eyecandy aspect of it appealed to me (hence why im orks lol) unless i had friends to help me figure things out.

I got stationed in Korea back in August, and the guy that got me at the bus stop was a 40k player. Immediately i found 10+ people that play often, only 1-2 being even remotely bad-apples but still able to play with w/o many issues. i consider myself lucky.
My biggest fear is when i return to Nebraska as a civilian i will either never find anyone, or find what youre talking about.

You might have to go outside the local area to find players, and make it a planned trip or something to get any games rather than just go "Hey who wants to play?"

well I cant say I have ever bothered to play in stores mostly because it would do my hea din to have people hang over me all the time and I like to play on large battle areas.

But mostly I enjoy a good agrument about the rules sometimes just because its amuseing and part of the hobby no malice or anything in it

It seems to me you are good at the game (from what you say) but have lost the point of it I enjoy lossing a game as much as winning probably more because I think of how to beat them next time.

But sounds like you are getting a tad bored of winning where you wan to admit it or not tryed collecting a diffrent army or even playing points down from your oppent as in he/she has 1500pts you have 1000-1200pts

As for the people in the stores hygiene and stuff or being fat cant say I have ever noticed could just be you ether your nose to near your a** or you have some crap luck lol thats why your so good at 40k you used up all your luck with the dice and feck all left for real life lol dice gods giveth and dice gods takeith away lol

NoArmorSave wrote:
I don't want to come across as arrogant, but I just don't see most 40K players as being my social equals.

Sounds like you have the answer to your own problem here: quit having a superiority complex and learn humility.

If you want good opponents, train them. Be the fething change you want to see in the world, not complain about it.

Guess what? You ARE TFG. But you don't have to be.

Asmodai Asmodean wrote:
If you want good opponents, train them. Be the fething change you want to see in the world, not complain about it.

This is good advice.

wufai wrote:

NoArmorSave wrote:
I dominate the local tournaments. It is mostly the same players attending them....

I would love to travel to out of state tournaments, but can't justify the expense.

And I don't "write off anybody". I would gladly play toned down lists with the right people (if I have to).
I can't even find those folks....

I don't want to come across as arrogant, but I just don't see most 40K players as being my social equals.

I was kind of supporting you until I read this..... I guess wargaming has different meaning to different people. Some like the painting, some are fluff bunnies, some like to club baby seals. From reading that you beat face at your local tourney I would suggest you move on to state tournaments, especially you seem to be that kind of player who likes to win. But then you can't justify the expense....

Well I would like to play with you, and show up with an awesome WAAC army, but I can't justify the expense...

You are in a situation where your enjoyment of the game is reduced by your lack of funds. Just like me wanting a beat face army to compete with you but lack for funds. Since 40k is a social hobby, you either have adapt to your social group for find another hobby that you can justify the expense with.

Here's to us in making more money to justify our expense in the future!

Spending hundreds on plane tickets and hotel rooms isn't my idea of fun. I would much rather take my kids on a nice vacation.
My armies are already done, other than the usual maintenance between codexes.

And I don't play WAAC armies outside touraments FYI. What's the point, it doesn't prove anything......


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Asmodai Asmodean wrote:

NoArmorSave wrote:
I don't want to come across as arrogant, but I just don't see most 40K players as being my social equals.

Sounds like you have the answer to your own problem here: quit having a superiority complex and learn humility.

If you want good opponents, train them. Be the fething change you want to see in the world, not complain about it.

Guess what? You ARE TFG. But you don't have to be.

No, I am not TFG. Not by a long shot.

I am a reasonable, skilled, 40K gamer. I don't enjoy gaming with the local population (most of them).

Training them is impossible. For starters, most of them are broke and don't have the resources needed for the game.

Whereabouts are you? You said you tried 3 stores - how "local" are they?

You know the Kipling quote?

If you can talk with crowds and keep your virtue,
' Or walk with Kings - nor lose the common touch,
if neither foes nor loving friends can hurt you,
If all men count with you, but none too much;

You fail at this completely.

 azreal13 wrote:
You know the Kipling quote?

If you can talk with crowds and keep your virtue,
' Or walk with Kings - nor lose the common touch,
if neither foes nor loving friends can hurt you,
If all men count with you, but none too much;

You fail at this completely.

Meh, I don't need Kipling's advice on how to live my life. If I recall correctly, Kipling used to laugh hysterically at his own jokes.

He can be your hero, but he is not mine.

Your response to my post, coupled with your apparent inability to find one compatible opponent despite numerous games in multiple locations really does suggest that any problem lies with you.

Kipling is no particular hero of mine, but good advice is good advice, no matter who gives it.

Training them is impossible. For starters, most of them are broke and don't have the resources needed for the game.

if they are broke and you own painted armies, then here is a revelation for you, Lend them an army while you are instore (or at your house), OR is only one army you own competitive? it sounds alot like your "that kid that wont share his toys with the other kids in the sand pit", just saying because i own 9 unpainted armies and i lend them out (some players provide me with beer in return) and a further 3-4 for warhammer fantasy....maybe form your own club with people you do like to hang out with (ie work collegues/college buddies etc), otherwise as noted above "don't let the door hit you on the way out".

