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Just wondering if there is a plastic kit that would make good artificer armor... i.e. Look ilike it is engraved. I know I could get purity seals and the like but I would like some good base armor to use.. Right now I am thinking the best I could do is Sanguinary guard lower bodies and then lose the nipple torsos for some standard marine torsos.

Literally, it comes down to painting. Artificer armour, is just very old, very well made, standard power armour. So, weather normal armour, but have artificer armour 100% weathering and chip free, with a metallic or pearlescent colour to it

The 'chapter champion' (?) from the space marine command squad box makes some cool looking unique armour. I always like to use the super heavy shoulder pads to show Artificer armour.

Not my pic: http://fc00.deviantart.net/fs70/i/2010/282/0/0/chapter_champion_by_cjmj1975-d30ei83.jpg

I asked this over on B&C a few weeks ago, mainly about Ultramarines, but got some pretty good answers and ideas.
http://www.bolterandchainsword.com/topic/272771-ultramarines-artificer-armour/
There's also a picture at the bottom of I painted up the artificer armour in the end.

Grey Knight Power Armor also works and has wonderful bits included.

The calgar honor squad.....awesome.

Everything posted above - and two more ideas. The Death Company box has some good bits if you want lots of skulls on it, there are a couple of bits where the blood drops are easy to get rid of.
The tactical squad also has a single piece of Mk8 Errant armour chestpiece - the one with the high collar.

Definitely Grey Knights stuff, just shave off the Grey Knight logos (but you can keep the inquisition because I think it gives the model more character, don't know why) and you're on your way to an awesome looking special character with a 2+ save.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Also the Masters of the Chapter box set comes with 4 guys in artificer like armour, and they're quite easy to convert as well.

I looked at the Grey Knights and think that may be the best... Seeing I want Honor Guard with 1 Thunder Hammer and 4 Relic Blades, they also have the right options.... I may have to switch to standard upper bodies and heads so they don't look like blue painted Grey Knights but they should do the trick.

Thanks guys, I think Pedro has his Honor Guard!!!

DAaddict wrote:
Just wondering if there is a plastic kit that would make good artificer armor... i.e. Look ilike it is engraved. I know I could get purity seals and the like but I would like some good base armor to use.. Right now I am thinking the best I could do is Sanguinary guard lower bodies and then lose the nipple torsos for some standard marine torsos.

Saguine guard painted prob better than this but like this would assuming the picture works or the link does or something if not i'll post link below (didn't work. check link below, it might help you out)

http://www.dakkadakka.com/gallery/477429-.html

this is my alt colour scheme for loyalist yet semi-chaotic world eaters, whom haven't fully embraced chaos yet.....

If you are okay with Third Party Power Armor™, I wholly recommend picking up some Scibor Miniatures to represent heroes, HQs, and Runic... err, silly non Wolves, Artificer Armour:

http://sciborminiatures.com/en_,shop.php?group=70

My "Counts-As" Coteaz:

When.I.started marines, I had a look at the diagram.in the codex. I noticed one shoulder had the raised bit similar to the plastic Deathwatch shoulder pad in the Commander kit. Stuck.it on and called it AA ever since.

When I built my second Captain, I used 2 of the spiky Mk V/VI pads to emulate the "orb like bumps" on the diagram's other side.

The AA pic also showed a raised collar similar to MK VIII armour.

Any of the FW armour Mks would also suffice.

 Deadshot wrote:
When.I.started marines, I had a look at the diagram.in the codex. I noticed one shoulder had the raised bit similar to the plastic Deathwatch shoulder pad in the Commander kit. Stuck.it on and called it AA ever since.

When I built my second Captain, I used 2 of the spiky Mk V/VI pads to emulate the "orb like bumps" on the diagram's other side.

The AA pic also showed a raised collar similar to MK VIII armour.

Any of the FW armour Mks would also suffice.

That makes sense, since all AA armor really is is (in most cases) the oldest armor the chapter has. Since Space Marines have a religious and fanatical outlook on their gear at points, the oldest equipment is some of the best as it's treated to the best repair and care the Techmarines can put it through.

