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Once I finish painting my vampires, I'll be working on Orcs and goblins.
Here's my initial thoughts

Goblin Great shaman (level 3) on Arachnarok with shrine, and 4+ ward save. (shrine gives him loremaster and all wizards within 6" channel on a 4+).
Orc Big Boss, great weapon, General (LD8)
2x Orc Shaman, level 2
2x Night Goblin shaman, level 1
Goblin BSB

35 Savage Orc Big Unz, extra hand weapons, full command
2x10 savage orcs with bows, musician
20 Goblins, full command, shields and bows

6 River Trolls
3 Goblin Chariots
2 Stone Throwers (built from Arachnarok flingers)
2 Doom Divers (built from arachnarok flingers)

Idea is a healthy number of channelings on a 4+. I get 5 channel attempts, and should be getting 2-3 extra power and dispel dice each phase.
Orc shamans go for the foot. With 2 level 2's, the chances of not rolling a 6 or a pair to trade for #6 is only ~9%.

The savage bowmen are ITP character bunkers. The block of goblins are shaman and BSB bunker.
That puts the Savage horde, Arachnarok spider and river trolls up front, with 4 warmachines in the back and a unit of 3 wolf chariots holding a flank.

With Loremaster little waaaagh, +2 little waaaagh spells, and 4 big waaaagh spells, I have a lot of magic to choose from.
Likewise, 4 indirect firing warmachines should help out against a lot of threats that the melee can't take out.

Ideally, I'd like 2 or 3 chaff units as well, but points have taken that option away. I could drop the pair of level 1 shaman for chaff, but I think I'm really going to want those extra power and dispel dice they channel, and the threat of stealing dispel dice is decent as well.

-Matt

I can't speak highly enough about large units of squigs, 8 points a pop is terrifying

Ditto on squigs. I love mine.

Also, I'm having a hard time reasoning for 2 Lobbas. The s9 is good but wu tang is better. (Ha)

In all seriousness though; I have better luck with chukkas. Last game nabbed. 480 pt demon prince near my other Artillery! Bamm!!! He was then promptly eaten by. Plague drone in retaliation.

Also why common gobbos over NG if not taking skulkers? With your savages and troll being so resilient send a block of 20 NG behind them with 3 fanatics So when your trolls take charge you can shoot thru trolls doing 6d6, and making enemy land on top of them doing 9d6? I figure you have a reasoning. The shoot thru isn't. "Go to" as it is situational.

Also curious why no manglers? Seems like would provide good protection for chariot advance.

skyfi wrote:
Ditto on squigs. I love mine.

Also, I'm having a hard time reasoning for 2 Lobbas. The s9 is good but wu tang is better. (Ha)

In all seriousness though; I have better luck with chukkas. Last game nabbed. 480 pt demon prince near my other Artillery! Bamm!!! He was then promptly eaten by. Plague drone in retaliation.

Also why common gobbos over NG if not taking skulkers? With your savages and troll being so resilient send a block of 20 NG behind them with 3 fanatics So when your trolls take charge you can shoot thru trolls doing 6d6, and making enemy land on top of them doing 9d6? I figure you have a reasoning. The shoot thru isn't. "Go to" as it is situational.

Also curious why no manglers? Seems like would provide good protection for chariot advance.

6 river trolls, 2 doom divers and 2 catapults is 600 points of rare.

I'm seeing a lot of high value single targets. Monsters on those huge bases and super chariots (iron blaster, mortis engine, cannon of khorne, manticore, hydra, abom, terrorgeists).
In short, every game has something that I'd like to fling a pair of S9 D6 wounds at.
As for Manglers, I chose doom divers instead. They fill the same role; doom diver does it a bit more spread out over several turns, with better ability to hit the needed unit. Mangler does more damage over a shorter period of time, but it's harder to deliver.

Am I better off losing the ward save on the goblin great shaman, dropping 1 savage big un, and upgraded the goblin warboss to an orc warboss? It would give me Ld9 and he could call the waaaagh, but it would be a death sentence to the wizard lord (T4 with only a 6+ armor save).

I'm seeing Tons of high value singles too.

My reasoning is 190 points for 2 shots with a 33% chance of hitting and needing 2s to wound probably. Vs 5 chukkas for same points (less actually, still room for a magic item on someone)

The chukkas have shorter range but will become increasingly accurate as targets approach. D6 wounds and s6 will wound lots on 2s and a bunch of monsters on 3 still until they are buffed ?

More or less I wasn't happy with my 3 chukka 2 Lobba 2 diver setup at 2500 or 2 chukka/2 Lobba / 2 diver at 2k. Chukkas were really working for me. I'm considering running a single Lobba now instead.

It seems like with that much artillery you will be set to receive charges, to which the fanatics may prove beneficial.

I personally never leave home without 2 manglers. They are such high priority to destroy it gives a free pass for chariots, etc...

Especially if you take a boss on wolf for WM hunting.

I feel like chariots if used for wm hunting will be singled off from rest of army. Could drop one take a boss with charmed shield on wolf?

