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i.e bolters firing at a Flyrant which is T9 thanks to iron arm

Spanks!

Yes, you're only forbidden from charging things you can't hurt.

Not sure why you would want to, though.

 insaniak wrote:
Yes, you're only forbidden from charging things you can't hurt.

Not sure why you would want to, though.

To force Grounding tests.

Believe this is also in a FAQ

Aelyn wrote:

 insaniak wrote:
Yes, you're only forbidden from charging things you can't hurt.

Not sure why you would want to, though.

To force Grounding tests.

Fair point. :p

 insaniak wrote:
Yes, you're only forbidden from charging things you can't hurt.

Have you got a page number for that?
I've missed that one completely

It'd be nice to stop my wraithlords being tarpitted in every game I use them

You have permission to shoot at any unit it does not give you a limitation on it. There is no rule that says you can't shoot at a unit you can't wound. There is a rule that says you can't charge a vehicle you cannot wound, pg 76. There is no rule that prevents infantry from being charged even if the unit charging cannot hurt them verified by pg 5 of the FAQ.

PredaKhaine wrote:

Have you got a page number for that?
I've missed that one completely

It'd be nice to stop my wraithlords being tarpitted in every game I use them

It only applies to vehicles, to stop people from gaining free movement since you're not locked in combat with most vehicles.

 insaniak wrote:

PredaKhaine wrote:

Have you got a page number for that?
I've missed that one completely

It'd be nice to stop my wraithlords being tarpitted in every game I use them

It only applies to vehicles, to stop people from gaining free movement since you're not locked in combat with most vehicles.

I'm not going mad then...
For a second, I thought I'd missed something, but it's back to wraithlords up to the knees in cultists...

Thanks for the prompt response

phew! that nearly scuppered my plan for my next game of chargign guardsmen with myTomb Stalker.

S3 vs T7 - nope.

 Praxiss wrote:
phew! that nearly scuppered my plan for my next game of chargign guardsmen with myTomb Stalker.

S3 vs T7 - nope.

I think what scuppers that plan is the fact that they can fall back.

Yeah, I think the rule is called "Our Weapons are useless!" and it allows them to fall back if they can do no harm to the unit. A tactic against high toughness units is to throw the sergeant away in a challenge then run away, having taken minimal casualties (unless they get swept.)

Ah....poo.

What about if they have grenades that could, in theory wound it? Or does it only apply to their basic strength?

 Praxiss wrote:
Ah....poo.

What about if they have grenades that could, in theory wound it? Or does it only apply to their basic strength?

In the Case of Haywire granades you can in theory "hurt it"... but i dont think i read anywhere that you cant charge a unit you cant hurt, only the case of "our weapons do nothing" that allows you from escaping Walkers or High T monsters.

 Praxiss wrote:
Ah....poo.

What about if they have grenades that could, in theory wound it? Or does it only apply to their basic strength?

You can only use "our weapons are useless" if you cant actually hurt the enemy unit, and this provides no limits on what you can hurt them with. So grenades etc that CAN hurt them disqualify you from using our weapons are useless. Because your weapons arent!

Excellent.

/rubs hands

Everyone seems to forget or not know about that FAQ ruling that you can indeed charge units you cannot hurt. So you can shoot at units you can't hurt and you can charge them too.

Its got to be pretty rare that unit has literally NOTHING that can wound an MC.

This seems to come up in some of my game in regards to night fighting. Can you shoot a vehicle with a weapon that can not penetrate its armour?

Don't see why not, if you couldn't then Markerlights would be a bit pointless.

But theres very little point in shooting, for example, a boltgun at a land raider.

Unless you are shooting a SB at it from a rhino with a searchlight, to light up the target so that your better weaponry can hit it wuthout the cover save advantage

nosferatu1001 wrote:
Unless you are shooting a SB at it from a rhino with a searchlight, to light up the target so that your better weaponry can hit it wuthout the cover save advantage

Show off.

Well the clue was from the poster talking about nightfighting....

nosferatu1001 wrote:
Unless you are shooting a SB at it from a rhino with a searchlight, to light up the target so that your better weaponry can hit it wuthout the cover save advantage

Thats is exactly what I was on about.

 Praxiss wrote:
Its got to be pretty rare that unit has literally NOTHING that can wound an MC.

Guarsdsmen vs T7+; Without Krak grenade upgrade the guardsmen cannot do anything.

Ork Boyz charged by a T7+, cannot do anything.

Pretty much every Eldar and Dark Eldar model(striking scorpions, Wraith -whatever, and incubi can) v. T7+ cannot do anything

Tau Vs T7+, cannot do anything(unless they are in a suit).

Cultists vs T7+; Without Krak grenade upgrade the guardsmen cannot do anything.

Pretty much every Codex other than MEQ Either cannot do anything v. T7+ or require a points costing upgrade to have a slight chance.

I hate it when douches place templates over tanks they can't hurt to snipe models behind them.

 Dozer Blades wrote:
I hate it when douches place templates over tanks they can't hurt to snipe models behind them.

Remember two things though.

1) If the tank is the target unit you must place the template over as much of the hull as possible, so it will limit the hits on the unit behind the tank. (P.52)

2) If the unit behind the tank is out of Line of sight you can not allocate the wounds to the unit as per Page 16 out of sight rules.

Be sure and consider the differences between Blasts and Templates here. Blasts are more useful for this tactic than templates.

I think an example that clarifies "yes they can shoot something even if it can't wound them" are markerlights. They hit but you can't wound. And i can see why you would want to do something like shooting something if it means not wounding them. The only reason that would explain it would be shooting a flying monstous creature and trying to ground said monstrous creature so that other things can shoot/ assault it.

Or, as stated by Nosferatu1001 earlier - to light something up with a searchlight when Nightfighting is in effect.

This is also useful for Deathwing Termies, you have one guy with a stormbolter splitfire his shots onto a vehicle you want to assault that turn while the rest of the shots go at a unit of enemy infantry, then still get to charge the vehicle because it was shot at in the preceeding Shooting phase.