Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you:
No adverts like this in the forums anymore.
Times and dates in your local timezone.
Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance.
Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely.
Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net.
If you are already a member then feel free to login now.
0XFallen wrote: I have a 1k tournament incoming, Didnt play in tournaments yet and only played against Necrons, Tyranids ( always lost), and once against deathwatch.
Any tips especially regarding deployment? Also what do I do against a A: Shoot heavy list; B Melee heavy list; C Knights
My list is Cawl, enginseer, 4x 5 Vanguards with each one plasma, 1 stocked rangersquad, 5 tazer infiltrators, 1 neutronlaser crawler
0XFallen wrote: Oops forgot the Main pieces, which are 3 Kastelan robots
Heavy Support - 440 4x Kastelan Robot - 12x Heavy Phosphor Blaster
Total: 1000 points 8 CP (-1 CP)
Take Cohort Cybernetica so your Robots can run and shoot. They are your primary anti-tank/anti-everything firebase.
Dominus over Cawl because you get an entire extra Robot. Choppy setup so that he stands a chance in Heroic Intervention; Omniscient Mask is also acceptable, though I personally would use the stratagem to take it in cases where you need to deploy your Infiltrators as a counter-charger. Monitor Malevolus because this army is quite CP hungry. (Expect to spend 3-4 points per turn.)
At lower points, one big unit of Vanguard is efficient. Use the Doctrina to get 2+ safe OC plasma. Most of your infantry should be Rangers though. Good for screening.
Big unit of Infiltrators. Drop them down, turn on Wrath of Mars and/or Doctrina, cook stuff. Use +1S Canticles to kill vehicles in CC up to T7. Deploy close to your artillery if you want to use them as counter-chargers.
0XFallen wrote: Just played with my 1k list against deathwatch.
Now I cant believe how strong their Hqs are, or how weak ours are.
One Hq of his could fly 12", 4++ and a hammer that killed a crawler in 1 turn, and 2 kastelans the other turn while still rerolling all 1s
The 2nd Hq could reroll all misses, hit, wounds, even in overwatch!! While still being good in melee and having a solid ranged weapon.
Im baffeled, please show me light again Omnissiah
Well, DW is one of the more competitive armies at low points. Or any game that uses PL. I swear, 40k actually makes a lot more sense at 1000 points because of the "I go with everything, then you go with everything" structure. Armies are a lot less killy.
Our HQs are support, not principal combatants. At 1000 points though, I would set them up for last-ditch fighting, just in case, but I would never charge one at the enemy line.
You need more infantry. Haha. I feel like I am a doctor recommending exercise or something. 80% of the times, the problem with a list is that people underestimate how many infantry they need. Infantry do a ton of things in a very point efficient manner, including:
-Protect your artillery from melee
-Deny deep strike area
-Deny ruins
-Seize and hold objectives
-Kill other infantry
In my opinion, the best infantry for this job are Guardsmen. In a meta where fighting Orks and Tyranids is a high possibility, Catachans are your best bet.
Skitarii are a decent second pick. Rangers are good for anti-infantry. Vanguard are much more flexible because they can advance and shoot.
Of course, infantry should not be your primary firebase. For AdMech, that mantle belongs mostly to Robots and Kataphrons now.
This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2018/12/16 03:32:12
0XFallen wrote: Thx for the recommendations, why not just use wrath of mars with the robos though?
As you get 50 shots with the infiltrators to the 36 shots of the kastellans. If they are in double tap mode then yeah 72 shots but i believe you get better mobility and accuracy with the infiltrators as with doctrinas they are bs 2 so dont need cawl baby sitting them.
How many kans can a killa kan kill if a killa kan can kill kans?
0XFallen wrote: Thx for the recommendations, why not just use wrath of mars with the robos though?
As you get 50 shots with the infiltrators to the 36 shots of the kastellans. If they are in double tap mode then yeah 72 shots but i believe you get better mobility and accuracy with the infiltrators as with doctrinas they are bs 2 so dont need cawl baby sitting them.
The extra Robot with dominus vs Cawl does about 35 wounds against Geq vs 34 wounds, is it worth as Cawl is stronger, can take a different relic(enginseer) and have a bigger and better buff for the rest of the army because of his huge base as well as the modifier for canticles? I also only own 5 infiltrators sadly.
Edit: So maybe : Cawl, enginseer, 4 Kastelan, 2x5 rangers(1x arc rifle for straight 1k points), 3x5 vanguards 1plasma each, 1x10 vanguards with 3 plasma and EDT?
