Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

I want to field them..

For no other reason than I think they deserve some board time, and I find them shiny Q_Q

But I can't decide whether or not to field them with Tzeentch or Khorne marks...

T = 4++
K = +2 attacks on the charge

I can completely understand if y'all want to bonk me on the head and say "Just take bikes!" But I feel like these guys cost me 30$ so I'd better get some use out of them >.<

I know they are basically, only ever considered good when you are fighting MEQ targets that need to be eradicated ASAP (A squad of pesky long fangs hiding on the back edge of a board) But can anyone give me some tips on how to actually approach with these guys? I would love to actually Deep Strike with them, but that whole 6" nonsense for their unique ability to affect enemies is (IMO at least) asking for myself to lose said unit of Warp Talons, and have them laze around in the warp eating Doritos at game..

Wrong sub-forum. You're looking for 40k Tactics.

Ya, thread needs to be moved.

To answer your question, would you rather pay 170ish points for a unit of Warp Talons, or 170 points for a Heldrake?

Woops >.< I had a few tabs open from Dakka >.< my bad everyone.

Good point loreweaver

Tell me about it, I bought 10 for a max squad on the release day, only to find out how bad they were, anyway it was my duty as a Night Lord to get me a squad. Sadly they have only seen the battlefield twice. However if you feel like taking them out to play go with allied daemons, get a herald with greater reward (preferably Tzeentch, so that he can buff with divination another unit), get the grimoire and boost the talon's sv to 2++ with MoT. Also for heavy I'd go with the skullcannon to counter the no grenades problem OR get slaanesh fiends also to counter the assault on terrain issue.

The only downside is that there is no way to make this squad fearless since attaching a lord to them would break the "only daemons" rule from the grimoire.

The Grimoire is swapped for an Exalted Reward.

And the target only has to have at least one model in it with the Daemon special rule.

 XT-1984 wrote:
The Grimoire is swapped for an Exalted Reward.

And the target only has to have at least one model in it with the Daemon special rule.

Yeah, exalted one, my bad.

And yeah, I thought it was written as a unit composed entirely of daemons, guess I got confused with all the icons & Deepstrike.

In that case go with a Lord with Jump pack as well to make them fearless!, haha an expensive combo for warptalons to work, but that's the price you gotta pay for shiny new models on the table.

Neither. I take it you are taking them to kill marines or MEQ's like you should with your expensive anti-MEQ unit. So what you in is Mark of Slannesh so you can strike before other marines, DRASTICALLY reducing the amount of expensive saves you have to make. Even if you wipe the marine unit you charged, there is a good chance you will lose one of your expensive warp talons to return attacks at same I, but with MoS most of those marines are dead, so lose there attacks. I know i'd much rather not have to face an attack then to have a 4++, which is over ridden by my 3+ anyway...

 Lord Yayula wrote:

 XT-1984 wrote:
The Grimoire is swapped for an Exalted Reward.

And the target only has to have at least one model in it with the Daemon special rule.

Yeah, exalted one, my bad.

And yeah, I thought it was written as a unit composed entirely of daemons, guess I got confused with all the icons & Deepstrike.

In that case go with a Lord with Jump pack as well to make them fearless!, haha an expensive combo for warptalons to work, but that's the price you gotta pay for shiny new models on the table.

10 warp talons and a lord packing 2++ saves. Good god that would work too well against most things. 550+ points + the daemons. You would shred anything in 3+ armor though.

 Exergy wrote:

 Lord Yayula wrote:

 XT-1984 wrote:
The Grimoire is swapped for an Exalted Reward.

And the target only has to have at least one model in it with the Daemon special rule.

Yeah, exalted one, my bad.

And yeah, I thought it was written as a unit composed entirely of daemons, guess I got confused with all the icons & Deepstrike.

In that case go with a Lord with Jump pack as well to make them fearless!, haha an expensive combo for warptalons to work, but that's the price you gotta pay for shiny new models on the table.

10 warp talons and a lord packing 2++ saves. Good god that would work too well against most things. 550+ points + the daemons. You would shred anything in 3+ armor though.

That would only work for the talons though, the +2 invul specifies it only applies to the daemon models withing the unit. The lord would have 3++ because of tzeentch + sigil, and the warptalon champ should be able to beat any sv3 challenge with a 2++ or if sv2 hold his own till the other talons and the lord wipe the unit, then intervene the challenge with the lord to deal with the sv2 model.

Ic

I don't have a Daemon codex atm from the current edition, but I'll do some research on how to get that 2++ and what I would need to buy from my local store to run that kind of setup

That combo also works with possessed as well. I've seen it used to good success.

If you deep strike them in, be prepared they will most like be a suidical unit, unless your entire army is somehow based on a beta strike army with multiple deep strike and flyer threats on turn 2. Even then, to get the most out of their ability, you have to risk them scattering onto enemy forces and suffering a mishap.

