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Hey guys,

I just wanted to hear your thoughts on this. I frequently travel between my home country and the US (studying there), but most of the time I'm free to play 40k is back home over the breaks. However, the cost of GW products here is abyssmally high, like Aussie-price high. The Wraithknight here, for example, is 50 USD above GW retail (and this is the average price range for 40k at home). Hassle of bringing them back aside, I can easily get boxed sets from the US at 20% off from places like The Warstore rather than paying the price premium. However, my FLGS provides a community, painting stations, and gaming tables without any membership fee, open to everyone, so they rely on their in-store sales to survive. From a business perspective, gaming and painting table space is shelf space that they're not using, so this is essentially something that they take on as a loss for themselves. Right now I'm torn between wanting to save money for myself (especially when I'm doing conversion work and bashing up 2 to 3 good kits to make something) and supporting the store so it can stay open. As a result, I buy some things in the US, and some things back home.

At what point in time does it just become unreasonable for myself to spend a huge premium just to support my FLGS, and do you guys feel that I should be completely unscrupulous and just buy everything from the US? Should I buy more from my FLGS? Or should I just keep doing what I'm doing of doing half-and-half?

You're looking at it backwards.

The gaming space that your store provides is nothing more than an incentive to get people to spend time in the store, in the hope that they will spend money while they are there.

You are under no obligation to pay for this service if no payment is asked for. The store needs to make it worth your while to spend money there.

If their providing gaming space balances out the prices, then by all means support them to whatever degree you deem appropriate. But if the prices they are charging don't seem like a fair exchange for the service offered, buying out of some perceived obligation isn't going to get that message across to the store.

I stand by the mantra "Pay where you Play".
If you want your FLGS to stay open for you to play/paint/hang out, you need to buy your stuff there, or don't be surprised if it shuts and you have nowhere to play.

Some gaming stores adopt the "pay to play" option, they charge you for using their space to play games. For example a store where I live charges players $5 every time they play at the store. Personally I would like it if they didn't charge anything and rather I bought something since at least I'm getting model out of the deal and they get paid full price for it. But to each their own, and its either that store or the tyrannical GW store which wont even let you play unless your army is 1000% GW....god forbid if you use 3rd party paint or your models will explode....eh sorry got off topic there

/rant.

 Spartan089 wrote:
Some gaming stores adopt the "pay to play" option, they charge you for using their space to play games. For example a store where I live charges players $5 every time they play at the store. Personally I would like it if they didn't charge anything and rather I bought something since at least I'm getting model out of the deal and they get paid full price for it. But to each their own, and its either that store or the tyrannical GW store which wont even let you play unless your army is 1000% GW....god forbid if you use 3rd party paint or your models will explode....eh sorry got off topic there

/rant.

Pay 5$ to play, shop online to balance it ou via savings on models

One local FLGS, which dealt more with CCGs than minis, had something of a pay-for-play deal. You could pay a daily fee to hang out, or buy a "membership" for the month for $20, which in turn they gave you a punch card for $21 in store credit (in $1 increments). That meant they got $20 in guaranteed sales from you, and you got more for your money, assuming you were going to spend $20 that month anyways. It stabilized their income somewhat, and customers didn't feel like they were getting a raw deal. At the very worst, you got an extra soda or candy bar out of it.

Plus it meant that there were fewer malingerers who would use the store without contributing to the store, which meant it was easier for you to find table space.

And of course, if you were paying to participate in an event (tournament, pre-release, etc.) you were not obligated to pay. I think this is a "best of both worlds" operating model.

 Sigvatr wrote:

 Spartan089 wrote:
Some gaming stores adopt the "pay to play" option, they charge you for using their space to play games. For example a store where I live charges players $5 every time they play at the store. Personally I would like it if they didn't charge anything and rather I bought something since at least I'm getting model out of the deal and they get paid full price for it. But to each their own, and its either that store or the tyrannical GW store which wont even let you play unless your army is 1000% GW....god forbid if you use 3rd party paint or your models will explode....eh sorry got off topic there

/rant.

