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The subject line really says it all.
What do you find the best way to use your land raider gods hammers?
In the backfield making the best use of lascannons? Up close delivering terminators?

The best (and only) way to make use of one is to convert it into a LR Crusader.

I'm not 100% convinced of this myself. In a couple of games, I have wished for my crusader to be a godhammer instead. If the LR is part of a mech list that focuses on shooting rather than assault, the LR can move 6" and fire both lascannons are full BS at different targets. The terminators (or DC) inside can be used to assault whatever threats get close to assault range of the mech formation.

The crusader took a bit of a firepower hit with the passing of defensive weapons. It's still the overall best, I think as it is pretty good at killing troops if it gets the chance to stop moving.

Martel732 wrote:
If the LR is part of a mech list that focuses on shooting rather than assault, the LR can move 6" and fire both lascannons are full BS at different targets.

But that's a complete waste. You have two TL LCs for 250 points. Compare that to Predators and you see how terrible it is. If you're not making good use of the transport capacity and delivering something nasty ASAP then you're just wasting your points.

It's two TL LCs for 250 that give a terminator assault unit a 12" + 2D6 charge range. Using the terminators for "get off my lawn!" duty is a good use of transport capacity. I didn't say it was awesome, but it is a legitimate use of the godhammer configuration, in my opinion.

Well, it's possible to use it as a sit back and shoot bunker. Plop a fragile troops choice and disembark them on an objective on Turn 5. It's not a terribly effective use of 250 points, but it is a use.

I'm inclined to say that a Landraider should generally be pushing up and throwing its weight around. AV14 all around is a tough nut to crack and using that to gain ground and give cover to other advancing armor or foot troops is an incredibly valuable use of the points you invested.

Pretend it's a Proteus/Thread.

Get the chaos variety and pop destroyer blades on it then go and mow down big horde units; after your rock hard chaos loving troops have assaulted from it.

What's a proteus?

If you are fielding a LR and sitting it empty at the back of the table youre playign it wrong.

The LR is designed to delevery assault troops into combat, be it Terminators or whatever. All the whiel popping off LC and HB shaots at targets of opportunity.

If you want a LC platform to sit at the back you are probably better off just using a las-Pred.

It's the only version I own, and being a WYSWYG guy, it's what I field. I've used it in a few different ways.

Almost always it contains 5 assault terminators (2xLC, 3xTH) and a chaplain.

Most of the time it works like this:
Spend the first turn or two standing still or puttering around at 6". Shoot the godhammers at things, watch them blow up. Listen to the gentle patter of anti tank guns spanging off of the AV 14. No melta should be in range, due to being in the middle of my army.

Determine what portion of the battlefield needs a big ol' box-o-pain delivered. Put the peddle down and get over there.

ASSAULT!

Depending on the situation, hop back aboard and head somewhere else, or just assault something else nearby. LR either blows up more things, acts as a giant wall blocking LOS to protect the troops, or eats a melta and dies.

LRRs and LRCs are better at troop delivery, but are very focused. They will mess up whatever they are pointed at, but that's basically troops. Which are generally going to be blended by the assault squad inside. They will do a better job at softening up the target for your boys though.

The classic LR is more of a TAC tank. It can project fire across the table, deliver it's cargo, be a rolling bunker, everything. You pay a premium for this flexibility though, so it's not going to be cost effective at any role. But it can get a lot done. When I'm allocating 1/3 to 1/4 of my army to one basket of pain, I want it to be versatile and cover a lot of bases. The basic LR gives me that. This from a TAC Ultramarine player, YMMV.

Counter-assault.
I will stick something in there that can beat something up if it gets close. In the case of CSM, I will use Abbadon, or some other big threat. If an enemy gets close then you can use it to step out and clobber them.

Armored Shell.
I use them as protection vs Helldrakes and other threats. On the later turns of the game, having scouts/cultists hop out of a land raider and claim an objective can be very good. Since the land raider is so large, its easy to hide the entire squad.

Firing Platforms.
As has been noted, your not paying 230/250 points for the damage output. Your getting two TL LCs and a TL HB. These can be used vs flyers when moving flat out, and will still hit 30% of the time. This lets you take the occasional pot shot into the rear of a helldrake -- and has worked for me in the past.

The old Godhammer is the most flexible Land Raider pattern, as its weapon configuration does not dictate what role the vehicle must follow. Unlike Crusaders or Redeemers, a Godhammer can sit back and fire, or move forward into assault range. Crusaders and Redeemers MUST move into assault range to be useful.

I've spent many a game moving every turn yet staying out of close range while sniping enemy units with my Godhammers (2-3 of them, if the mood suits me), treating them like the honest to god tanks that they actually are, rather than the "assault boats" they can be.

SJ

< taken by the void dragon >

 jeffersonian000 wrote:
The old Godhammer is the most flexible Land Raider pattern, as its weapon configuration does not dictate what role the vehicle must follow. Unlike Crusaders or Redeemers, a Godhammer can sit back and fire, or move forward into assault range. Crusaders and Redeemers MUST move into assault range to be useful.

