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Hi Dakka, got a game coming up.

I'm facing a pure Genestealer army. It's like:

1x Hive Tyrant
6x Lictors
Everything Else = Genestealer Broods

I'll have:

1x Librarian
1x Assault Terminators
2x Scouts
2x Stormtalon Gunships
Everything Else = Tactical Squads (1 Flamer & 1 Missile Launcher each)

Both armies belong to my buddy. He just made the Genestealer one.

He just loves himself some melee. He'll infiltrate probably his whole force.

The game is happening tomorrow. Any advice welcome.

aren't genestealers 4+ saves? take lots of razorbacks. that'll mincemeat 'em!

A few things:

1. He has to Infiltrate, its not an option anymore. If he doesn't Infiltrate he can Outflank or just be held in Reserve, but that's it. He can't deploy normally.

2. Your scouts will just be eaten up. I'd Reserve/Outflank them depending on where you place the Objectives.

3. Don't let him touch you! I6 and Rending is gross. It is unfortunate you don't have any Rhinos... Very unfortunate. He has nothing that could deal with it.

4. Your Stormtalon Gunships are invincible, he has nothing that can hurt it if that Tyrant doesn't have Wings. I hope its full of dakka.

5. AP 5 weapons will help you. Flamers are a must. Try to hit him out of cover. Focus Fire if you need to.

6. Are these regular Genestealers or Ymgarl Genestealers? Regular Genestealers will never be able to assault you on turn 1, which is why they normally get left at home.

And the most important piece of advice: Play the mission, not his army. This is a game of Objectives. Even the Kill Point games are games of Objectives. He is going to mess you up when he gets in close, but you just need to have more objectives held by troops than him at the end of the game.


Honestly, your buddy's SM list isn't optimal for dealing with his 'Nid list. Hopefully that wasn't intentional, but you're going to have an ugly time of it.

Ymgarls are elites I believe.

That's right. Forgot about that. Well, then he's got a turn of shooting guaranteed and AP 5 will shred them (Ymgarls are 4+; Genestealers are 5+). He just needs to stay out of close combat for as long as possible and preferably go second for late game objective nabbing/denying.

I would recommend using drop pods, terminators, and jump packs. Genestealers get a lot of their strength from being able to attack first turn(in many cases) so disallowing that will be a good start. Now they could of course just come in later on, but setting up your forces so the GS will to spread to be greatly effective, is going to be the best way to take them down. Of course, vehicles will also work very well, a LR Redeemer will tear through them in not time, and Razorbacks will do the same. Large teams of Devastators set in the back, behind a Tac squad or two, will also be able to combat them well.

As for the Lictors, he will probably use the pheremone trail rule, and just have all his troops come in on them. I use a bait and switch to deal with them. Just set up a unit that is obviously unprotected and will be a good target, and set it up so you can drop/deepstrike/drive/or run into position behind them to take them out. Terminators are excellent for these kinds of things, a couple units of 5 accompanied by podding Tac squads and support fire from the gunships.

I agree with the above.

Also: Use the Talons to drop the tyrant.
Templates are your friends in the early shooting.
Don't bunch up. Avoid giving him multi assault chances.
Pay attention to his Synaps creatures. These should take priority.

Synapse in this case is largely useless. The only benefit that GS get from Synapse is Fearless. As was stated, focus fire and templates are your friends against Genestealers.

Sternguards would be a great addition for your army you could ask to swap a tactical for a squad of them.

BTW, I think you guys missed the part where his army was chosen for him by his opponent.

I mean some of this depends on how many tacticals and how many Genestealers. Also how big are the scout squads, and how are the equiped. and how much terrain is on the table.

My intitial thoughts.

1.) If you can infiltrate prior to him (win the roll off) infiltrate your scouts to push back his stealers further from the rest of your army (he must be > 18" away from your units.).

2.) IF you are going first deploy your troops as far forward in your deployment as possible (so you have room to fall back), if he infiltrates 18" away fall back 6" and fire your bolters.

3.) Combat squad everything you can. It makes it more likely that he will only be assaulting small units and killing them in his turn, that way you can shoot him on your turn.

4.)Stand in terrain, if he assaults into terrain with no grenades, you will swing first and kill more of his stuff, it also makes it more likely that he will fail an assault.

Hi guys, thanks for the quick feedback, really appreciated.

I won't get much choice in the army list, unfortunately.

So what you guys said was right, there are simple hard counters.

But I'm going to just play with the hand I've been dealt.

cowmonaut wrote:A few things:

2. Your scouts will just be eaten up. I'd Reserve/Outflank them depending on where you place the Objectives.

6. Are these regular Genestealers or Ymgarl Genestealers? Regular Genestealers will never be able to assault you on turn 1, which is why they normally get left at home.

Honestly, your buddy's SM list isn't optimal for dealing with his 'Nid list. Hopefully that wasn't intentional, but you're going to have an ugly time of it.

Yeah, the Scouts. My initial thought was to Reserve/Outflank/late Objective grab as well.

The Genestealers will be regular ones mostly. Maybe 1 or 2 broods of Ymgarl.

For the record, I don't think my buddy is deliberately sabotaging the Marine army.

