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Can orks be competitive now with out lootas ? Or are the one unit we MUST take in order to have a chance ?

I have held off taking or even owning lootas up till now. I am curious if people have success with out them.

I don't like the idea of "insert" said number of lootas to a list and it works. It appears from my searching and online reading that every list contains lootas, and I really don't like the idea that we must take a certain unit to be effective.

So get lootas ? Or tough it out untill new codex and hope we get more units to use ?

I totally understand where you are coming from Dakkafang.

No, you don't need Lootas to be effective. But you *do* need some killy ranged stuff, because this is a game where killy ranged stuff lines up against other killy ranged stuff and rolls for first turn.

With that in mind, Lootas are generally the best killy ranged stuff we have outside of Forgeworld (Supa Trakk gives them a run for their money!)

Another contender though is kannons/lobbas behind an aegis. They can man a Quad Gun or Lascannon at BS 3 and give re-rolls to the latter, while the Gretchin are completely invulnerable behind the wall because they're too short to be seen!

Dakkajets are also killy and ranged but can be unreliable and die badly to the slightest bit of skyfire.

Yes, just yes
you should have at least 2 units of lootas to get some cross fire.

But if you want to hold out til the new codex, take some tau as allies to fill their roll

Any army can be successful without a certain unit, its just alot harder. For me, not taking lootas does happen, but theyre so valuable that I feel like im really missing something when I dont.

I run battlewagon lists and don't use Lootas. It depends on what list your going for. I see so many Ork list that are just a random list of units with no synergy.

Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Dakkamite wrote:
I totally understand where you are coming from Dakkafang.

No, you don't need Lootas to be effective. But you *do* need some killy ranged stuff, because this is a game where killy ranged stuff lines up against other killy ranged stuff and rolls for first turn.

With that in mind, Lootas are generally the best killy ranged stuff we have outside of Forgeworld (Supa Trakk gives them a run for their money!)

Another contender though is kannons/lobbas behind an aegis. They can man a Quad Gun or Lascannon at BS 3 and give re-rolls to the latter, while the Gretchin are completely invulnerable behind the wall because they're too short to be seen!

Dakkajets are also killy and ranged but can be unreliable and die badly to the slightest bit of skyfire.

kannons are artillery, and confer tougness 7 to the crew now right? so i think they are great!!

Depending on who you play though, Gretchin cannot see over an Aegis wall. That both makes them invincible to standard shooting but also makes them unable to fire the Kannons...

I was like you and I never ever... Ever ran lootas. Just the last couple games I decided to give them a try. Three units of ten... I can honestly say I'm never going to leave home without them now. I always ran 9 grot Landon's and they do amazing things... Now tossing a in 30 lootas to back them up is just sick.

In short, yes you can be competitive without them... I was for the longest time. Do they up your game and help you stomp? Yes

The autocannon is extremely formidable in 6th edition. By extension, so is the deff gun. Need? Maybe not. Good to have? Hell yes.

you don't need them to play or have fun but to be competitive right now yes. And even then its tough to be competitive with orks. I'd get some for now and see what goodies the update brings

 General_Chaos wrote:
I run battlewagon lists and don't use Lootas. It depends on what list your going for. I see so many Ork list that are just a random list of units with no synergy.

I was about to mention this same thing. I often run a Wagon list where I don't use lootas as the wagons just block LoS for them.

Heard a rumor that Ward was on the next Ork dex and lootas will gain the gets hot rule. So like the war buggy in the previous dex lootas may become the awsome unit that gets shelved due to a really poor change over.

Lol, the mighty will fall if that change is put in place. That rule kind of makes sense, but Lootas would need to become dirt cheap to be worth taking them in that case.

Yeah I think 10 points is reasonable.

I'd like to see some kind of klan rules come back they could work it like marks of chaos only instead of making certian units troops they just count as scoring.

Eg:
Death Skullz = Scoring Lootas
Bad Moonz = Scoring Flash Gitz

Bad Moonz = Scoring Flash Gitz

Oh hell yes. Make them scoring and make them less rubbish.

Would prefer it if the Klan differences were a little more than that though. Maybe not quite so much as the difference between Space Marine Chapters, but different characters, special upgrades that only say, Blood Axe Kommandos can take, restrictions on certain unit types perhaps (Snakebits for instance), army wide special rules ~ Goffs perhaps could be 6+ FNP, I'd love to see army rules that were *that* powerful and make Klans a serious aspect of the army.

Lootas are our best long range fire power in codex (read: not forgeworld). They put out tons of mid-strength dakka to pop open transports and the like, which our boys will have a hard time catching up with. That said, you don't NEED them to be successful. I actually used a 3 x 3 Kannons as my heavy support for a few games and they've proven their worth over and over again.

I play a kult of speed so don't use lootas, but haven't been very successful running my old list in 6th ed.