Pay 5$ to play, shop online to balance it ou via savings on models

Exactly if you're not able to get at least 40% off of your GW fix you're getting a raw deal. Also who needs a FLGS in the US. You should be playing the game in your basement with your friends. The only time you should get out of the basement is when there is a tournament sponsored by some FLGS that is begging for you to buy something. You should laugh at them while you complain about their tournament not being up to your standards and then go online for sympathy that you lost. You didn't lose because someone was better, you lost because of an inept TO.

In all honesty, I would suggest doing what you're comfortable with. Contrary to popular belief, gaming space does not translate to more sales as the floor space can be used to sell another product and provide a new revenue stream that would make more than the incremental wargame sales, or they could allow that space to be used by M:TG players who tend to buy a higher margin product. Pack more of them in and they will sell more boxes of cards.

boyd wrote:

 Sigvatr wrote:

 Spartan089 wrote:
Some gaming stores adopt the "pay to play" option, they charge you for using their space to play games. For example a store where I live charges players $5 every time they play at the store. Personally I would like it if they didn't charge anything and rather I bought something since at least I'm getting model out of the deal and they get paid full price for it. But to each their own, and its either that store or the tyrannical GW store which wont even let you play unless your army is 1000% GW....god forbid if you use 3rd party paint or your models will explode....eh sorry got off topic there

/rant.

Pay 5$ to play, shop online to balance it ou via savings on models

Exactly if you're not able to get at least 40% off of your GW fix you're getting a raw deal. Also who needs a FLGS in the US. You should be playing the game in your basement with your friends. The only time you should get out of the basement is when there is a tournament sponsored by some FLGS that is begging for you to buy something. You should laugh at them while you complain about their tournament not being up to your standards and then go online for sympathy that you lost. You didn't lose because someone was better, you lost because of an inept TO.

In all honesty, I would suggest doing what you're comfortable with. Contrary to popular belief, gaming space does not translate to more sales as the floor space can be used to sell another product and provide a new revenue stream that would make more than the incremental wargame sales, or they could allow that space to be used by M:TG players who tend to buy a higher margin product. Pack more of them in and they will sell more boxes of cards.

Not my point. My point is that if you force your customers to pay for playing, they might be more likely to keep buying online.

I'm a firm believer in supporting your FLGS, but sometimes you do need to watch how much you spend. You could compromise, and buy some stuff cheap, and take the money you save and buy at your local store. Does your FLGS sell food/drinks/snacks? You could make an effort to impulse buy little stuff to help keep the doors open.

I have watched a number of FLGS come and go. The times between them are dark eras, where the only games I get to play are in my basement, with one or two of the same guys. Life is so much better with a game store, and a lot of them are on the ragged edge of going out of business. If you have a good one, take care of it.

The avenue I took is this:

1) Buy smaller items form the store like paint, brushes or other items that are priced competitively.

2) If you are making a purchase on something which the LGS is not as competitive, buy in bulk instead of multiple small orders. Ask them what they can do for a discount due to the bulk purchase. If they come off the price and are within a reasonable amount of your preferred price, buy from them.

3) Buy when they have sales.

4) It they won't offer item 2 or 3, buy online because it's a delta in pricing that is significant. Buying used models helps with the "morality" of it if you feel guilty about buying new.

5) If they cop an attitude about you buying items not from their store, point out items 2 and 3 above basically stating they don't discount at all and we're talking big bucks. In some cases, buying online saves 30%, which is $150 on $500 MSRP. $150 is a lot of money for some people. Also point out that you gave them an opportunity which they declined. If the attitude continues, find a new LGS.

 insaniak wrote:
You're looking at it backwards.

The gaming space that your store provides is nothing more than an incentive to get people to spend time in the store, in the hope that they will spend money while they are there.

You are under no obligation to pay for this service if no payment is asked for. The store needs to make it worth your while to spend money there.

If their providing gaming space balances out the prices, then by all means support them to whatever degree you deem appropriate. But if the prices they are charging don't seem like a fair exchange for the service offered, buying out of some perceived obligation isn't going to get that message across to the store.