Safer might be to use them as a counter attack unit in a heavy ranged army. This will allow you to use their strengths, because they are fast, so they can rapidly move to any potential weak spot in your lines facing attack. Furthermore, attacking forces won't be in cover, so they will strike at initiative, and if you are counter charging into an already engaged battle, you won't even have to suffer overwatch.

Problem is, while they are good, they still aren't heavy enough as a hammer. If you face dedicated hammer units, they won't stand up. Like if the classic storm shield thunder hammer unit deep strikes behind your lines, then yes, you can immediately counterattack with your warp talons, but in this case, his hammernators will likely trounce your warp talons.

I guess they can be good to clean up the troops coming out from drop pods. Those are usually MEQ.

I run a daemon army with csm allies that has a unit of possessed and warp talons, they hold their own pretty well. Possessed march up the field with 2++ from the grimoire, crushers zip in fast turn 1 and pinpoint deepstrike a unit of khorne warp talons with an icon to blind as many units as they can. Important thing is to go second so the crushers can get a turn 1 assault without getting shot up and have a couple extra deep striking daemon units, preferably with instruments so you guarantee the talons get pulled in too. You have 3+ new units on the board and not every gun will be pouring into the warp talons

 ALEXisAWESOME wrote:
Neither. I take it you are taking them to kill marines or MEQ's like you should with your expensive anti-MEQ unit. So what you in is Mark of Slannesh so you can strike before other marines, DRASTICALLY reducing the amount of expensive saves you have to make. Even if you wipe the marine unit you charged, there is a good chance you will lose one of your expensive warp talons to return attacks at same I, but with MoS most of those marines are dead, so lose there attacks. I know i'd much rather not have to face an attack then to have a 4++, which is over ridden by my 3+ anyway...

Except they don't have assualt grenades, so that upgrade can be denied utterly by the enemy if they position correctly.

Sadly, they are not competitive. You can spend over 600 points to make a big squad with a 2++, or you can spend 170 on a heldrake to kill meq just as well.

 Inigo Montoya wrote:
Sadly, they are not competitive. You can spend over 600 points to make a big squad with a 2++, or you can spend 170 on a heldrake to kill meq just as well.

I don't think he needs them to be comp

GoliothOnline wrote:
I want to field them..

For no other reason than I think they deserve some board time, and I find them shiny Q_Q

 Inigo Montoya wrote:
Sadly, they are not competitive. You can spend over 600 points to make a big squad with a 2++, or you can spend 170 on a heldrake to kill meq just as well.

However if you WANT to field them that is some way to make them suck less, and yeah the heldrake can kill as well, but if you manage to pull the 2++ off you get pretty much the best anvil unit available for chaos (besides possessed and mutilators/oblies with the same trick). you could charge a deathstar and keep them there forever. Taking down 2 models with 2++ isn't easy at all. They would probably beat a 5-7 man thunderhammer if joined by a lord with PF they will for sure

You could add a Khorne Cannon to the list.

It gives them grenades essentially on assault if it hits a unit (not wounds)

With a 2++ or even a 3++ I really don't think the nades are necessary. TH/SS always strike last, they seem to do pretty well in CC despite that limitation.

Sadly, they are not competitive. You can spend over 600 points to make a big squad with a 2++, or you can spend 170 on a heldrake to kill meq just as well.

You really think a unit that has actual board presence and can wipe out entire squads every turn is going to have the same impact as a unit that has zero board presence and kills ~3-4 MeQ per turn, starting turn 2, maybe? I think your giving the Drake a little too much credit there and selling the Talons just a wee bit short.,

ShadarLogoth wrote:
You really think a unit that has actual board presence and can wipe out entire squads every turn is going to have the same impact as a unit that has zero board presence and kills ~3-4 MeQ per turn, starting turn 2, maybe? I think your giving the Drake a little too much credit there and selling the Talons just a wee bit short.,

Thank you for putting it into context. I don't believe that Talons are fantastic or even fairly priced, but the models look fantastic. I am currently trying to field this type of unit, though I am going for the 3++ and MoS. Most of the time, I have found that the enemy doesn't necessarily hug cover all that much and it's quite possible to get off charges of opportunity against weak back field units with fastand hard-hitting units like the Talons.

Just my two cents here, use them for what they appear to be made for: making Swiss cheese out of gunline marines.

Against dedicated entire army's worth of guns you won't do much, but that squad of Long Fangs or Devestators camping out in back field is a pain in most people's sides and with Warp Talons, they don't have to be. IIRC they come stock with VotLW, so just slap the initiative boost on them and go heavy weapons hunting, hoping to lose as few in each combat as possible.

I would keep them cheap though and pretty much leave them at home for any opponent that isn't some flavor of marines