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As the title says, I'm trying to figure out a way to counter the effectiveness of Empire Great Cannons and other heavy hitting war machines with my Warriors of Chaos army during the first turn. I don't necessarily need to destroy them, but I need to try and save my monsters and the like from taking cannon shots to the face and being a large point sink. Turns 1 & 2 are usually tough and I have to rely on the dice gods to be favorable with my ward saves. Turn 3 they're usually toast, but by then the damage has been done.

The only effective strategy I can come up with is a Lv4 Chaos Sorcerer Lord, with familiar and Lore of Death... pray I get lucky and roll Purple Sun of Xerxes and then force miscast with it for its large template effect and wipe the back field of the map clear of the war machines. This relies a little to heavily on the dice gods, getting turn one, or not being swatted out of the sky before I get a chance to attack, blah blah blah... You get the idea.

Any suggestions folks?

Not familiar with the new book...Is there a way to get a lore of death wizard across the board quickly? I mean you could use a throw away sorcerer if they're that much of a problem. The way I always saw it done was the tzeentch ward against shooting..or cav/hyrdras getting to them ASAP. Alternatively..You could chance the helcannon?

Slaanesh has 2 great spells for taking out warmachines.
The hex that gives random movement, and the direct damage that does hits and gives random movement. You can't choose to not move, and you can't move and fire.
With the steed of slaanesh, you can vanguard then march 20", so range isn't an issue.

If you want death magic, you can either go prince, or sorcerer lord on a flying carpet (with charmed shield and 4+ ward). More survivable vs shooting than the daemon prince, but can't go into combat. ~100 points cheaper or so.

You could get into a shoot out with hellcannons, but lobbing 210 point shots at targets half the cost isn't a good solution, or the best use the hell cannon.

Finally, my favorite solution is a Tzeench BSB on a barded daemonic steed. Blasted Banner, and stick him in a unit of trolls. With T5 from the mount, the BSB is very likely to survive a cannon shot to the chest (as are the trolls). Likewise, the shot is very unlikely to make it through the trolls.

So, deploy monsters behind troll wall and soak the hits until the cannons are dead.

Hero on slaneshi steed and terrifying mask of Eeeeeee!

Well, turn one if you go second, you can just declare stupidly long charges and scare them off the board? Artillery has crap for leadership, and if they fail a terror check they are simply gone. Then redirect into another war machine. Who cares if it's too long to reasonable make the charge with out rolling double 6's, you don't do it for the combat, just for the terror checks.

Note: I have lost too much artillery to 22inch 2nd turn charges with failed ld7 checks. Chimeras... Grrr arg

 Castitas wrote:
Hero on slaneshi steed and terrifying mask of Eeeeeee!

Well, turn one if you go second, you can just declare stupidly long charges and scare them off the board? Artillery has crap for leadership, and if they fail a terror check they are simply gone. Then redirect into another war machine. Who cares if it's too long to reasonable make the charge with out rolling double 6's, you don't do it for the combat, just for the terror checks.

Note: I have lost too much artillery to 22inch 2nd turn charges with failed ld7 checks. Chimeras... Grrr arg

Warmachines that fail panic tests (like terror) don't actually flee, but instead cower beneath the machine and cannot shoot next turn.

At best, you're going to prevent a machine from shooting for a turn. I'd rather bank of magic.

-Matt

^Matt I can't find in the BRB where it says that warmachines are completely ItP.

It just states they don't break from panic checks which leads me to assume they have to take, and are affected by fear/terror tests just like any other unit.

Not trying to argue with you here bc i very much enjoy your posts but i just want to be clear on this rule since i'm an Empire and WoC player.

Terror Rules State "run for your lives" p78. a unit which fails a panic test from being charged by a terror causer terror must flee from the terror causer.

War machine rules on panic p110: if a war machine Fails a panic check it does not flee. (example given is a friendly unit being destroyed with in 6inches"

However page 109: if forced to flee (example is a failed break test) the war machine is destroyed.

I suppose in this case it is down to whether the "run for your lives" is a panic test. After re reading the entries it actually does use the word panic (even if under panic tests it isn't mentioned) current ruling at my FLGS was that the unit has to flee per the terror rules. I will have to bring this up again and hope I get to see my artillary survive turn 1 and 2.

My apologies for suggesting what was hopefully a rules error.

nathan2004 wrote:
^Matt I can't find in the BRB where it says that warmachines are completely ItP.

It just states they don't break from panic checks which leads me to assume they have to take, and are affected by fear/terror tests just like any other unit.

Not trying to argue with you here bc i very much enjoy your posts but i just want to be clear on this rule since i'm an Empire and WoC player.

All that terror does is cause a panic test. Warmachines have a special rule about what they do if they fail a panic test.
Terror causes panic that says you flee if you fail.
Warmachines have a rule that say if you fail a panic, instead of fleeing you cower under the machine.

The only real good use for terror is making fear causing units take fear tests. That, or running off goblin units on the far flanks.

-Matt

-Flying demon prince (with lore of death or nurgle)
-tzeentch lord on disk
-Hellcannon

Thanks a lot for the advice folks, looks like I will be adding a hell cannon to the list sooner rather than later.

The normal rules for panic say that "if the test is failed, the unit will immediately flee".
I think the word will is important here, because Terror says Must instead, making the must an additional clause. Will flee < does not flee < must flee I think

Chimeras all the way surely? Take a pair and go kill warmachines, then turn and bight everything else in the ass.