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Made in gb
Focused Fire Warrior




Norwich,UK

Hi all i have a 1750 point tournament coming up in a couple of weeks and i need some advice on my list, the army I've ordered on-line still hasn't arrived yet so I am limited for models as I will be using a friends army.

I've played 3 games so far not with this exact list but what ever I could piece together with what I have and the farsight bomb concept has been working well.

Commander Farsight 165
Crisis Xv8-02 Bodyguard [1] 144
Drone Controler, Vectorised Retro thrusters,Command and control node, Purtide engram Nurochip, Multi spectrum sensor suite, Iridum Armor, 2 Gun drones 146
Crisis Xv8 Bodyguard [2] 91
2x fusion Guns, target lock, 2x Gun drones
Crisis Xv8 Bodyguard [3] 91
2x fusion Guns, target lock, 2x Gun drones
Crisis Xv8 Bodyguard [4] 91
2x fusion Guns, target lock, 2x Sheild drones
Crisis Xv8 Bodyguard [5] 91
2x Plasma rifle, target lock, 2x Sheild drones
Crisis Xv8 Bodyguard [6] 67
2x Plasma rifle, target lock
Crisis Xv8 Bodyguard [7] 67
2x Plasma rifle, target lock

Commander Shadowsun 135


9 Fire warriors 81
9 Fire warriors 81
9 Fire warriors 81


Skyray 116
blacksun filter
Skyray 116
blacksun filter

Xv88 Broadside Team 256
Broadside Xv88 [1] 95
Bonding Knife Ritual, Target lock, 2 Missile Drones
Broadside Xv88 [2] 83
Bonding Knife Ritual, Target lock, 1 Missile Drones
Broadside Xv88 [3] 81
Bonding Knife Ritual, Target lock, shas'vre

Agis Line Comms relay 75


I have also been toying with the idea of adding a space marine ally into the list with a librarian with gate and null zone.


Commander Farsight 165
Crisis Xv8-02 Bodyguard [1] 144
Drone Controler, Vectorised Retro thrusters,Command and control node, Purtide engram Nurochip, Multi spectrum sensor suite, Iridum Armor, 2 Gun drones 146
Crisis Xv8 Bodyguard [2] 91
2x fusion Guns, target lock, 2x Gun drones
Crisis Xv8 Bodyguard [3] 91
2x fusion Guns, target lock, 2x Gun drones
Crisis Xv8 Bodyguard [4] 91
2x fusion Guns, target lock, 2x Sheild drones
Crisis Xv8 Bodyguard [5] 91
2x Plasma rifle, target lock, 2x Sheild drones
Crisis Xv8 Bodyguard [6] 67
2x Plasma rifle, target lock
Crisis Xv8 Bodyguard [7] 67
2x Plasma rifle, target lock

Commander Shadowsun 135


9 Fire warriors 91
shas'ui
9 Fire warriors 91
shas'ui
9 Fire warriors 91
shas'ui


Skyray 131
blacksun filter, dpods
Skyray 136
blacksun filter, dpods , sensor spines


Librarian 175
Terminator armor, episitory, Gate, zullzone


5 scouts 90
Snipers, camo cloaks

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2013/05/03 16:35:43


Tac Ticz, Whatz Dat?  
   
Made in us
Sneaky Sniper Drone






The main thing I'd be worried about with this list is those firewarriors being shot out right away. They'll probably stick on on the table, especially on turn 1, as easy kills. You'll be hard struck for scoring as a result. I think I'd lean more toward eldar allies with a unit of jetbike guardians and eldrad or farseer instead of the SM allies, if you were to use allies.

One of the nice things about this list though is that using skyrays for ML support works out better than usual since you have so few units.

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5000
1500



 
   
Made in us
Dakka Veteran




Bay Area

i play a similiar farsight bomb

and usually you table them or they table you...so i dont worry about troop choices living....personally, its DEATH OR GLORY!!!!

   
Made in gb
Focused Fire Warrior




Norwich,UK

I think most lists wont be able to take out my fire warriors 1st turn both grey knights and crons needs to get closer before putting out much damage. careful placement should see them survive 1st turn and in the list with the marines the bomb will start on the board distracting from them.

Tac Ticz, Whatz Dat?  
   
