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Hey everyone!, you may remember me from an older post asking for thoughts and feelings on some quick miniature concept art i had a whyll back, well now i am back on track to getting my company up and running after a short pause on work.

As i am getting nearer to getting things fully moving i have come back to one key issue that i have not yet fully decided on. I have gotten some feed back from another forum and a few people on their thoughts and feelings on resin miniatures vs metal miniatures. I have seen alot of companies switching over to resin and were once i felt the market was fairly unwanting of resin it seems the recent success of a few small companies using thiis material means that might no longer be the case.

As of course as long as the miniatures are good that is the most important thing ( as well as a good price ), however as i am compairing the cost difference between a few companies ( if you have any caster you know of , defo post in your comment if you want to recromend them?) and i would like to again post a thread here on the Dakka forums to hear this communities thoughts on this subject?

Now if i do go with resin i will ensure its not brittle and or cheap material but a good high quality resin that will not shatter or have any other quality issues that would make them unusable for wargamers and collectors.

I sincerly look forward too all of your thoughts and views on this subject!.

With best regards - Shawn.

About 15 years ago Ral Partha was doing something interesting.

The core pieces of several battlemech miniatures were done in a resin / plastic hybrid. Meanwhile the "brittle" parts were still done in metal. This meant that the tiny weapon bits and other parts that stuck out were still highly durable. Now RP had a problem with them in that the resin/plastic parts were pretty low quality and paint didn't stick too well. Although, the idea was great.


I dislike working with pure metal for several reasons. First, they tend to fall apart over time (failed glue joints). Second, trying to re-position an arm that was modeled in place is extremely difficult. So you tend to be stuck with the pose as modeled. However, I have to admit that, with exception to glue joints coming undone, the odds of destroying a metal model is pretty low... as in you'd have to really work at it.

For building the model I like resin better. It's much easier to cut and customize. However, certain thin parts like swords, horns or guns tend to break very easily. I try to be really careful pulling my miniatures out of my bag, but at least once a week something breaks. The good thing is that superglue holds the parts together, so I'm not worried about joint failures. Also I haven't seen a top heavy resin model yet...

If I was starting out, AND I wasn't just going to do plastic to begin with then I'd look into doing parts in resin and others in metal. Supergluing metal to resin seems to be near permanent and the metal parts will survive bag rash, being dropped, etc. Meanwhile the resin parts are easy to cut. Seems like the best of both worlds. I'm not entirely sure why more manufacturers don't do this.

If you do resin correctly, I like it better than metal for weight, conversion, etc. If you cannot do it correctly and it is Finecost quality or worse, then stick to metal.

From a business standpoint for you, resin is going to give you better cost controls for manufacturing since you aren't reliant on a volatile metals market.

And while we're talking resin, do not take a page from Privateer (as much as I like their products) and make resin/plastic models that do not take regular plastic model glue.

Either is good when done properly. The problem with something like finecast, is that it isn't.

In descending order of preference:

Properly cast resin > metal > finecast.

Resin is by far the superior material, and all of the hatred for it is because of poor casting work and nonexistent quality control, not the material itself.

Metal all the way. I hate working with resin and love having metal minis in my army. Not for large creatures, but characters and sw dudes are cool

So long as it's cast properly, resin.

 Howard A Treesong wrote:
Either is good when done properly. The problem with something like finecast, is that it isn't.

I can agree with this.

 Peregrine wrote:
Properly cast resin > metal > finecast.

Pretty much this.

And plastic before resin.

For painting (which I do more of than actual gaming) there's no real difference between resin, metal (or plastic)

For assembly and conversion (assuming it's not a single piece casting) resin is far easier to work with (plastic is either as good or better depending on type)

For actual gaming I'd tend to favour metal (especially single piece castings) as it's just harder to snap off stuff like spears/swords etc. I also prefer some weight to my models, at least for human sized ones



as an example this Mierce 'beastman' resin mini is in on my table at the moment, It's got superb detail and is made of really good quality resin, but I've managed to snap off the sword already, My fault (and an easyish fix), but it's what happens when you've got thin sticky out resin bits

In terms of what you've got to charge for a mini you'll probably find that you want to move to resin (or plastic) for dreadnaught size or bigger if not earlier

In terms of production rubber moulds (for metal) will cost you less than moulds for resin, and will last much, much longer.