I feel like dropping the ward save is a death sentence for sure. I think for the spider needs some other monster that they want to eat a cannon ball more quickly (mangler) if you do drop ward

Ld9 is great. I usually cheat in my NG list and take a common goblin warboss and a NG big boss with +1ld banner in same unit.

Also if you dropped a single troll and a Lobba, would free up room for 2 manglers right?

skyfi wrote:
I'm seeing Tons of high value singles too.
My reasoning is 190 points for 2 shots with a 33% chance of hitting and needing 2s to wound probably. Vs 5 chukkas for same points (less actually, still room for a magic item on someone)
The chukkas have shorter range but will become increasingly accurate as targets approach. D6 wounds and s6 will wound lots on 2s and a bunch of monsters on 3 still until they are buffed ?
I personally never leave home without 2 manglers. They are such high priority to destroy it gives a free pass for chariots, etc...
Ld9 is great. I usually cheat in my NG list and take a common goblin warboss and a NG big boss with +1ld banner in same unit.
Also if you dropped a single troll and a Lobba, would free up room for 2 manglers right?

My problem with manglers is that I had horrible luck with fanatics. I want more dependable than random movement once they go wild.

Chuckas are good, but they do D3 wounds not D6.
At Range, Chukkas hit on 5's, wound on 4's and do D3 wounds.
Rock Lobbers hit* 1/3d of the time (same as hitting on a 5), wound on 2's, and do D6 wounds. Statistically, it makes a lobba about as good as 3-4 chukkas at range. Unlike a chukka, the rock lands somewhere and can net you some bonus kills. Also, with the new huge monster base (4"x8"), even on a scatter you can still hit it.
Chukkas do better vs knights; but I'm planning on covering that with the doom divers.
I used to run max warmachines, and it's solid; but I wanted a more rounded army this time.

Oh, the best use for fanatics isn't flinging them through big'uns or trolls, it's flinging them through warmachines.

-Matt

Doh! D3! Good way to look at Lobbas. Also hadn't thought of shooting em thru War machines. I typically shoot em thru NG


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Doh! D3! Good way to look at Lobbas. Also hadn't thought of shooting em thru War machines. I typically shoot em thru NG

In my opinion you're not going to get the return on your magic phase that you would hope for the points invested. That being said I haven't tried catchweb channel spam. Keeping that Spider alive is not going to be an easy task. Leadership 8 also leaves you quite vulnerable to some Death and panic tactics.

That aside most of the army is solid and I like the bows in your units to clear out your back line if need be.

As for the merits of DD vs. Manglers, I agree they have similar targets, but what Manglers can be used for as well is to deny movement to the enemy and for this reason 2 are an auto-include in my opinion. Spear Chukkas are trash in my opinion.

Unrelated - Why would you ever fling Fanatics through War Machines? I've played a lot of OnG and I don't know why this would ever be a desirable thing to do.

I never thought of it but, a 35 point WM being squished at T7 vs a bunch of S5 shooting attacks (unlikely) was my assumption.

I never use Spear Chukkas but I suppose I see that if you use them to trip the fanatic screen then you're only risking a unit that was going to die in the first place and was 35 points. The downside though is if you kill the spear chukka he gets an automatic overrun which you might not want, especially considering the antics you can pull on overruns from warmachines.

Sneaky_Gobbo wrote:
I never use Spear Chukkas but I suppose I see that if you use them to trip the fanatic screen then you're only risking a unit that was going to die in the first place and was 35 points. The downside though is if you kill the spear chukka he gets an automatic overrun which you might not want, especially considering the antics you can pull on overruns from warmachines.

You deploy infantry in the back, and warmachines in the front. With 10 warmachines (6 bolt throwers, 2 stone throwers and 2 doom divers), you've got a pretty good wall of shooting.
When the enemy finally closes in, you fling a crap load of fanatics through the T7 warmachines. The machines are only wounded on a 6, and that lets you pop the fanatics in the path of the on coming charges.
When the over-run happens, the survivors hit the front of the night goblins with nets, which often win by combat res. Should they break, behind them are units of orcs.
Basically, it's a 3 layer plan.
Warmachines in front, night goblins in the middle, orcs in back.
Combine 10 warmachines with health magic and you'll thin the enemy quite a bit before they get to you.

-Matt

I'd keep 1 each of Doom Diver and Rock Lobber and add Spear Chukkas. Trust me, you can never have enough of them. So what if they might fall apart every once in a while?

Also, agree on what others said on Goblins. If not running Skulkers, there is no point. Use Night Goblins instead, fanatics are fun!

Mangler Squigs are even more fun, although they tend to be blown up by small, suicide units. Even so, you force your opponent to use some part of his points on small, disposable units to use as Mangled fodder. And, with some careful positioning and maneuvering, you will land the Squig right where you want him (or, if your opponent has never faced any Manglers before, they might do something as stupid as run 10 Chaos Knights through your squig - if you'll be so lucky!).