Made in us
Fixture of Dakka





Los Angeles

 Kendowned wrote:
I think most lists wont be able to take out my fire warriors 1st turn both grey knights and crons needs to get closer before putting out much damage. careful placement should see them survive 1st turn and in the list with the marines the bomb will start on the board distracting from them.
I agree.

As an opponent facing this, I'd be pooping my drawers to get rid of FarSight and the b-sides. Once FS and his crew show up, I prolly wouldn't have *time* to shoot at FWs.

I see no need for changes. It looks nice, filthy, scary .

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/05/04 01:25:23


"You can bring any cheesy unit you want. If you lose. Casey taught me that." -Tim S.

"I'm gonna follow Casey; he knows where the beer's at!" -Blackmoor, BAO 2013

Quitting Daemon Princes, Bob and Fred - a 40k webcomic 
   
Made in gb
Secretive Dark Angels Veteran






I'm not entirely sure of the point of shield drones in the unit, since you already have a 4+ cover save.

Drop the shields and take guns instead.

Your list is kind of short on Markerlights, and has no FW support. The Bomb will be going in unsupported, and you have no mobility for capturing objectives deep in the enemy territory.

The Iridium battlesuit should be on somebody other than the C&C Systems suit.

Your anti-air is also extremely weak, a single Helldrake will toast you. You need skyfire on something.

Are the broadsides rail or missile?

Also consider taking Longstrike because he's the best value unit in the codex, and maybe an interceptor Riptide.

I don't feel Skyrays are competitive.






Automatically Appended Next Post:
My 1750 bomb list goes more on the lines of

HQ - 818 points
Farsight
Shadowsun
1x Bodyguard, 2x Flamer, Sensor suit, Control Node, Puretide Chip, Vectored Thrusters, Neurosystems Jammer
5x Bodyguard: Pod/Plasma, Target Lock
5x Gun Drones, 2x Markerlight Drones

Elite: 190 points
Riptide, Interceptor, Ion Cannon

Troops: 450 points
5xFW
Devilfish, SMS, Disruption Pod x3

Fast Attack: 100 points
2x Tetra (if FW not allowed, an equivalent pointage of Pathfinders)

HS: 190 points
Hammerhead, Longstrike, Submunitions, Disruption Pod

1748

You have a well-rounded, mobile, hard hitting force that can easily reposition and respond to threats. Helldrakes can generally be ignored since your troops are embarked in transports. If you're going Bomb, you need to support your deathstar by having units which can move and support it- half gunline and half bomb doesn't work because once you split the two, either are in danger of getting isolated and destroyed.

This message was edited 4 times. Last update was at 2013/05/04 02:10:49


Mechanicus
Ravenwing
Deathwing

Check out my Mechanicus Project here... http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/570849.page 
   
Made in au
Drone without a Controller




I like the odds of 12 seeker missiles shooting down a single drake. Even of they dont the 4 markerlights could give the farsight bomb bs4 shooting at it. 3 helldrakes would be funny though.

I also love FWs in devilfish, though the ones in the above list are a FW short, isn't the minumum unit size 6?

I thought they smelt bad on the outside 
   
Made in gb
Focused Fire Warrior




Norwich,UK

thanks for the input guys

I agree with the gun drones over shield drones but the Tournament is wysiwyg and my friends army I'm using dose not have enough gun drones the shields are not useless though as the unit tends to get assaulted the shield drones can help vs power weapons and the like.

the iridium suit is on the bodyguard with all the toys so a lucky precision shot with a lascannon or similar dose not kill him and massively reduce the effectiveness of the unit.

The broadsides in the top list are missile sides.

To be honest my anti air is pretty decent not only do i have 8 missile shots from the sky rays but their marker lights can make the bomb fire at their bs or better. so in the top list the missile sides deal with air with the sky rays and in the second list the bomb can reposition to deal with flyers.

Marker lights in this list are not as much of a problem as is most other lists, if you look there are not that many units to make good use of them. the 3 on average from the sky rays is fine. the bomb can work effectively without marker lights as can the broadsides all the mark lights do is make them slightly more effective or greatly increase their AA effectiveness.

As for skyrays not being competitive in alot of lists i would probably agree with you but in my one they work perfectly.
the skyrays if im not playing vs a flyer heavy list blow their load of 12 missiles 1st turn kill somthing big and get me first blood and then they become a low priority target for the rest of the game and happyly give of mark light support.