Not quite sure how that means it gets a +2 save, but it does

 washout77 wrote:

 Deadshot wrote:
When.I.started marines, I had a look at the diagram.in the codex. I noticed one shoulder had the raised bit similar to the plastic Deathwatch shoulder pad in the Commander kit. Stuck.it on and called it AA ever since.

When I built my second Captain, I used 2 of the spiky Mk V/VI pads to emulate the "orb like bumps" on the diagram's other side.

The AA pic also showed a raised collar similar to MK VIII armour.

Any of the FW armour Mks would also suffice.

That makes sense, since all AA armor really is is (in most cases) the oldest armor the chapter has. Since Space Marines have a religious and fanatical outlook on their gear at points, the oldest equipment is some of the best as it's treated to the best repair and care the Techmarines can put it through.

Not quite sure how that means it gets a +2 save, but it does

*2+ save. 2+ not +2. #grammarnazi.

 washout77 wrote:
Not quite sure how that means it gets a +2 save, but it does

Because if it's looked after and kept in optimal operating conditions then it's functionality (i.e. protection) is maintained to a higher degree than the "normal" suits which, by comparison, just receive routine maintenance.

Deadshot wrote:

 washout77 wrote:

 Deadshot wrote:
When.I.started marines, I had a look at the diagram.in the codex. I noticed one shoulder had the raised bit similar to the plastic Deathwatch shoulder pad in the Commander kit. Stuck.it on and called it AA ever since.

When I built my second Captain, I used 2 of the spiky Mk V/VI pads to emulate the "orb like bumps" on the diagram's other side.

The AA pic also showed a raised collar similar to MK VIII armour.

Any of the FW armour Mks would also suffice.

That makes sense, since all AA armor really is is (in most cases) the oldest armor the chapter has. Since Space Marines have a religious and fanatical outlook on their gear at points, the oldest equipment is some of the best as it's treated to the best repair and care the Techmarines can put it through.

Not quite sure how that means it gets a +2 save, but it does

*2+ save. 2+ not +2. #grammarnazi.

Fine, I admit my mistake. Send me to death

Anfauglir wrote:

 washout77 wrote:
Not quite sure how that means it gets a +2 save, but it does

Because if it's looked after and kept in optimal operating conditions then it's functionality (i.e. protection) is maintained to a higher degree than the "normal" suits which, by comparison, just receive routine maintenance.

True, but I still don't see how it gets the same protection as a suit of Terminator Armor. It's still power armor at it's core, and if a perfectly maintained suit of PA can apply a 2+ save then shouldn't brand-new PA do the same? I mean, it's no big deal I honestly couldn't care less about it, but it's one of those small fluff points that erks me at times.

 washout77 wrote:
True, but I still don't see how it gets the same protection as a suit of Terminator Armor. It's still power armor at it's core, and if a perfectly maintained suit of PA can apply a 2+ save then shouldn't brand-new PA do the same? I mean, it's no big deal I honestly couldn't care less about it, but it's one of those small fluff points that erks me at times.

No. It's a well-known trope of the 40K setting (and many others, for that matter) that Man's tech is better, more powerful and/or advanced the older it is. The Imperium today is a mere shadow of it's former self, the golden age long over, and it's armouries and manufactorums barely able to capture the memory of their former, superior selves. Besides, it's just common sense that if one set of armour is revered, and therefore maintained with greater care, than another set, then the former is going to maintain greater functionality than the latter. Don't look for logic in this. It's space fantasy.

 Anfauglir wrote:

 washout77 wrote:
True, but I still don't see how it gets the same protection as a suit of Terminator Armor. It's still power armor at it's core, and if a perfectly maintained suit of PA can apply a 2+ save then shouldn't brand-new PA do the same? I mean, it's no big deal I honestly couldn't care less about it, but it's one of those small fluff points that erks me at times.

No. It's a well-known trope of the 40K setting (and many others, for that matter) that Man's tech is better, more powerful and/or advanced the older it is. The Imperium today is a mere shadow of it's former self, the golden age long over, and it's armouries and manufactorums barely able to capture the memory of their former, superior selves. Besides, it's just common sense that if one set of armour is revered, and therefore maintained with greater care, than another set, then the former is going to maintain greater functionality than the latter. Don't look for logic in this. It's space fantasy.