I've spent many a game moving every turn yet staying out of close range while sniping enemy units with my Godhammers (2-3 of them, if the mood suits me), treating them like the honest to god tanks that they actually are, rather than the "assault boats" they can be.

SJ

Just buy a Helios or Terminus Ultra if you want a sniper.

What's a helios or terminus ultra?

And labmouse is absolutely correct. For instance, I have several BA lists now that are all counter-assault, not assault based. Counter assault is a valid tactic.

I find that the Godhammer is a good overall vehicle, but for more focused lists(as most people tend to build for the sake of fluff AND competitiveness) the other variants are more useful.

The Crusader can carry not only a squad of Termies, but an attached character...and it's weapons aren't a mix of anti-tank and anti-infantry like the Godhammer.

Though, I'm a big fan of the Achilles as far as the LRs go to be honest...as most of my Termies are deepstriking Deathwing style.

As a GK player, ive put a cheap 100 pt purgation squad kitted with 4 incinerators in a LR and you camp an objective. GM makes the squad scoring. Sit stationary and fire 3 weapons, pop out at the end game and roast the objective clean. Winning.

 Farseer Faenyin wrote:
Though, I'm a big fan of the Achilles as far as the LRs go to be honest...as most of my Termies are deepstriking Deathwing style.

The Achilles is hands down better than any of the other varieties. Of course, you need to play with people who allow forge world for that.

Telling people they should play with broken forgeworld units is not a reasonable answer. The godhammer is good for delivering your terminator then backing out of melta range and taking down any mobility your opponent has that they can use to escape your terminators

Martel732 wrote:
What's a helios or terminus ultra?

And labmouse is absolutely correct. For instance, I have several BA lists now that are all counter-assault, not assault based. Counter assault is a valid tactic.

They're very reasonable forgeworld units, the first replacing the dinky heavy bolter that never kills anything with a whirlwind missile launcher, the second removing transport ability to carry another twin linked lascannon and two non twin linked las cannon so you can FIRE YOUR LAZERZ!

I suppose one reason to love the Phobos is that it has a pretty large diameter threat bubble with those lascannons. Even when it's immobilized it can probably still shoot something unlike its cousins in from amongst the standard codex units.

 Che-Vito wrote:
The old Godhammer is the most flexible Land Raider pattern, as its weapon configuration does not dictate what role the vehicle must follow. Unlike Crusaders or Redeemers, a Godhammer can sit back and fire, or move forward into assault range. Crusaders and Redeemers MUST move into assault range to be useful.

In other words, no matter what you do with it you're wasting points. If you sit back and shoot you have an overpriced Predator squadron. If you move up and deliver the passengers you're wasting the guns (especially compared to the Crusader). Flexibility is nice, but not when you're talking about a 500+ point unit.

 Kain wrote:
They're very reasonable forgeworld units, the first replacing the dinky heavy bolter that never kills anything with a whirlwind missile launcher, the second removing transport ability to carry another twin linked lascannon and two non twin linked las cannon so you can FIRE YOUR LAZERZ!

Correction: the Terminus Ultra was an Apocalypse unit posted as a pdf on the GW website. You can't use one in a standard game of 40k.

Also, the Helios is limited to 6 models worth of passengers, which pretty much excludes it from doing the things you buy a LR to do and limits it to being a really overpriced Whirlwind bolted to a Predator squadron.

I honestly think the Helios should swap out transport ability for more long ranged dakka, maybe a hell fire missile launcher? Transport capacity on something never meant to get close seems odd.

I get confused with all the "loyalist" LR variants now....there's so many!....

Godhammer (standard codex LR, right?)
Crusader
Redeemer
Helios
Achilles
Ares
Proteus
Prometheus
Spartan
Terminus Ultra





And now for Chaos....

Land Raider.








doh.

Last time I used mine was sat on a skyshield landing pad for a 4+ invul save. Expensive for a single vehicle you may say, so I stuck a couple of preds on there as well. You could always use some HWS IG allies on there ...

2 TL lascannons are not mind-blowing but they are reliable. You can even shoot them at different targets if one enemy dies from the first one.

And now for Chaos....

Land Raider.

But at least we get a gremlin or imp in the tank that can fire one weapon at full BS, and at a different target, which is a fluffy way of showing the Dark Mecha... What's that? We don't?

Oh right. Because Loyalists...

 Praxiss wrote:
I get confused with all the "loyalist" LR variants now....there's so many!....

Godhammer (standard codex LR, right?)

Technically the standard land raider is the LR Phobos. "Godhammer" is the name of the lascannon pattern it uses. People will use both names to describe the same tank, which is same 2xTLLC, 1xTLHB model the traitors took with them to the Eye of Terror.

But as godhammer is a much cooler sounding name, it gets used more then phobos. (even when incorrect)

And I'm with you on the rampant proliferation of land raider variants. But GW and FW need to sell models, and these are big, expensive, kits. I'm a little surprised chaos didn't get some of the variants in the last codex. I could totally see a redeemer shooting multi-colored flames of tzeench out of those cannons...

I'm surprised there hasn't been more FW chaos stuff in general since the new 'e came out.

Anyway, getting OT. Sorry.

ive been wondering that, why can't CSM have more options? it prevents me from getting LR