Ive tried out lnog strike and he is fairly underwhelming for his value as other have pointed out in other threads his chances of killing an AV 14 tank in the open is around 25% the bomb can deal with any heavy tanks making him obsolete.

The devil fish idea is a good one but they are so expensive so I wouldn't be able to fit in what i want in the remaining points.

Do people think its worth taking the librarian list, as its the one ive been edging towards. as it has more troops and the combo is nice being able to deep strike 24" each turn and force re rolls on invuns good for my most feared opponent deamons.




This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2013/05/04 10:32:51


Tac Ticz, Whatz Dat?  
   
Made in gb
Focused Fire Warrior




Norwich,UK

Tryed the second list with the Libby out tday and it worked really well, played a grey knight/ cron list with 2 dreadknights which I was worried about but when his first turn came he was very aggressive and the bomb managed to take out two dreadknights in 1 round of shooting thanks to monster hunter and null zone from there on he had pritty much lost.

Any advice from people for the bomb loadout would be helpfull, don't know weather to add some missile pods in or not.

Tac Ticz, Whatz Dat?  
   
Made in us
Dakka Veteran




Bay Area

 Kendowned wrote:
Tryed the second list with the Libby out tday and it worked really well, played a grey knight/ cron list with 2 dreadknights which I was worried about but when his first turn came he was very aggressive and the bomb managed to take out two dreadknights in 1 round of shooting thanks to monster hunter and null zone from there on he had pritty much lost.

Any advice from people for the bomb loadout would be helpfull, don't know weather to add some missile pods in or not. [/quote

ive played 5 games and done a fair amount of research with the bomb and my load out is as such;

Farsight
Shadowsun
Bodyguard C&C, Multi Spec, Nuero Web Jammer, Drone Controller, Vectored Retro Thrusters ((i love the idea of the commander tau with all his sensors of doom!!!!))
Bodyguard Plasma, Plasma, Target Lock
Bodyguard Plasma, Plasma, Target Lock
Bodyguard Plasma, Plasma, Target Lock
Bodyguard Fusion, Fusion, Target Lock
Bodyguard Missile Pod, Missile Pod, Target Lock Iradium Armour
Bodyguard Missile Pod, Missile Pod, Target Lock Puretide engram
10 gun drones (i understand you need shields though)


I find the missile pods invaluable so I can play a long range game when I need to.

the only thing i waffle on from time to time is adding another fusion suit for a plasma suit, but so far ive bee able to handle all the armor I have faced (i use 2 riptides though)


Example to my mind - an orc army i faced has 2 loota units in the back, 90 or so shootas and a mini nob biker swarm.

turn 1 i use everything but the missiles on the nobs, and the 8 missiles whittle down a loota unit (the riptides handled the other one and tore apart a few shootas as well)

The tactical sweet spot for the star is the middle of the board, you punish those who enter rapid fire range, but also have 36" missiles that ignore cover/twin linked to get those dudes in back that are trying to hurt you.

I also find it essential so you can win the ranged game. The ranged game is when you first see an opponents army and you guess if he can do more damage than you at max range, meaning you have to close with him. With my load out on the suits and 2 riptides I challenge even IG at the ranged game forcing them to come out and play.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2013/05/10 05:23:54


   
Made in gb
Longtime Dakkanaut





So you outrange GK and necrons what about guard and other long range?, you have a max of 12 missiles at 72inches, everything else is 36" inches, I think a good guard player will make you pay hard imo.

40kGlobal AOA member, regular of Overlords podcast club and 4tk gaming store. Blogger @ http://sanguinesons.blogspot.co.uk/
06/2013: 1st at War of the Roses ETC warm up.
08/213: 3rd place double teams at 4tk
09/2013: 7th place, best daemon and non eldar/tau army at Northern Warlords GT
10/2013: 3rd/4th at Battlefield Birmingham
11/2013: 5th at GT heat 3
11/2013: 5th COG 2k at 4tk
01/2014: 34th at Caledonian
03/2014: 3rd GT Final 
   
Made in gb
Focused Fire Warrior




Norwich,UK

Thanks for some good advise

I think the main reason I have gone fusion heavy is to deal with multi wound t4 models more than tanks.

Tac Ticz, Whatz Dat?  
   