Geez, take a chill pill. Don't take my words so seriously. I'm far from looking at 40k logically. I've been in this and the Space Opera type stuff for a long time, I know the tropes by now. I'm actually poking fun at the lack of logic. I'm looking at it from a game point of view.

On topic though, since we keep getting off, all the suggestions are valid so far. Grey Knight kit-bashing is valid, so is some of the FW armor sets. Really, anything to make the armor look fancier or older is good enough.

 Anfauglir wrote:

 washout77 wrote:
True, but I still don't see how it gets the same protection as a suit of Terminator Armor. It's still power armor at it's core, and if a perfectly maintained suit of PA can apply a 2+ save then shouldn't brand-new PA do the same? I mean, it's no big deal I honestly couldn't care less about it, but it's one of those small fluff points that erks me at times.

No. It's a well-known trope of the 40K setting (and many others, for that matter) that Man's tech is better, more powerful and/or advanced the older it is. The Imperium today is a mere shadow of it's former self, the golden age long over, and it's armouries and manufactorums barely able to capture the memory of their former, superior selves. Besides, it's just common sense that if one set of armour is revered, and therefore maintained with greater care, than another set, then the former is going to maintain greater functionality than the latter. Don't look for logic in this. It's space fantasy.

Armour isn't better the older it is though. Mk 8 Errant Armour is superior to Mk 7, which is superior to Mk 6 and so on. The reason Artificier Armour is better than "normal" Astartes Power Armour is that it's essentially a custom job; "normal" Power Armour is, comparatively speaking, mass-produced. Each suit of Artificier Armour is unique and much more expensive and time-consuming than a "normal" suit of Power Armour.

Terminator Armour still provides better protection, it's just not a big enough difference to be visible on the tabletop.

 washout77 wrote:

True, but I still don't see how it gets the same protection as a suit of Terminator Armor. It's still power armor at it's core, and if a perfectly maintained suit of PA can apply a 2+ save then shouldn't brand-new PA do the same? I mean, it's no big deal I honestly couldn't care less about it, but it's one of those small fluff points that erks me at times.

It really makes no sense and it devalues terminator armour. As Space Marine Captains come with 4+ inv save, so artificer is just plain better than terminator armour. Terminator armour should be the pinnacle of imperial armour technology, and no mere power armour, no matter how fancy, should be better than it.

 AlmightyWalrus wrote:

 Anfauglir wrote:

 washout77 wrote:
True, but I still don't see how it gets the same protection as a suit of Terminator Armor. It's still power armor at it's core, and if a perfectly maintained suit of PA can apply a 2+ save then shouldn't brand-new PA do the same? I mean, it's no big deal I honestly couldn't care less about it, but it's one of those small fluff points that erks me at times.

No. It's a well-known trope of the 40K setting (and many others, for that matter) that Man's tech is better, more powerful and/or advanced the older it is. The Imperium today is a mere shadow of it's former self, the golden age long over, and it's armouries and manufactorums barely able to capture the memory of their former, superior selves. Besides, it's just common sense that if one set of armour is revered, and therefore maintained with greater care, than another set, then the former is going to maintain greater functionality than the latter. Don't look for logic in this. It's space fantasy.

Armour isn't better the older it is though. Mk 8 Errant Armour is superior to Mk 7, which is superior to Mk 6 and so on. The reason Artificier Armour is better than "normal" Astartes Power Armour is that it's essentially a custom job; "normal" Power Armour is, comparatively speaking, mass-produced. Each suit of Artificier Armour is unique and much more expensive and time-consuming than a "normal" suit of Power Armour.

Terminator Armour still provides better protection, it's just not a big enough difference to be visible on the tabletop.

This is the most viable explanation if one is needed. The differences on the table top make the statement here. I wouldn't say Artificer is the equivalent to Terminator armor in protection, but it's better than power armor. Kinda a tricky spot to place the rule in. It does devalue Terminator armor though, as it gives you nearly all the positives without the negatives.

The Imperiums tech actually seems to be getting better. IT was amazing pre to during Heresy, sucked post Heresy, but it seems to be almost surpassing Heresy tech at this point as the Admech finds more and more STC knowledge

 washout77 wrote:
Geez, take a chill pill. Don't take my words so seriously.