He just has an infantry-oriented approach to all armies, like on cover art.

helgrenze wrote: Don't bunch up. Avoid giving him multi assault chances.

I agree. It's going to be about splitting his army. With all melee, he has few options.

Breng77 wrote:Also how big are the scout squads, and how are the equiped. and how much terrain is on the table.

1.) If you can infiltrate prior to him (win the roll off) infiltrate your scouts to push back his stealers further from the rest of your army (he must be > 18" away from your units.).

2.) IF you are going first deploy your troops as far forward in your deployment as possible (so you have room to fall back), if he infiltrates 18" away fall back 6" and fire your bolters.

3.) Combat squad everything you can. It makes it more likely that he will only be assaulting small units and killing them in his turn, that way you can shoot him on your turn.

4.)Stand in terrain, if he assaults into terrain with no grenades, you will swing first and kill more of his stuff, it also makes it more likely that he will fail an assault.

The Scout Squads are 5-man each. One has all Snipers. The other has Shotguns, IIRC.

I think it's an interesting notion to use the Scouts to "push back".

His whole advantage was to Infiltrate his whole Genestealer army.

I think it's real interesting Scouts are doing what they're supposed to...scouting ahead.

Definitely going to Combat Squad. The Tacs will be 1 Flamer & 1 Missile Launcher.

Probably split them up so if he finishes a Combat Squad with a brood, they just get shot at.

Good point on terrain.

I'm headed to bed for now, so I will keep up with this thread when I wake.

If he really wanted pure genestealers he should have gotten Ymgarls.

In any case, Genestealers don't like two things, overwatch and assaulting through cover. Flamers are your best bet here.

Flamer dreads can also be surprisingly effective as they'll struggle to glance it and it can pulp each one with a punch.

Don't rely on Termies, Genestealers have been a hard counter to Terminators since Space Hulk. They will hit first, and they will dump enough rending attacks to cut your expensive, low attack termies into ribbons.

If you want vehicles, go for vehicles that can dump out a lot of shots or templates, Whirlwinds will serve you better than Preds here.

Lictors you can just punch in the face with a power fist and turn them inside out, they're only really going to be a threat if they can get to the rear of a vehicle and unleash their flesh hooks.

That lone hive tyrant you can pretty much just ignore. If you really want it dead, one good shot will send it to the ground at which point you can fist it to death.

Genestealers got no grenades... just stay in cover and you will be fine. You still got to shoot a bunch first though... 8)

Land raider crusader/redeemer + the assault termies.

It's going to be very hard for him to kill it, especially if you focus on killing his Tyrant. Aside from that, just do as everyone else says; play the mission and keep very mobile and shooty.

A particular, pretty fun tactic: put some sternguad in a rhino, combat squadded. 5 of them move onto an objective, the other 5 stay in the rhino. Give the rhino squad 2 heavy flamers. Run around shooting them out of the firing points, killing off genestealers.

That being said, really:

Fliers + flamers + heavy armor + troops holding objectives (hopefully in cover) should equal victory

 Kommissar Waaaghrick wrote:

The Scout Squads are 5-man each. One has all Snipers. The other has Shotguns, IIRC.

I think it's an interesting notion to use the Scouts to "push back".

His whole advantage was to Infiltrate his whole Genestealer army.

I think it's real interesting Scouts are doing what they're supposed to...scouting ahead.

Definitely going to Combat Squad. The Tacs will be 1 Flamer & 1 Missile Launcher.

Probably split them up so if he finishes a Combat Squad with a brood, they just get shot at.

Good point on terrain.

I'm headed to bed for now, so I will keep up with this thread when I wake.

Another thought I had on infiltrating the scouts, if you are able to do so, they can then scout back 6" after denying him the position, meaning you can force him to be >24" from your closest models.

If he is Playing Ymgarl stealers at all make sure to use your units to block off any nearby terrain pieces, so he cannot deploy them nearby.

As for your termies If you can use cover for them they can make a good Screen, if the Stealers assault them through terrain the termies will win more often than not.

I'm getting ready to go out to wage this battle.

Wish me luck, all.

Quick last tip, but everything in this army has rending, except the tyrant who ignores saves.
Keep as much distance as you can.

The termies are nice, but i'd ignore them as they will die just as easily as a marine to the stealers.

Libby - Take him, he will have a use.

Assault termies - Leave them at home.

Scouts - What are they armed with? if you need to make up points, then use them.

Talons - take them, they are near on invincible.

Tacs - As many as you can fit into lists.
Combat squad them though, so they can only assault 5 marines at a time.
The flamer and launcher are both pretty damn useful for hunting stealers.

 Hashbeth wrote:
Land raider crusader/redeemer + the assault termies.

It's going to be very hard for him to kill it, especially if you focus on killing his Tyrant. Aside from that, just do as everyone else says; play the mission and keep very mobile and shooty.

A particular, pretty fun tactic: put some sternguad in a rhino, combat squadded. 5 of them move onto an objective, the other 5 stay in the rhino. Give the rhino squad 2 heavy flamers. Run around shooting them out of the firing points, killing off genestealers.

That being said, really:

Fliers + flamers + heavy armor + troops holding objectives (hopefully in cover) should equal victory

Redeemers make MC light Tyranid armies cry very, very hard.