Made in us
Regular Dakkanaut




Have you tried switch the farsight bomb into a shadowsight wave? (that's my new name for it ) I have play tested a similar list several times and I am now convinced the list works better with Shadowsun as Warlord. infiltarte still gives you the viable means to deploy where the units you want dead the most will be and with shadowsun as warlord the unit becomes much faster with a 3d6 jump. You're able to deliver a serious punch to the face 1st turn and don' thave to rely on them coming from reserve and put the pts spent on the relay and aegis elsewhere, like on more drones.

This is probably what my list would look like at 1750 (Normally I run this list at 2k).

Shadowsun 135
-Warlord

Farsight 165

Bodyguard (7) 639
1. C&C, MS, Drone C, V Thrusters, N-Chip, IA 117
2. 2 Fusion, TL 67
3. 2 Fusion, TL 67
4. 2 Fusion, TL 67
5. 2 Plasma, TL 67
6. 2 Plasma, TL 67
7. 2 Plasma, TL 67
- 10 Gun Drones 120

Kroot (10) 60
Kroot (10) 60
Kroot (10) 60
Kroot (10) 60

Pathfinders (5) 55
Pathfinders (5) 55
Pathfinders (5) 55

Broadsides (2) 194
- HYMPs, VTs, TL SMSs, 2 Missile Drones
Broadsides (2) 194
- HYMPs, VTs, TL SMSs, 2 Missile Drones



Automatically Appended Next Post:
Another idea for a list I had looked something like this at 1750

Shadowsun 135
-Warlord

Farsight 165

Bodyguard (7) 639
1. C&C, MS, Drone C, V Thrusters, N-Chip, IA 117
2. 2 Fusion, TL 67
3. 2 Fusion, TL 67
4. 2 Fusion, TL 67
5. 2 Plasma, TL 67
6. 2 Plasma, TL 67
7. 2 Plasma, TL 67
- 10 Gun Drones 120

Riptide 190
-Ion, TL SMS, EWO

Kroot (10) 65
- 1 hound
Kroot (10) 65
- 1 hound
Kroot (10) 65
- 1 hound

Tetra 50

Tetra 50

Broadsides (2) 194
- HYMPs, VTs, TL SMSs, 2 Missile Drones

Hammerhead 130
-Ion, TL SMS, Blacksun Filter

Basically, with this list you outflank the kroot and only have stuff on the board that is "harder" to kill or deal with. this list can get away without having a ton of markerlights because the blob squad has TL weapons and ignore cover to begin with and then there's really only 3 units that I'd like to give markerlights to as kroot are only here for objective holding (but can obviously use Markerlights given a certain situation).

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2013/05/10 12:07:14



7000pts
(In Progress)

"I don't need to hold a single objective to win any of the missions" -FlingitNow 
   
Made in gb
Focused Fire Warrior




Norwich,UK

I haven't tried that but it wouldn't work with my libby combo i have been trying. sounds good tho

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/05/10 16:11:04


Tac Ticz, Whatz Dat?  
   
Made in us
Wicked Canoptek Wraith





ajsnips44 wrote:
Have you tried switch the farsight bomb into a shadowsight wave? (that's my new name for it ) I have play tested a similar list several times and I am now convinced the list works better with Shadowsun as Warlord. infiltarte still gives you the viable means to deploy where the units you want dead the most will be and with shadowsun as warlord the unit becomes much faster with a 3d6 jump. You're able to deliver a serious punch to the face 1st turn and don' thave to rely on them coming from reserve and put the pts spent on the relay and aegis elsewhere, like on more drones.

This is probably what my list would look like at 1750 (Normally I run this list at 2k).

Shadowsun 135
-Warlord

Farsight 165

Bodyguard (7) 639
1. C&C, MS, Drone C, V Thrusters, N-Chip, IA 117
2. 2 Fusion, TL 67
3. 2 Fusion, TL 67
4. 2 Fusion, TL 67
5. 2 Plasma, TL 67
6. 2 Plasma, TL 67
7. 2 Plasma, TL 67
- 10 Gun Drones 120

Kroot (10) 60
Kroot (10) 60
Kroot (10) 60
Kroot (10) 60

Pathfinders (5) 55
Pathfinders (5) 55
Pathfinders (5) 55

Broadsides (2) 194
- HYMPs, VTs, TL SMSs, 2 Missile Drones
Broadsides (2) 194
- HYMPs, VTs, TL SMSs, 2 Missile Drones





I really like this list and can't wait to try it. I was wondering, do you think it would be viable to get rid of the broadsides and use the points to reinforce the kroot? You could have full squads of kroot with kroot hounds and krootox starting turn 1 in rapid fire and assault range, backed up by the wave. If you don't go first, you could outflank your entire army. I'm not sure if it would work because kroot are so fragile, but it'd be a hell of an alpha strike.