I have been toying with the idea of kitting up a sky shield as an orky fuel depot/garage and sticking 10 - 15 lootas on the top so they benefit from 4+ invulnerable and a greatly improved line of sight..

Sinji wrote:

 General_Chaos wrote:
I run battlewagon lists and don't use Lootas. It depends on what list your going for. I see so many Ork list that are just a random list of units with no synergy.

I was about to mention this same thing. I often run a Wagon list where I don't use lootas as the wagons just block LoS for them.

Heard a rumor that Ward was on the next Ork dex and lootas will gain the gets hot rule. So like the war buggy in the previous dex lootas may become the awsome unit that gets shelved due to a really poor change over.

That get's hot rumor scares me. I'd never use lootas again.

My first turn would go:
hey look, I blew up your transport and lost 1/2 my lootas. oh they ran off the table.

Just rolling the dice would be a pain, because you'd have to roll each loota individually.

Gets Hot by itself would be a ridiculous Loota nerf, but in combination with other changes could be workable, e.g:
- also give lootas some decent armour (e.g. 4+) as protection against their own weapons (sounds orky ) - but seems unlikely, as the models don't look armoured
- a Look Out Sir equivalent that lets a cheap grot assistant take the blast
- mek has a forcefield (small version of KFF) that protects just his squad

I'm a BA player and I'm saying the lootas don't need this nerf. Lootas are fine. I think Ork boyz might be a bit more valuable than what the current rate is, but that's a different can of worms.

Well our codex needs em! not suited for all lists but they are one of the top units in our book. i tried the ork gun line once (kannons and 3x10 lootas tons of fun but doesnt feel that orky (sure sure if you are a deathskull but i like speedy lists and greentide too!)

The one time I took Lootas, they were destroyed my a single squad of raptors...
So if you can keep them out of close combat then yes. Lootas are good.

Stuff dies in 6th edition left and right. You just kind of have to accept it. The lootas could just as easily die to a whirlwind round or a deep striking warp spiders.

I could accept that a guy dies if you roll a generic 1 when rolling you D3 ammount of shots. But gets hot would really suck.

Who thinks Kommandos should get tank busta bombs and who thinks burnas should be AP2 Armourbane in CC mode?

 Overlord Thraka wrote:
The one time I took Lootas, they were destroyed my a single squad of raptors...
So if you can keep them out of close combat then yes. Lootas are good.

They're just like regular boys in CC, just more expensive. Plus with up to 3 Mek boys, you can keep challenging and tie up some nasty IC or MC if they got to close.

Lootas are great, but I still think theyre a bit pricey in points for what you get, especially considering how fast they die to anything. Same stats as a boy but 15 points for that gun.

I ran them today. Unit #1 tanked two Manticore shots due to Area cover and then killed a bunch of nothing. Unit #2 gave first blood dying to three of those 20 shot IG tanks massacring the living daylights out of them.

What you really need in this game generally is something that can shoot (actually, quite a few things that can shoot). Lootas are a very strong option in this regard, but they're certainly not the only one, so they're certainly not necessary.

One thing I do think becomes necessary if you're taking lootas is an Aegis Defence Line, or maybe a Landing Pad. You'll want some terrain to help keep your Loota line kicking and those are the ways to do it. And if you're going lootas, probably don't just take one mob.

Some other very nice shooting options for orks, however, include:

--Boomgun Looted Wagons (always in multiples and always hiding amongst bigger more obviously scary targets-- i.e., in wagon lists only!)
--Dakkajets (in pairs)
--Kannons and Lobbas
--Grot Mini- and Mega- Tanks (if you're using FW)
--Supa Trakks (again, FW only)
--Tau Allies (Looted Riptides and Broadsides, Stormboy Vespids, Sneeky Shoota Kroot)
--Necron Allies (Runtbot/Tinboy Warriors, Looted Barges)

There are actually quite a few different ways you can go successfully with Orks. Play around and mix and match them. Different options work better with different core builds, but you can still have success a few different ways. The Ork codex hasn't become a one-trick pony just yet.

Seconding the Supa Trakk and Lobba batteries, both of these are damn good. The Lobbas in particular are fantastic for their points cost. However, I don't think I agree with Grot tanks - I love the idea but they're just not shooty enough IMO

Adding ~Looted Necron Heavy Destroyer, ~Grot Bomm Launcha/Junka+Grot Bomms, and ~Aegis with Lascannon, fired by a Kannon battery with ammo runts. Also the name Tin 'eads for Looted Necron Warriors

Allied IG platoon loaded with Lascannons, Sabre's with TL-Lascannons, a Vendetta and an Earthshaker Gun Battery. Gives a solid back field scoring unit and gives some good ranged anti-tank/air that the Orks lack. Orks can move up and smash things which is where Guard is weak. Between both Armies you can Spam AV14 like no other army can.

Little saying from the military kinda relates here.

One is none, two is one, if you're going to bring one might as well bring two.