O_o Umm... I'm perfectly calm.

 AlmightyWalrus wrote:
The reason Artificier Armour is better than "normal" Astartes Power Armour is that it's essentially a custom job; "normal" Power Armour is, comparatively speaking, mass-produced. Each suit of Artificier Armour is unique and much more expensive and time-consuming than a "normal" suit of Power Armour.

Right. Which is essentially the same as the point I was making. The original context of my point was in answering; "why does artificer armour provide 2+?" Which was said in a way as though there was no clear reason or answer to why. Well, there is. Artificer armour retains higher functionality due to the loving customisation and extra careful maintenance compared to standard power armour. Simple.

As for the tech thing, while the quality of power armour itself isn't the best example... my point about the setting and the Imperium as a whole still stands. The Astartes, and their gear, are a relic of a past golden age, never to be recaptured. What are now considered the Imperiums best/most powerful pieces of tech, like the Space Marines, Baneblade super heavy tanks, laser destroyers and plasma weapons etc, are now rare when once they were numerous and common. If all your best toys are the dregs that remain from millenia ago... then that's a clear sign of the old = superior trope in full swing.

Well, last I checked... artificer armour doesn't provide you with the means to teleport, or fire an assault cannon on the move. Or lug a missile launcher around while keeping both hands free.
It's not all about protection, folks.

 Crimson wrote:

 washout77 wrote:

True, but I still don't see how it gets the same protection as a suit of Terminator Armor. It's still power armor at it's core, and if a perfectly maintained suit of PA can apply a 2+ save then shouldn't brand-new PA do the same? I mean, it's no big deal I honestly couldn't care less about it, but it's one of those small fluff points that erks me at times.

It really makes no sense and it devalues terminator armour. As Space Marine Captains come with 4+ inv save, so artificer is just plain better than terminator armour. Terminator armour should be the pinnacle of imperial armour technology, and no mere power armour, no matter how fancy, should be better than it.

It is not... it doesn't have the built in 5++ save. Sure it protects against krak missiles but hit it with plasma and you will die.
My need for artificer armor is I want to do a Pedro Crimson Fist army using max sternguard. That means no room for terminators. So I thought of high-priced honor guard... all armed with relic blades... it will eat through any power armor or most MCs but it will die against terminators. I have since amended it to having the Chapter Champion wield a Thunderhammer but the Grey Knight swords definitely look like 2-handed relic blades and I believe there is a thunderhammer in the kit also... So other than the sunken heads of Grey Knights in their armor, it is perfect. I am thinking that I will add standard upper torso to GK legs and then pick shoulder pads with the extended guards... I want to try a dark blue with gold inlay on them and of course numerous purity seals... It is going to be my one concession to close combat in an otherwise shooty army... But with Pedro's banner rule we are talking 16 S6 attacks on the charge at initiative + 5 S8 thunderhammer hits... it should be enough of a deterrent to some one charging my sternguard and thunderfire cannons.

 Super Ready wrote:
Well, last I checked... artificer armour doesn't provide you with the means to teleport, or fire an assault cannon on the move. Or lug a missile launcher around while keeping both hands free.
It's not all about protection, folks.

In game terms, and for the 2 models (Captains and Chapter Masters) that can choose between the three, there is simply no benefit from TDA apart from assaulting after firing a combiweapon.

They both provide 2+ save and you have a 4++ anyway. Both sets can take SS, Hellfire, Meltabombs and Auxilary Grenade Launcher. The TDA can Deep Strike but for the same price you can buy AA and JP and move as JI. And you have grenades. Or you can go the extra 10pts again for +1 Toughness and TL Bolter on a bike. And you can still get all the same weapon options except Chanfist but whoould ever use a Captaim for tank hunting? Besides, Relic Blade+SS+JP looks badass.

The Artificer Armor isn't just old pieces.

It's custom jobs, made of better materials than the "mass-produced" PA. It's partly this and that old hero's armor, it's effect increased by whatever piece of his soul the marines believe is still holds. It really is better than standard suits due to receiving much better materials for repair and much more attention in service since the Techmarines too revere it higher. And since there's old pieces it might well have an older, much more sophisticated Machine Spirit rerouting damage and keeping all working in battle conditions.