The key to strategy is not to choose a path to victory, but to choose so that all paths lead to a victory.

War is beautiful because it establishes man’s dominion over the subjugated machinery by means of gas masks, terrifying megaphones, flame throwers, and small tanks. War is beautiful because it initiates the dreamt-of metalization of the human body. War is beautiful because it enriches a flowering meadow with the fiery orchids of machine guns. War is beautiful because it combines the gunfire, the cannonades, the cease-fire, the scents, and the stench of putrefaction into a symphony.
-Filippo Tommaso Marinetti 
   
Made in us
Dakka Veteran




Bay Area

MarkyMark wrote:
So you outrange GK and necrons what about guard and other long range?, you have a max of 12 missiles at 72inches, everything else is 36" inches, I think a good guard player will make you pay hard imo.


I play 1500 pts so at 36" range i have the bellow (then i jump back an average of 10" on 3d6 meaning your long range is further than mine) WHICH IS KEY

7 twin linked plasma gun shots (ignore cover) str 6 ap 2 ((jsj range))
8 twin linked missile shots (ignore cover) str 7
16 twin linked sms missiles (ignore cover and los) str 7 ((i use my nova charge to double shoot sms))
6 ion cannon shots at str 7 ap 3 OR turn it into 2 str 8 small blast

short range you can have the above plus the below and my short range is 18" and i jump back then 10" on average

7 more twin linked plasma shots (ignore cover) str 6 ap 2
4 fusion shots twin linked ignore cover str 8 ap1
20 str 5 twin linked ignore cover pinning str 5 ap 5 carbine shots
((nueral jammer which is AWESOME))


The other part of the ranged game is taking the return fire.

Riptides are high toughness 5 wounds with a 2+ armor and 5++ (can go to 3++ in a pinch)

The bomb all have 2 wounds, 3+ armor, 2+/4+ cover, toughness 4 with one suit at 2+ armor --it also has 10 abalative gun drone wounds

tau suits in general (including riptide) are just super efficient at maximizing their shots at range while limiting most enemies return fire. This is the true power of the deathstar has it nimbly bounces around where it wants to be always being as effective as it wants with all its weapons while limiting the enemies options.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/05/10 16:51:39


   
Made in us
Sergeant Major




Fort Worthless, TX

I prefer to keep my Farsight bomb in reserve. Risky with the rolling but I can put the bomb down exactly where I want and make a dramtic entrance by blowing 2-3 of his units off the board the turn they arrive. An extra D6 of jet pack movement is nothing to get excited about cause its only 3-4 inches a turn. And you still gotta get accross the board. I prefer to come in round 2 and kill all his delicate stuff that he's keeping hidded in the back like units sitting on objectives, artillery, warlord, and such.

My opponent then finds his forces cut in two. One half is trying to advance to the rest of my army while the other is getting bent over the barrel by 9 suits and 14 drones, while jumping from cover to cover.

I run my bomb like this:

Farsight - Warlord
Shadowsun
Bodyguard w/ 2 Fusion Blasters, Targetlock
Bodyguard w/ 2 Fusion Blasters, Targetlock
Bodyguard w/ 2 Plasma Rifles, Targetlock
Bodyguard w/ 2 Plasma Rifles, Targetlock
Bodyguard w/ 2 Plasma Rifles, Targetlock
Bodyguard w/ 2 Plasma Rifles, Targetlock
Bodyguard w/ Vectored Retro Thrusters, Drone Controller, Command and Control Node, Neuroweb Jammer, Counterfire Defense System, and Multi-Spectrum Sensor Suite
14 Gun Drones

I have the drone controller and counter defense system so that my drones fire at BS 3 TL and BS 2 TL when getting charged. It makes a difference. I usually drop down by 2 or 3 units and kill them. If there are a few vehicles all the better. 5 TL fusion blasters take care of them. Termies? They don't like plasma and fusion. A lot of troops you say? 28 TL gun drone shots should do the job. Leave that 36" shooting and jump back crap to the riptides and use the farsight bomb to its full potenial.