I agree. And if your on the fence then it seems like they maybe aren't doing enough to make it worth your while


Automatically Appended Next Post:

boyd wrote:

 Sigvatr wrote:

 Spartan089 wrote:
Some gaming stores adopt the "pay to play" option, they charge you for using their space to play games. For example a store where I live charges players $5 every time they play at the store. Personally I would like it if they didn't charge anything and rather I bought something since at least I'm getting model out of the deal and they get paid full price for it. But to each their own, and its either that store or the tyrannical GW store which wont even let you play unless your army is 1000% GW....god forbid if you use 3rd party paint or your models will explode....eh sorry got off topic there

/rant.

Pay 5$ to play, shop online to balance it ou via savings on models

Exactly if you're not able to get at least 40% off of your GW fix you're getting a raw deal. Also who needs a FLGS in the US. You should be playing the game in your basement with your friends. The only time you should get out of the basement is when there is a tournament sponsored by some FLGS that is begging for you to buy something. You should laugh at them while you complain about their tournament not being up to your standards and then go online for sympathy that you lost. You didn't lose because someone was better, you lost because of an inept TO.

In all honesty, I would suggest doing what you're comfortable with. Contrary to popular belief, gaming space does not translate to more sales as the floor space can be used to sell another product and provide a new revenue stream that would make more than the incremental wargame sales, or they could allow that space to be used by M:TG players who tend to buy a higher margin product. Pack more of them in and they will sell more boxes of cards.

Is magic a higher margin? But your right that they due to the nature of the game and the scene, they shift WAY more. I would be very surprised if a store could survive without a large contingent of CCG/TCG/LCG Players

I think it would be in some sense rude to play in a shop, taking advantage of their facilities, and not pay something back by buying stuff there.

However if you want to look at it as a value for money proposition, only you can decide in your individual case whether you are getting the value of playing facilities that the higher price of the models is supporting.

My view is I am not interested in playing in shops. I would rather play in a club or pub, and in either case I would expect to support the venue by fees or buying beer.

A lot of posters seem to be paying attention to this:

 Enigwolf wrote:
the cost of GW products here is abyssmally high, like Aussie-price high. The Wraithknight here, for example, is 50 USD above GW retail

and ignoring completely the immediately following caveat:

 Enigwolf wrote:
(and this is the average price range for 40k at home).

His FLGS is charging more than US retail, but is not gouging relative to other shops in the area. They are charging the same prices as other stores, but providing a community gaming space which he uses and appreciates.

I think that Enigwolf is doing the right thing now. He wants his gaming store to survive, and he wants them to maintain a gaming space. They are providing a service that he values, so he's paying a price for that, even if he's not obligated to do so. It is in his interests to have the gaming store continue operation, so he's spending money in his own interest.

People are saying that he's "under no obligation" to spend money there, and the store needs to make it 'worth his while'. This is, of course, true, but it's a very narrow, legalistic view of things, and doesn't take into account the underlying reality of the situation. You're under no "obligation" to be pleasant to your spouse or significant other, either. You're under no 'obligation' to get your kids things for their birthday, or to be nice to your neighbors. However, if you want those people to like you and value your company, you might want to be nice to them. He admits that the store, under no obligation themselves, provides a free gaming space for the community, and he uses and values that resource.

Personally, one of the things I try to do to support my FLGS is shop often if I can't shop big. Not only do I shop around for large purchases, I also have a lot of models already, so I don't tend to make a lot of purchases of new models. However, I try to buy something whenever I use the space. Even if that's just a pot of paint or a new brush, I buy something. That way, the operator associates my presence with buying stuff. I don't come in and take up space. When I'm there, I'm supporting the store. If you are there a lot, even minor purchases add up, both financially, and for building goodwill.

I don't think you should feel any compulsion to burn money because GW don't want to have more consistent world wide pricing.

IMO, it's up to the consumer to get a product as cheap as they can within their own requirements (if you need something tomorrow, no point ordering it from somewhere that's going to take 2 weeks to ship even if it's cheaper).