NoArmorSave wrote:
I have been playing 40K in my area for several years. I have played at the 3 local games stores in the area.
I am starting to realize that I just can't stand 90%ish of the 40K player base. The players are anti social, with
bad hygiene, obesity, and just plain nasty. One guy I thought was half way decent, is just too sore of a looser. He is fine
as long as he is winning, but as soon as things don't go his way he throws a hissy fit like a 5 year old.

I am not able to field my competitive builds against most of the player base. There are only 1-2 people that can really
hang with me if I take the gloves off. Usually, I find I have to take sub-optimal armies and let people win so they won't
get discouraged. I find no honor or pleasure in taking a machine gun to a knife fight. But I don't like playing that way. 40K is
a wargame, not barbies.....

Am I alone in this evaluation of most 40K players? I am considering getting out of the hobby because I can't stand to
spend any significant amount of time with the player base.

That is bad man. I know exactly what you mean, though. When I started in Battletech, the people teaching me to play were total jerkoffs. One guy started talking about how he could get his girlfriend to give him sexual favors whenever he wanted (I was 16 nd my brother was 14 at the time ad he's talking like that in front of kids? WTF?) and the two guys teaching me to play were having a good time belittling me about my paint job on my Atlas, the choices I made tactically, just a whole slew of things that made me give up Battletech for a while.

I was playing in the 2007 Warmachine tournaments (I got the No Man's Land patch) and I was playing my Khador army against another guy's Cygnar. On the next section of the large table we were playing on, the wheelchair-bound guy playing his Menoth against a teenager that was using a Trolls army. The store owner pulled some strings for this kids troll army to be able to compete and the entire time this kid is whining and complaining because his opponent was dicing him up pretty good.

It was then that i smelled it. I caught a foul odor in the air and started trying to identify the source of the stench and I asked my opponent what that was. He told me to leave off and he'd tell me in a bit. Well, after I got beat, my opponent and I went out for a smoke and he told me it was that kid and that he never took baths. NASTY !

I apologize about the long post, but that's just not right in either case. You don't belittle new players, or anyone for that matter, and you should take at least one shower per day.

I know I can act like an ass on the forum, but if you met me in the RL, I'm easy to get along with...and I take my showers. If someone is new to the game (and it's one I play) then I'm MORE than happy to help them out . If they want to play a game, great! Let's go! I love giving tutorials because I want to see the tabletop gaming community grow, grow, GROW! I want to see it be a place that people feel comfortable coming to and playing with others of like minds and tastes.

that's my two cents.

Despite some people saying you are the problem the fact that you have not once gotten angry or dismissive with your replies tells me that you are in fact a decent level headed guy. Having played Magic the gathering competitively for a while before getting into Warhammer (it is much cheaper to play warhammer) I know exactly the type of gamers your talking about. While everyone who is into our hobby is not neccesarily a fat, anti-social slob, there is unfortunately a fair number of such people who do enjoy our hobby.

This is not a knock on other people, but we ALL know or maybe we are that guy who doesn't pay much attention to their own appearance or hygiene when we go out in public perhaps because we claim to 'not care' what other people think. Bottom line, many 'nerds' fit the stereotype of the smelly fat guy and there's not a lot to be done about it.

That being said, I'm not sure how to suggest you improve your local player base, I mean, you're kind of stuck between a rock and a hard place. Handing the smelly anti-social offenders a bar of soap and a book on talking to people is just going to make you look like an donkey-cave. Only thing I could think to do would be to perhaps get friends of yours that you know you get along with into the hobby and teach them how to play at your level. Yeah, it will take a while and it will definately require you to dumb down your play style for a while but in the end you'll have a reasonably enjoyable group of people to play with.

I do sympathise with you to an extent, the only store I can play in is the local GW and the cheating, poor socialisation/hygiene, and lack of effort put into armies when you've spent a long fething time getting yours to a semi golden daemon standard is pretty frustrating. As someone suggested though if your problem is at least partially their lists then make up two balls to the wall uber lists of your own minis then challenge someone either flipping a coin or letting them choose the army they want. You'd increase understanding of your own lists as well.

Yessir, but then....then there are those people that make you wish chainswords were real

I humbly suggest getting out of the hobby.

Fact I've come to know about most Wargamers, they aren't as bad as people put them out to be as, unless in the most extreme of circumstances.

I somehow doubt you have been to 3 local areas where the general Wargaming populous has been; obese, "Reeked" and been sore losers to such extremes as you have said..

I have yet to meet one that in a friendly / competitive game, I haven't had a great time in making great conversations and being able to enjoy myself.

Like said above, the problem isn't your local groups, it's you... You see them as "Socially unequal" yet refuse to admit to yourself being arrogant?.. Really? lol

If you find yourself having trouble socializing with people, the problem will always stem from YOU. I suggest getting out more, and actually trying to get some friends in closed circles.. Play with them regularly if you want to find social interactions that are meaningful.

Otherwise, just stop. I've dealt with the elitist kind, and they are a pain and sore on the hobby.. Most consider themselves "Gods" in the hobby, yet can't interact with singular individuals for the life of them... Don't turn out to be one of those people please...

If you want to play competitive games, join a regional tournament. Otherwise you can't expect the local gaming groups of casual players to really enjoy an elitists view of "Win at all costs, no mercy, no fun 4 U!" as even worth showing up to...