Killed Logan and 10 space wolf termies by deepstriking next to logan and unloading on him. He made every look out sir roll he attempted and it still didn't save him. Then finished off the last few termies from another squad with overwatch. I didn't table him because I just ignored his 7 drop pods. But everything else was dead. Next game I killed two tervigons, a flyrant and about 50 devilguants.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2013/05/20 15:27:07


GW - If it ain't broke, fix it until it is. 
   
Made in it
Regular Dakkanaut




 Davespil wrote:
I have the drone controller and counter defense system so that my drones fire at BS 3 TL and BS 2 TL when getting charged.


Sorry to burst your bubble, but this doesn't work. When you fire Overwatch, your BS doesn't matter, you are set to the fixed value 1. Then, the model with Counterfire Defence System has BS2 instead, but this doesn't mean it passes it to drones thanks to Drone Controller. The sequence is something like this: 1) you get assaulted 2) all models fire Overwatch 3) the suit has BS3, and passes it to drones 4) the suit, firing Overwatch but having CDS, can then fire with BS2 (if it had weapons...) 5) the drones, firing Overwatch, will then have their BS dropped to 1. The main point here is that firing Overwatch does not set you to BS1, it makes you fire as if you had BS1. Even if the suit fired Overwatch as if it had BS10, the drones will not benefit from it in any way, since they will always fire as if their BS was 1, no matter what the suit with Drone Controller would do, because the drones themselves don't have CDF.
   
Made in us
Sergeant Major




Fort Worthless, TX

Teschio wrote:
 Davespil wrote:
I have the drone controller and counter defense system so that my drones fire at BS 3 TL and BS 2 TL when getting charged.


Sorry to burst your bubble, but this doesn't work. When you fire Overwatch, your BS doesn't matter, you are set to the fixed value 1. Then, the model with Counterfire Defence System has BS2 instead, but this doesn't mean it passes it to drones thanks to Drone Controller. The sequence is something like this: 1) you get assaulted 2) all models fire Overwatch 3) the suit has BS3, and passes it to drones 4) the suit, firing Overwatch but having CDS, can then fire with BS2 (if it had weapons...) 5) the drones, firing Overwatch, will then have their BS dropped to 1. The main point here is that firing Overwatch does not set you to BS1, it makes you fire as if you had BS1. Even if the suit fired Overwatch as if it had BS10, the drones will not benefit from it in any way, since they will always fire as if their BS was 1, no matter what the suit with Drone Controller would do, because the drones themselves don't have CDF.

The Drone Controller's BS is 2 during overwatch. The drones use the drone controller's BS. Its cute that you made up a lot of extra steps that actually don't exist in the game, though.

GW - If it ain't broke, fix it until it is. 
   
Made in it
Regular Dakkanaut




 Davespil wrote:

The Drone Controller's BS is 2 during overwatch. The drones use the drone controller's BS. Its cute that you made up a lot of extra steps that actually don't exist in the game, though.


Not really.... the Drones use the BS of the suit, it's true. Which means they have BS 3, ALWAYS. Then, when they fire Overwatch, they shoot as if they had BS 1. Their BS is STILL 3 (not 2, the BS of the suit is 3), but they don't use that to hit. You should read again page 13 of the rulebook, Snap Shots. The BS is NOT influenced by taking Snap Shots or firing Overwatch, the models simply do not use their own BS when they do those things, they use the fixed value 1. With CDS, the fixed value is 2 (but the BS of the model is STILL 3). So drones inherit the suit's BS, but do not use it to fire, they use the fixed value 1 because they don't have any rules that modify Overwatch themselves. There is a big dfference between "having BS 1" and "shooting as if you had BS 1". Go check the rulebook which of the two version applies.
   
Made in us
Longtime Dakkanaut




Teschio wrote:
 Davespil wrote:

The Drone Controller's BS is 2 during overwatch. The drones use the drone controller's BS. Its cute that you made up a lot of extra steps that actually don't exist in the game, though.


Not really.... the Drones use the BS of the suit, it's true. Which means they have BS 3, ALWAYS. Then, when they fire Overwatch, they shoot as if they had BS 1. Their BS is STILL 3 (not 2, the BS of the suit is 3), but they don't use that to hit. You should read again page 13 of the rulebook, Snap Shots. The BS is NOT influenced by taking Snap Shots or firing Overwatch, the models simply do not use their own BS when they do those things, they use the fixed value 1. With CDS, the fixed value is 2 (but the BS of the model is STILL 3). So drones inherit the suit's BS, but do not use it to fire, they use the fixed value 1 because they don't have any rules that modify Overwatch themselves. There is a big dfference between "having BS 1" and "shooting as if you had BS 1". Go check the rulebook which of the two version applies.