If the store feels too many people are "freeloading" on their tables, it's up to them to institute policies to either prevent freeloaders from using tables, give freeloaders incentive to buy things or as people have mentioned have some sort of membership required to play on the tables.

Now, if you want to support your local FLGS, then sure, go for it, but I don't think you should feel compelled to do that. I don't feel compelled to buy GW models from my FLGS compared to internationally because I know the price difference isn't actually going to my FLGS, it's going to GW and my FLGS is actually reducing their margins below RRP trying to compete. I honestly don't think my FLGS owner cares whether or not I buy new models from him because it seems to be more of a hassle to order them in as they're rarely on the shelves and he doesn't actually make much off them anyway.

But I do like to support my FLGS, I've been going there for 17 years and he used to give me big discounts as a little kid buying models with stacks of loose change I'd earned doing chores. However I support him by buying things like paints, brushes, glues and also buying 2nd hand miniatures that people have traded to him even though I could probably get them cheaper on ebay, as I know he gets a far greater margin on those than he gets on brand new models.

I want to support HIM, not GW's insane pricing systems.

 Enigwolf wrote:
Hey guys,
Hassle of bringing them back aside, I can easily get boxed sets from the US at 20% off from places like The Warstore rather than paying the price premium. However, my FLGS provides a community, painting stations, and gaming tables without any membership fee, open to everyone, so they rely on their in-store sales to survive. From a business perspective, gaming and painting table space is shelf space that they're not using, so this is essentially something that they take on as a loss for themselves. Right now I'm torn between wanting to save money for myself (especially when I'm doing conversion work and bashing up 2 to 3 good kits to make something) and supporting the store so it can stay open. As a result, I buy some things in the US, and some things back home.

This dilema isn't limited to just internationally mobile collectors like yourself. Some people take a black and white answer to the question and say "go for the best deal; the store has to survive on it's own merits" while others will say "I hope you can play games at the Warstore all the way from Singapore because that's what you'll be left with if you don't support local stores". Personally, I see the merits in both arguments but lean towards the later. I tend to do smaller more frequent purchases at the local store to show my support (buying single boxed sets or blisters for instance); if I'm planning a whole army purchase ahead of time in one go (like for instance getting a new Eldar 1500pt army now that the new codex is out), I'll buy online for the discount. I got my intial pile of x-wing game content for instance via online trades but I made it a point to get the second wave releases from the store and plan on getting the third wave there as well. I'm not (and I doubt you are) Paris Hilton in disguise where your simple presence and celebrity is worth money to the venue you spend time in. Playing at the store doesn't pay employee's salaries nor the utility bills that keep the lights and heating/airconditioning on. If I play there, I'm using those "services" and feel the duty to help pay back that. While I would personally balk at joining a miniatures gaming "club" that actually charges dues directly for those, I don't mind chipping in for a boxed set/blister purchase every two trips to keep the doors open. The old prepainted star wars and D&D minis boosters were my go to method of doing that for years but they're sadly both gone now.

When it comes to market economics, if you are doing anything except for what is most beneficial with the least cost to you, then you are just throwing away money. If I were you, I'd buy stuff in the states, take it out of the box but keep it on the sprue, and wrap it in bubble wrap. It would be very safe and would take up very little room. Heck, if you take an extra small suitcase, you could sure fit a ton of sprues in it.

Cheers,

 warboss wrote:
If I play there, I'm using those "services" and feel the duty to help pay back that.

I'm not sure why people feel such a duty. If they want to supply services for free instead of thinking of a way of exploiting it to pay the bills and the employees, that's their prerogative.

I personally have no problem if a store wants to charge a few bucks membership fee to use the tables (especially if the membership fee is recouped through discounts on purchases). But I don't feel remotely compelled to buy a $100 box of models of which they only get a tiny margin anyway when I could have gotten it for $60 elsewhere. I'd rather just hand them $20 for the privilege of playing there instead of wasting $40 on the models of which not much goes to them anyway.

That's why when I do choose to support an FLGS, I support them by buying stuff I know they make money off and also isn't just burning my money for no good reason.

AllSeeingSkink wrote:

 warboss wrote:
If I play there, I'm using those "services" and feel the duty to help pay back that.