This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2018/12/16 01:16:16
0XFallen wrote: Thx for the recommendations, why not just use wrath of mars with the robos though?
As you get 50 shots with the infiltrators to the 36 shots of the kastellans. If they are in double tap mode then yeah 72 shots but i believe you get better mobility and accuracy with the infiltrators as with doctrinas they are bs 2 so dont need cawl baby sitting them.
The extra Robot with dominus vs Cawl does about 35 wounds against Geq vs 34 wounds, is it worth as Cawl is stronger, can take a different relic(enginseer) and have a bigger and better buff for the rest of the army because of his huge base as well as the modifier for canticles? I also only own 5 infiltrators sadly.
So maybe : Cawl, enginseer, 4 Kastelan, 2x5 rangers, 3x5 vanguards 1plasma each, 1x10 vanguards with 3 plasma?
I personally wouldnt take any named character in 1000pts. Thats just me though, he still takes up 190pts which is nearly a 5th of your list in one character! Try out your new list though and yet us know how it goes
How many kans can a killa kan kill if a killa kan can kill kans?
0XFallen wrote: Thx for the recommendations, why not just use wrath of mars with the robos though?
As you get 50 shots with the infiltrators to the 36 shots of the kastellans. If they are in double tap mode then yeah 72 shots but i believe you get better mobility and accuracy with the infiltrators as with doctrinas they are bs 2 so dont need cawl baby sitting them.
The extra Robot with dominus vs Cawl does about 35 wounds against Geq vs 34 wounds, is it worth as Cawl is stronger, can take a different relic(enginseer) and have a bigger and better buff for the rest of the army because of his huge base as well as the modifier for canticles? I also only own 5 infiltrators sadly.
So maybe : Cawl, enginseer, 4 Kastelan, 2x5 rangers, 3x5 vanguards 1plasma each, 1x10 vanguards with 3 plasma?
I personally wouldnt take any named character in 1000pts. Thats just me though, he still takes up 190pts which is nearly a 5th of your list in one character! Try out your new list though and yet us know how it goes
Will do ! One last question: Regarding Cawl where do you place him, in front of the robots to take the charge?
0XFallen wrote: Thx for the recommendations, why not just use wrath of mars with the robos though?
As you get 50 shots with the infiltrators to the 36 shots of the kastellans. If they are in double tap mode then yeah 72 shots but i believe you get better mobility and accuracy with the infiltrators as with doctrinas they are bs 2 so dont need cawl baby sitting them.
The extra Robot with dominus vs Cawl does about 35 wounds against Geq vs 34 wounds, is it worth as Cawl is stronger, can take a different relic(enginseer) and have a bigger and better buff for the rest of the army because of his huge base as well as the modifier for canticles? I also only own 5 infiltrators sadly.
So maybe : Cawl, enginseer, 4 Kastelan, 2x5 rangers, 3x5 vanguards 1plasma each, 1x10 vanguards with 3 plasma?
I personally wouldnt take any named character in 1000pts. Thats just me though, he still takes up 190pts which is nearly a 5th of your list in one character! Try out your new list though and yet us know how it goes
Will do ! One last question: Regarding Cawl where do you place him, in front of the robots to take the charge?
Crawl isnt all that durable although he looks it on paper, he is quite resilient to small arms fire but weak to heavy hitters as he only has a 5++ invun (why gw why... we should have conversion fields back!!!) When i played mars at the start of 8th i had him behind the robots but close enough to Heroically intervene. The chaff line should be enough to absorb chargers, just keep them just more than 3" ahead of the robots so they cant be consolidated into
How many kans can a killa kan kill if a killa kan can kill kans?
So... more effective wounds, and another Robot's worth of wounds that the opponent has to kill? (Remember, no wounds table!) Seems like a good deal to me. Lol.
Cawl placement depends on a lot of factors. Generally speaking, you should have him to the side and slightly behind the Robots. This is because the Robots are a lot more durable, especially in Aegis mode, and you don't want to give them the option to shoot Cawl. If your Robots are in Protector mode, put Cawl in front with your screen to make it harder for your opponent to charge the Robots. Remember: you want to stop them BEFORE they reach the Robots.
IVIOOSE wrote: so if taking caul in a mars detachment is he the best choice for warlord? the extra 3" bubble is nice but is it necessary.
if you take him as warlord what have people been taking for a relic?
It's not really hard to keep your artillery within 6" of Cawl.
