Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

I've been looking at a bunch of stuff people have been saying about the 'meta' that currently exists, boiling down to Flyerspam, Fast Assault, and Infantry Hordes. With Monstrous Creatures added to the horde list, this makes up a lot of the tough lists that people play today. A lot of people have been railing at the recent spat of really tough MCs, and the response is typically 'ignore them unless you're playing Dark Eldar.' Artillery are also pretty powerful this edition, at least in the form of things like Thunderfire cannons and now the new Vaul's Wrath Support Battery, not to mention the nonsense that is the Forgeworld Thudd Gun. High toughness wounds parked in cover (or with a 2+ or 3+) are pretty tough to take out, especially when you've only have the capacity to get a few high S wounds on them.

On account of all of this, I'm starting to take a serious look at the ability of the Dark Eldar Codex to 'bust the meta' so to speak. Poison weapons basically ignore some of the rules of the game, in that they totally ignore the toughness of what they're shooting at. The ability to throw lots of poisoned shots at a Riptide or Wraithknight or TMC is pretty damn powerful when more and more armies are getting and using stuff with high T.

What does everyone else think? Is Dark Eldar a new way to go now, to actually engage these mass MC/mass infantry lists? Is the standard mass raider/mass venom build actually effective against these armies, or are they too paper-thin against the firepower of the other factions? With the new Eldar Codex, how are the existing Dark Eldar/Eldar Deathstars, and/or do Eldar have anything to offer in a meta-busting army?

tl;dr Dark Eldar in theory seems to be good against some top lists, how true is this?

Its just situational, as are most things.

Yay, DE kill MC's, so do most armies.
Infact, eldar do it even better now with bladestorm rules.

Its a case of matching up armies.

DE will tear though a nid army with ease.
Much like GK tear through daemons.
Or IG shoot down anything in the sky (vendet's)

Yes, we are seeing a lot more foot/MC lists at tournaments these days, and yes, that's playing right to DE's strengths. The codex IS starting to show its age however with how plentiful cover saves are becoming thanks to prevalence of Stealth/Shrouded and the ADL. Despite having flyers of their own, DE also have problems with flyer-heavy lists, since our flyers aren't Vendettas and compete with Ravagers for slots.

The mech DE "Yacht Club" of Venoms and Raiders still does well, but you'll need ways to get around high cover saves and flyers if you want to go far with it.

I think for Dark Eldar to preform at peak preformance the addition of Eldar Allies is a must. Venom/ Jet bike spam work great for me with the old Eldar Codex and I can't wait to pick up the new dex as pretty much everything got better or cheaper or both.

Venom spam is good with the lack of vehicles now, a friend of mine gave my FMC list its first loss with his splinter cannon spam army and won a local tourny with it, he is now taking it to a much bigger tourny in two weeks which I will also probably be taking my FMC list.

the codex IS starting to show its age however with how plentiful cover saves are becoming thanks to prevalence of Stealth/Shrouded and the ADL. Despite having flyers of their own, DE also have problems with flyer-heavy lists, since our flyers aren't Vendettas and compete with Ravagers for slots.

I think for Dark Eldar to preform at peak preformance the addition of Eldar Allies is a must. Venom/ Jet bike spam work great for me with the old Eldar Codex and I can't wait to pick up the new dex as pretty much everything got better or cheaper or both.

Yes, the codex hasn't aged that well, there's a lot of junk options. Yeah Cover Saves and Flyers are the tough part.

Eldar Allies could probably help with Flyers at least a bit, with War Walkers, Dark Reapers + Guide/Prescience, and maybe the Crimson Hunter. Not knowing the Dark Eldar Codex that well, are Ravagers generally considered better than Razorwing Jetfighters? Is the amount of Skyfire possible now really that bad for the AV10 of the flyer? Would something like 2 Razorwings, 1 Ravager, and 1 Crimson Hunter sound like something good?

Not sure how much Cover Ignorance there is in the Eldar Codex, apart from Dark Reapers (partially) and Reveal(only if the enemy has shrouded or stealth). Maybe Tau allies could help, even though they're desperate. CSM Allies with a Heldrake would also help, but again run into the Desperate Allies problem. Maybe taking a Spiritseer is preferable, both to get that cover removal and to unlock a tough scoring unit, something DE really lack. Spiritseer + Wraithguard in Wave Serpent(s) and/or guardian jetbikes + War Walkers or Wraithknight might not be a bad idea. Farseer double TL is so good though, even with the total nerfing of Runes of Warding.

As enemies are rapidly become able to remove cover saves, I think flickerfields are now probably mandatory again on vehicles, both to protect against markerlights/heldrakes, and to protect against giving out first blood if you go second.

 Thariinye wrote:

Eldar Allies could probably help with Flyers at least a bit, with War Walkers, Dark Reapers + Guide/Prescience, and maybe the Crimson Hunter. Not knowing the Dark Eldar Codex that well, are Ravagers generally considered better than Razorwing Jetfighters? Is the amount of Skyfire possible now really that bad for the AV10 of the flyer? Would something like 2 Razorwings, 1 Ravager, and 1 Crimson Hunter sound like something good?

Not sure how much Cover Ignorance there is in the Eldar Codex, apart from Dark Reapers (partially) and Reveal(only if the enemy has shrouded or stealth). Maybe Tau allies could help, even though they're desperate. CSM Allies with a Heldrake would also help, but again run into the Desperate Allies problem. Maybe taking a Spiritseer is preferable, both to get that cover removal and to unlock a tough scoring unit, something DE really lack. Spiritseer + Wraithguard in Wave Serpent(s) and/or guardian jetbikes + War Walkers or Wraithknight might not be a bad idea. Farseer double TL is so good though, even with the total nerfing of Runes of Warding.

As enemies are rapidly become able to remove cover saves, I think flickerfields are now probably mandatory again on vehicles, both to protect against markerlights/heldrakes, and to protect against giving out first blood if you go second.

The problem is that a lot of the good AA units in the Eldar book compete for slots. War Walkers and Dark Reapers, for example, or Crimson Hunters and Warp Spyders. Generally yes, the other HS options in the DE book are inferior to Ravagers. If you're going to take a DE plane, my preference is for the Voidraven over Razorwings and usually only one, since taking multiple planes means just one Ravager sitting there for a turn or two. That means it gets popped sooner and you have no more dark lances for a bit. Bad times.

Eldar also get the Night Spinner, which has Barrage and Torrent modes of fire to get around cover saves. Conceal/Reveal is great but short-ranged and I'm not sure if a Spiritseer is worth it over a Farseer giving rerolls to multiple venoms per turn.

I run pure Venoms for my transports, so flickerfields are great. I would definitely purchase them for Raiders if I took any. Night Shields are also a great upgrade and something I take standard on all my vehicles nowadays. Helps a lot with Tau and Necrons.