I'm not sure why people feel such a duty. If they want to supply services for free instead of thinking of a way of exploiting it to pay the bills and the employees, that's their prerogative.

I personally have no problem if a store wants to charge a few bucks membership fee to use the tables (especially if the membership fee is recouped through discounts on purchases). But I don't feel remotely compelled to buy a $100 box of models of which they only get a tiny margin anyway when I could have gotten it for $60 elsewhere. I'd rather just hand them $20 for the privilege of playing there instead of wasting $40 on the models of which not much goes to them anyway.

That's why when I do choose to support an FLGS, I support them by buying stuff I know they make money off and also isn't just burning my money for no good reason.

While I have no problem with your stance I the issue, your example is quite ridiculous. If you can get the $100 for $60, your store can get it for $5-10 cheaper than any online price. A $45-$50 profit on a $100 purchase is not "a tiny margin anyway". In your example, the tiny margin is what you're giving to the online retailer who makes up for that in bulk.

Remember most non direct items are bought by your store at a 60% discount from GWS. So asking a store to give you 20% off still leaves them with a 40% markup.

 warboss wrote:

AllSeeingSkink wrote:

 warboss wrote:
If I play there, I'm using those "services" and feel the duty to help pay back that.

I'm not sure why people feel such a duty. If they want to supply services for free instead of thinking of a way of exploiting it to pay the bills and the employees, that's their prerogative.

I personally have no problem if a store wants to charge a few bucks membership fee to use the tables (especially if the membership fee is recouped through discounts on purchases). But I don't feel remotely compelled to buy a $100 box of models of which they only get a tiny margin anyway when I could have gotten it for $60 elsewhere. I'd rather just hand them $20 for the privilege of playing there instead of wasting $40 on the models of which not much goes to them anyway.

That's why when I do choose to support an FLGS, I support them by buying stuff I know they make money off and also isn't just burning my money for no good reason.

While I have no problem with your stance I the issue, your example is quite ridiculous. If you can get the $100 for $60, your store can get it for $5-10 cheaper than any online price. A $45-$50 profit on a $100 purchase is not "a tiny margin anyway". In your example, the tiny margin is what you're giving to the online retailer who makes up for that in bulk.

It's not ridiculous in the context of the OP's question, which is international sales. The example he used was a Wraithknight being $50 higher, that's around 43% higher price. In Australia, a Tervigon or Trygon retails for $96, in the US, it's $57.75. That $38.25 difference does not go in to the pockets of the Australian retailer, it goes in to vastly higher wholesale prices in different countries.

EDIT: (Assuming exchange rate is 1:1, the aussie dollar has slipped in the past month or so down to 95 cents US, but it has been above $1 US for a while up until then).


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 R3con wrote:
Remember most non direct items are bought by your store at a 60% discount from GWS. So asking a store to give you 20% off still leaves them with a 40% markup.

Are you sure? From what I've read it's more like 40% unless you are huge. So if they knock off 20%, their margin is only 20%.

This isn't an option for everyone, but the best thing you can do for an FLGS is be the store and its owner's friend.

One customer, any customer, is irrelevant to the store's bottom line. However, a friend that...

Brings new people to the store.
Runs and helps to run events.
Projects a good image of the store's clientele.
Supports the store's owners by being good, generally.

...is far more important to the long-term success of the store than someone who buys a kit out of guilt. Love your store--prove it!

Some stores aren't worth supporting, of course, but those that are deserve more than your money.

Plug: Game Vault, of Fredericksburg Va--wonderful 40k community that meets on Thursdays. Lots of space and terrain. Cheap soda and lots of victims!

Thank you guys for all your feedback. Indeed my FLGS is charging roughly the same price as every other store in this region (+/- a few dollars), and the reason for this is partly due to shipping (which is way further), conversion rates, high taxes/tariffs, high cost-of-living (which translates to high operating costs). I've seen the financials for the store since I've grown close to the owner, there's not much they can do as their margins are already low.