That is the daunting question. My answer thus far is to not take any AdMech relics at all. Instead, make a Guard HQ your Warlord and take Kurov's Aquila. I like Grand Strategist or Implacable Determination for Guard WLTs.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/12/16 06:20:43
It very much depends on your list
Warlord traits
Monitor malevolous is on a paa with grandstrategist if you need more cp Necromechanic isnt terrible if you want a repair bot
armoured exoskeleton agripinaa dominous makes him tankier
Relic
The omniscient mask is broken in combination with hoplites
The eye is strong but only against vehicles agripinaa only
Autocadeousius of arkhan land repair bot
How many people have tried hoplites do they make their points back and are they decent for their points. What’s the best way to protect them? Bunker or vehicle
IVIOOSE wrote: How many people have tried hoplites do they make their points back and are they decent for their points. What’s the best way to protect them? Bunker or vehicle
I have 20 and only ever tried out 15 of them, they are just a more "durable" chaff line to protect your robots from assault. They have some melee capabilities, nothing to crazy and they are quite resilient to targets that do good ap wounds to them in CC. Not bad for 9pts, but you get double there wounds in guardsmen, so it depends entirely on your list as a whole.
How many kans can a killa kan kill if a killa kan can kill kans?
I ran 30 in a GT in Nov(3 squads with data teathers) accompied by an enginseer with omniscient mask.
I footslogged them in a blob of 30 in an infantry horde
They are 1pt more than vanguard and for that you get 3+(canticle) 4++ melee 5++ shooting assault1 s6 ap1 d3damvs vehicles.
They are great for killing light vehicles (aeldari) and infantry on mass and will chip a couple of w off a knight in a pinch in CC they have twice as many hits and mortal w indefence the ombiscient mask is huge and when a knight or character charges them the mortal W out put is awesome. Massed guardsmen may be more of a barrier but they dont have the same damage output.
I would use them either as footslogging infantry blob aiming to take the midfield
Or as a frontline wall.
I wouldnt protect them they are the protection
If your going to transport take electropriests they need it to get to their target
If your going to bunker up kataphrons they have the range to make use of it
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2018/12/17 09:36:32
Knight Gallant [20 PL, 368pts]: Character (Exalted Court), Character (Heirloom of the House), Heavy Stubber, Heirloom: The Helm Dominatus, Ironstorm Missile Pod, Reaper Chainsword, Thunderstrike gauntlet, Warlord Trait: Knight Seneschal
The list is fine the only thing i would consider is making a warglaive a freeblade (fixed penalties - no strats and reroll 6's) random bonusrs)
A 6 up fnp is half as good on a warglaive as a gallent your not useing strats on it anyway. And reroll 6's one doesnt always occur cos you pass the ledership check and 2 even when applied will reroll to a success 2/3 of the time.
Knight Gallant [20 PL, 368pts]: Character (Exalted Court), Character (Heirloom of the House), Heavy Stubber, Heirloom: The Helm Dominatus, Ironstorm Missile Pod, Reaper Chainsword, Thunderstrike gauntlet, Warlord Trait: Knight Seneschal
The only problems i see with the list is that you have 30 troops. I dot know if you are playing the new CA 18 missions there but they require more bodies now, so i would tend to aim for 50 troops minimum. One more thing, i dont think the relic on the Dominus is worth it, he will barely be in combat so maybe take the pimp cane instead to get max usuage out of the relic.
How many kans can a killa kan kill if a killa kan can kill kans?
lash92 wrote: Some love for Skitarii snipers post FAQ?
72 points per Skitarii sniper team with Omnispex.
I used them before CA18 when they wore 97pts but now at 72pts its a steal! Basically a twin autocannon team that can target characters with 60" and MW output on 6s.
How many kans can a killa kan kill if a killa kan can kill kans?
lash92 wrote: Some love for Skitarii snipers post FAQ?
72 points per Skitarii sniper team with Omnispex.
Still suffer from the same problem as before you need a few teams to reliably kill characters and they are squishy for there points. Certainly better though.
Think if I was to go that way i would drop the omnispex and put one sniper in each unit atleast that way they are harder to kill
lash92 wrote: Some love for Skitarii snipers post FAQ?
72 points per Skitarii sniper team with Omnispex.
Still suffer from the same problem as before you need a few teams to reliably kill characters and they are squishy for there points. Certainly better though.
