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For a unit so pricey and for something that can "rend time and space itself" why the hell are they only AP3.

I think AP1 claws would be fine for them, fits the fluff and makes them worth their points cost.

Agree?
Disagree?

Maybe propose different rules?

Not no, but hell no.

This man has said all that needs to be said. Space marines (by fluff) should have acute senses, FNP, several wounds, silly initiative, increadibly high Ws and Bs, etc, etc, etc...

They didn't add this in for a reason...balance...

You may have had an argument with asking for rending.

AP 1 Lightning claws however, the idea is just laughable.

Wow so constructive, of course gotta expect that on Dakka, like I said, any ideas?

AP1 is too extreme
Warp Talons are too overpriced

So where is the happy medium?

Rending is at least an idea, so thanks for that.

My biggest problem with them is, like Mutilators, they have no shooting attack and so largely spend a turn doing nothing in the open. It doesn't even have to be a conventional attack, maybe just some kind of special blinding weapons.

The only Thing they Need is assault grenades!

 Larendard wrote:
The only Thing they Need is assault grenades!

You know with the blind attack, maybe they can get some sort of flash attack that counts as grenades, fits the fluff and would help them

2x210 wrote:
Wow so constructive, of course gotta expect that on Dakka, like I said, any ideas?

AP1 is too extreme
Warp Talons are too overpriced

So where is the happy medium?

Rending is at least an idea, so thanks for that.

We also expect sensible proposals and no sarcasm when comments are given, but like you said, can't please everyone.

Ap1 Lightning Claws is a ridiculous idea. Give them Assault Grenades and that's fine, but Ap1 is laughable.

AP1 is virtually useless on a unit that can't do more than glance vehicles, and it's also silly. Even chainfists don't get AP1.

What Warp talons need are assault grenades and rending, then they can pretend to be Wraiths.

Rending is really all they need. Ignoring grenades and terrain in general, Rending on a model with Shred is really powerful... and worth 30 points a model.

To be honest I think part of fixing them as a proper unit that distinguishes themselves from normal raptors (in a good way) would be to actually be able to properly utilize their Warpflame Strike now that Icons no longer prevent scatter. So alongside this rule they should have had some sort of rule...let's call it "Predators of the Warp" where they are able to hone in on disturbances in the warp due to battles/deaths that are going on during the game which creates turbulence from which they can pinpoint certain areas to break into reality. So rules wise it would allow any Warp Talons coming in from reserve via Deep Strike to deploy and not scatter as long as it is within 6" of a unit that has suffered a casualty. This way we have an almost sure-fire way to allow them quick delivery to a unit that has already been damaged and allow full use of their Blind ability without endangering them.

This alongside the already proposed rending rule for their attacks, give them frag grenades and fearless (they are daemonically empowered anyways like their Possessed brethren) and I think they would be set. I do also think they should tweak the prices for marks a bit so they can be marked and still be relatively cost-efficient as well; say 2 points for Khorne, 3 for Tzeentch, 3 for Nurgle and 2 for Slannesh?