Right now they're trying to build their cash-on-hand to expand their store so they can hold larger tournaments and events to draw a bigger crowd and build the community further, which will eventually help their sales too.

I really like this store as it's very community-centric, and when I'm home I typically spend 5 of my 7 days a week there. Even if I'm not painting or gaming, I'm hanging out with people I like, and they provide boardgames and stuff too for people who just want to relax and chill out with friends over a few games. Again, I spend so much time there that I really don't want to see it close, and while I may or may not like the way some things are run by the owner, he's going in the right direction. I want to see the store survive, and not have to play out of a dingy old basement (if anything to justify the hobby to my girlfriend that I actually have friends ). That's the reason I feel guilty about not supporting the store.

We have another LGS (I refuse to use the F here, because of what I'm saying next) that went the exact opposite route, and stated that you could only paint there with paints and models you bought there, and only play with models you bought there (kinda like GW). Eventually they shut down their tables and only sold kits; their community has essentially died and they've been suffering a lot of losses.

This FLGS is my only FLGS, around my area in the US the closest 2 or 3 gaming clubs are weekend-only, using another gaming club's location, and charging a monthly fee on top of it (something like $30 to $50 USD). Not to mention they're WAAC gamers.

Right now I'm thinking of doing this:
1. Work part time at the store as a painter to earn some more gaming money and to build a wider painting experience
2. Take that money and use it to buy kits there
3. Money goes back into their pockets (sorta.)
4. They pay a low cost for models and terrain to be built/painted at decent quality, and I get to expand my experience and defray some costs too

Like cost-of-living, commission painters here are paid far more than their counterparts abroad because of limited talent and the base cost of the hobby.

Da Butcha wrote:
His FLGS is charging more than US retail, but is not gouging relative to other shops in the area. They are charging the same prices as other stores, ...

...which makes no difference if the local prices are higher than the market will bear.

'Everyone else within a certain distance of this seller is charging the same amount' doesn't make a price you perceive to be too high any more palatable.

I think that Enigwolf is doing the right thing now. He wants his gaming store to survive, and he wants them to maintain a gaming space. They are providing a service that he values, so he's paying a price for that, even if he's not obligated to do so.

And that's perfectly fine. So long as he feels he is receiving value for his money, why shouldn't he spend his money there?

People are saying that he's "under no obligation" to spend money there, and the store needs to make it 'worth his while'. This is, of course, true, but it's a very narrow, legalistic view of things, and doesn't take into account the underlying reality of the situation. You're under no "obligation" to be pleasant to your spouse or significant other, either.

Unless you had some rather peculiar wedding vows, you most certainly are under an obligation to be pleasant to your spouse.

But marriage isn't generally a business arrangement. Retail is not a two way street. The retail offers a product, the customer chooses whether or not to purchase that product, based on the price, and (to differing degrees, depending on the customer) the level of customer service offered by that retailer.

That customer service is something that the retailer does to entice people to buy from them. Not the other way around... you don't purchase in the hope that the store will continue to offer that level of service... If that service is what is getting them sales, it's in the store's best interests to continue to offer it.

However, if you want those people to like you and value your company, you might want to be nice to them.

I can't speak for everyone else, but if a local gaming store doesn't 'like me' I'm not going to lose a whole heck of a lot of sleep... I don't need my phone service provider to like me either. They just need to provide the product or service that I pay for. How they choose to encourage me to continue to do so is entirely up to them.

Well, it really needs to be looked at like this.

If you like the store, and want it to survive, buy from them. The store has bills to pay and the store owner needs to live as well.
If you want to save a few bucks then buy online, however do not expect the store to still be around when you next want a game.

Also you stated that you like to hang out there 5 out of 7 days for the community feel. Then you really should buy from them. Just because you frequent the store does not mean you are supporting it. They are 2 different things.
Before you ask questions like the one you did you should really put yourself in the store owners position and look at it from that angle. Would you want a bunch of people hanging out in your store for the ambiance, that spends little or no money at all.
Or would you rather have a bunch of people in the store that also actually support you. (And in support I mean give them money).

No cash flow = no store, simple as that.