Think if I was to go that way i would drop the omnispex and put one sniper in each unit atleast that way they are harder to kill
I tend to run 2 teams of 5 with 2 arquebus each but no omnispex, 65pts per squad. They are pretty self sufficient in that they are far away up high and their sole target is characters. They are one of the more better snipers in the game in that they have a high str, some ap, multiple damage and still do the usual MWs on 6s. I probably wont take more than 2 squads worth, If they kill a character great! but usually they force your opponent to skulk out of LOS which limits his movement potential and pens him in.
How many kans can a killa kan kill if a killa kan can kill kans?
Knight Gallant [20 PL, 368pts]: Character (Exalted Court), Character (Heirloom of the House), Heavy Stubber, Heirloom: The Helm Dominatus, Ironstorm Missile Pod, Reaper Chainsword, Thunderstrike gauntlet, Warlord Trait: Knight Seneschal
I'm waiting to buy some more Rangers so as to build 4 more arquebuses, so that I can field 3x 7-8 Rangers with 2 Arquebuses each, and maybe and Omnispex as well. We're going to play a lot of CA2018 missions, and some require characters to capture points, if I understood well. As my own character pool is limited, I plan on deleting the opponent's. With three squads of either Lucius or Stygies they'll be a real threat, it's easy to commit a bit of fire to kill one unit but three demands a bit more commitment. If there's no characters to target they'll be ideal to finish off almost dead targets.
Aaranis wrote: I'm waiting to buy some more Rangers so as to build 4 more arquebuses, so that I can field 3x 7-8 Rangers with 2 Arquebuses each, and maybe and Omnispex as well. We're going to play a lot of CA2018 missions, and some require characters to capture points, if I understood well. As my own character pool is limited, I plan on deleting the opponent's. With three squads of either Lucius or Stygies they'll be a real threat, it's easy to commit a bit of fire to kill one unit but three demands a bit more commitment. If there's no characters to target they'll be ideal to finish off almost dead targets.
With 3 squads you seem very committed Just sucks they have to stay still to fire as 3 squads not moving sucks!
How many kans can a killa kan kill if a killa kan can kill kans?
Definitely go Stygies the -1 is much more viable then ignoring -1. I'm still not a big fan of Lucius, maybe if you plan on some kind of weird teleporting Kastelan / Kataphrons shenanigans.
Since I haven't really played that much with snipers: Is it really that easy to lose them. Sure they are just Skitarii in cover, but you got 60" range and outrange most dedicated anti infantry weapons.
I speak of Lucius because yes, I'm planning a future list (gotta buy stuff first) with 4 Fistelans with Combustors in a Cohort Cybernetica, they come out of DS, charge at 6" and godspeed. The list is a Lucius Battalion with Cohort Cybernetica and an Agripinaa Battalion with 6 Destroyers in a Servitor Maniple, I posted it a few pages back. The plan is to have multiple threats at once, with Dragoons and Robots making a mess in the middle while I move with my Agripinaa line to claim board control. The 3 Rangers squad will be Lucius and hanging in the backfield with a Dominus for rerolls/counter charging. I'll post the list if I find it in the thread.
What do you think of servitors as bodyguards for kastelan= 20 points for 4 models with a good weapon, although it hits on 5+. I dont like the models though so I was thinking of using Eldar Guardians with hoodless ranger heads and some claw or fist bits and maybe some guitar strings
0XFallen wrote: What do you think of servitors as bodyguards for kastelan= 20 points for 4 models with a good weapon, although it hits on 5+. I dont like the models though so I was thinking of using Eldar Guardians with hoodless ranger heads and some claw or fist bits and maybe some guitar strings
Im using the dark mechanicus guys out of Blackstone fortress as my servitors. If you are only usinh them to body guard Kastelans then for 20pts there pretty good, but if you are alss using them for Biosplicing you may want to be more cautious where there are placed as if you loose them you wont be regaining destroyers back.
How many kans can a killa kan kill if a killa kan can kill kans?
Eh, I was planning to acquire a dozen of these Negavolt Cultists to use as count-as Fulgurites so that I didn't have to paint these abominations again. I'll use the 10 WFB Ghouls I still have to be Servitors.
At 65pts for a base squad of rangers with 2 Transuranic Arquebus each it comes out to 195pts for six sniper shots. Doesnt seem like too big of a commitment for something that will change how your opponent moves and thinks and does okay damage in their own right.
AdMech (Main army)
Black Templars (original army)
Death Guard (lazy side project)
Imperial Knights (extension of AdMech)
Harlequins (fun side project)
Just sucks they have to stay still to fire as 3 squads not moving sucks!