Teschio, that is one of the cleaner explanations of why the CDS would not transfer I have seen so far.

Till an official FAQ comes out otherwise, I think you will find most TO's will run it as Teschio describes.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2013/05/20 19:03:31


 
   
Made in us
Sergeant Major




Fort Worthless, TX

Teschio wrote:
 Davespil wrote:

The Drone Controller's BS is 2 during overwatch. The drones use the drone controller's BS. Its cute that you made up a lot of extra steps that actually don't exist in the game, though.


Not really.... the Drones use the BS of the suit, it's true. Which means they have BS 3, ALWAYS. Then, when they fire Overwatch, they shoot as if they had BS 1. Their BS is STILL 3 (not 2, the BS of the suit is 3), but they don't use that to hit. You should read again page 13 of the rulebook, Snap Shots. The BS is NOT influenced by taking Snap Shots or firing Overwatch, the models simply do not use their own BS when they do those things, they use the fixed value 1. With CDS, the fixed value is 2 (but the BS of the model is STILL 3). So drones inherit the suit's BS, but do not use it to fire, they use the fixed value 1 because they don't have any rules that modify Overwatch themselves. There is a big dfference between "having BS 1" and "shooting as if you had BS 1". Go check the rulebook which of the two version applies.

Then I should direct you to the Tau codex (which trumps the rulebook). But here it is: "A model with a counterfire defence system fires Overwatch at Ballistic Skill 2, rather than Ballistic Skill 1 ." And "All Gun Drones, Marker Drones and Sniper Drones in the same unit as a model with a drone controller use the bearer's Ballistic Skill instead of their own."

The drone uses the drone controllers BS which is firing at BS 2, if he's firing at a BS of 2. GUESS WHAT HIS BS IS??????? Thats right children, its 2 Cut and dry, don't try weaseling your way out of a rule you don't like.


GW - If it ain't broke, fix it until it is. 
   
Made in it
Regular Dakkanaut




You don't really understand... one thing is to HAVE BS 2, another thing is to SHOOT AS IF YOU HAD BS 2. They seem the same, but they are not. A suit's BS is ALWAYS 3. Then, if he fires Overwatch, he shoots AS IF HE HAD BS 2. But the model's BS is unchanged. And that is what it passes to drones, his full BS 3. And since the drones don't have any special rule, they fire AS IF THEY HAD BS 1, even if their BS is actually 3 (and not 2).

I am not "weaseling" out of anything, i am just reading the rules. You are not. Once again go to page 13 and tell me if it's written that the model firing Overwatch HAS BS 1. It's not. His BS is unchanged, he just uses a different one, a fixed one, when he does. Which in his case is 2, but this is NOT the value it passes to drones.

BTW, i play a Farsight Bomb list myself, and i would be really happy if my 14 drones could fire Overwatch at BS 2. But the rules say otherwise.

This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2013/05/20 19:33:35


 
   
Made in us
Dakka Veteran




Bay Area

Teschio wrote:
You don't really understand... one thing is to HAVE BS 2, another thing is to SHOOT AS IF YOU HAD BS 2. They seem the same, but they are not. A suit's BS is ALWAYS 3. Then, if he fires Overwatch, he shoots AS IF HE HAD BS 2. But the model's BS is unchanged. And that is what it passes to drones, his full BS 3. And since the drones don't have any special rule, they fire AS IF THEY HAD BS 1, even if their BS is actually 3 (and not 2).

I am not "weaseling" out of anything, i am just reading the rules. You are not. Once again go to page 13 and tell me if it's written that the model firing Overwatch HAS BS 1. It's not. His BS is unchanged, he just uses a different one, a fixed one, when he does. Which in his case is 2, but this is NOT the value it passes to drones.

BTW, i play a Farsight Bomb list myself, and i would be really happy if my 14 drones could fire Overwatch at BS 2. But the rules say otherwise.


teschio is right.

You are missing the part on HAVING a BS of 2 vs getting to shoot during overwatch at a BS of 2. Two different things. To say it another way...the BS of a model means ABSOLUTELY NOTHING during overwatch.

   
 
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