AllSeeingSkink wrote:


Are you sure? From what I've read it's more like 40% unless you are huge. So if they knock off 20%, their margin is only 20%.

Yes, direct from GWS depending on your "tier" amounts to 60%, you can buy from a larger distributor at 40% and not have to play the tier game with GWS if you so choose.

I go for a mix. Something that I will only save a few $ on, after shipping and all, Ill buy from a LGS. Something I will save a lot on Ill buy online.

Well, thats when I have a LGS. Closest game store to me is an hour away, so the majority of my gaming stuff is bought online. My buddy and I make a trip there every month or so, drop a few $$ while we are there.

 Bloodmagic wrote:
Also you stated that you like to hang out there 5 out of 7 days for the community feel. Then you really should buy from them. Just because you frequent the store does not mean you are supporting it. They are 2 different things.
Before you ask questions like the one you did you should really put yourself in the store owners position and look at it from that angle. Would you want a bunch of people hanging out in your store for the ambiance, that spends little or no money at all.
Or would you rather have a bunch of people in the store that also actually support you. (And in support I mean give them money).

There have been a few posts in the thread similar to this, but it's not necessarily entirely accurate. What I want to point to is what free to play games discovered - that when you've got a game that's played between people, having players around is valuable even if they aren't spending money, because they make the game more valuable by providing players who do spend money with people to play against.

That's sort of the conundrum, really: if you're a business, it isn't fantastic if the service you're providing isn't well linked with what actually makes you money. In this case, the main service FLGS provide isn't related to selling miniatures, because it's way more convenient to many players to go online and have a parcel with exactly what they want delivered to their door for less than an FLGS can afford to sell at. It would be much better if they got money for people using the store space, since that's the main service they provide - but things like memberships can actively drive down the value of the store by reducing the number of people playing there.

I did think the membership with store credit idea was pretty clever. It might be even better if the store could provide some kind of premium membership service rather than requiring a fee to play at all.

Personally, I try to buy from stores I play at, because I am getting benefit from them even if their economic model isn't entirely coherent.

A mate of mine and I were actually discussing this early on this week.
He came up with a great idea.
Charge people $10 to play in store. However you give them a $10 gift voucher for your store.
That way they can either spend it on stock then or save them up.
I think the idea is great. The proprietor is getting something and so is the customer.

 insaniak wrote:
I can't speak for everyone else, but if a local gaming store doesn't 'like me' I'm not going to lose a whole heck of a lot of sleep... I don't need my phone service provider to like me either. They just need to provide the product or service that I pay for. How they choose to encourage me to continue to do so is entirely up to them.

This is basically my thought. If they want to provide a free service of letting you use tables, that's up to them. If they want to institute policies that you have to be a regular customer to use their tables, again, that's up to them (and they'll probably lose me as a customer). If they want to charge a fee to use the tables, again, that's up to them. I'm not responsible for the business decisions of my FLGS, they are. If they don't think it's working for them, that's up to them to change, it's not up to me to support them despite their choices (good or bad). They aren't a charity, they're a business.

 Bloodmagic wrote:
A mate of mine and I were actually discussing this early on this week.
He came up with a great idea.
Charge people $10 to play in store. However you give them a $10 gift voucher for your store.
That way they can either spend it on stock then or save them up.
I think the idea is great. The proprietor is getting something and so is the customer.

Someone mentioned this earlier on in the thread. I personally think this is a fine way to deal with the issue.

I'm a big fan of 'pay where you play.' I don't have access to a large community of people to play in my basement, so I need the FLGS to find a game.

40k players take up more space and time in the store than other, more lucrative portions of the hobby, and I am willing to reciprocate that support. I appreciate the friendly atmosphere, as well as the personal relationship I have with the staff. I certainly don't want my games store to be nothing but a business transaction that I take part in to get a little bit of personal amusement when I'm not around my wife. That makes it seem like I'm visiting a whore, not enjoying a respectable wargame.

That being said, I don't feel any compulsion to support them solely through 40k. I also play several other games, and as long as I continue to give them my patronage in some capacity, I think my obligation to them is satisfied.