As a small start up probably go for metal human sized minis, or resin for larger stuff.

Unless you're aiming for boutique limited editions where resin is probably ok for everything (they're less likely to hit the gaming table so less risk of breakage, and you don't need a rubber mould capable of 1000s of casts if you only plan to sell 200)

I prefer Standard hard plastic then resin, then restic, then metal. The main reason for this is converting. I love to convert and the materials, in the order I have listed them in, are easier to convert, I have received minis with issues in every medium, so that isn't as big a motivator for me.

I prefer metal, resin holds detail better, but is more troublesome to deal with.

But in the end high quality properly cast miniatures of either medium are good.

Anything other then finecrap.

Metal gives you a reason to justify the expensive price. Resin lets you do larger scale stuff.

I don't mind either, but I hate restic./ plasin.

I like metal mostly because I like having heft to my pieces.

However, most of my models are one piece guardsmen so I don't really have problems with the joints falling off or anything.

In order of personal preference....

Plastic - because it is wicked easy to convert and mix 'n' match.

Metal - durability.

Good resin - detail and easy conversion.

PVC - price and durability. (Sooo looking forward to getting my own Bones Kickstarter shipment.)

'Poxy putty - cause I made it myself, even if it is kinda... ... ... crappy looking.

Earwax - hey, it's better than Finecast....

Finecast

The Auld Grump

Im a follower of the general gist here:

Plastic > Good Resin > Metal > Bad Resin.

However many of the current 'conversion parts' companies out there have proved that even small garage businesses can make high quality resin peices.

I do however have a soft spot for Metal Character pieces... moving you light troops in a game and then moving your heavy hero always feels right.

For me it's kind of a price thing. I generally prefer the heft and durability of metal, but I'll take resin, PVC, Plastic if it's what's available at a good price. However, most places have you paying a premium for resin and nothing about resin is (to me) worth a premium price.

Because I buy used and strip alot of figures, I end up with alot of metal, and that suits me just fine.

Why not both?

I've got resin models with metal parts (the thin, otherwise fragile parts that would be too hard to do in resin - or supplemental detail like hatches, antennae, etc).

I've got metal models with metal additional parts, too - and even resin with resin. I prefer a mix of both.

Especially vehicles.

I don't have a lot in the way of resin figures. I don't like it for figures. Until you're up around the 54mm range, when it becomes effective to use.

Wow thanks for all the feed back guys! that was alot more in a few hours than i expected , if i knew this i would have posted a response sooner!.

Now first off i can see alot of you like plastic , then resin and then metal for your miniatures and that does seem to be fairly the case across from others feed back as well. I do understand though also the attraction to metal miniatures as well. I have been at this for a fair amount of time now and know the over all set up cost difference between most of the materials viable on the market place.

I would have to be honest and say plastic is something i would not even look at until i was selling on such a massive volume of miniatures that then i would look into plastic mold making and such, however i have also read more than a few posts on here and other sites about how many times plastic minis lose alot of detail compaired too their metal and resin counterparts. So that if i got too that level i would have to consider as well.

For my overall miniature plans, i will be aiming to make them with as little seperate parts as possible ( due to personal taste that yes i like to customize my minis, but i also enjoy being able to base a miniature right out of the package and get painting it!.) , however i also aim with creating realistic combat situation style poses for my miniatures when possible ( though of course we always need a few looking off into the distance leaders after all ).

The less seperate parts for my miniatures will also mean the less cost for all of you guys, my customers!. I really want to bring interesting and new miniature concepts too the wargaming market, and mainly for the Sci fi gener. However i will be starting with 2 factions and what really is going to be the deciding factor on how large the two ranges will be is the cost factor. I have been looking at a few metal casting companies for a few days now and i can already tell the costs are much, much more than it would be for resin miniature casting. Also their is the added factor that my masters since they will be 3D printed will be in resin as well...

No worries about restic material miniatures even if i wanted too do my ranges in them, so far no one in north america casts with that material as far as i have seen . I would also say that Finecast material is something that makes even some lower grades of resin look good , and no need to worry about that i will ensure my miniatures if i do decide to go with resin will be done in real high quality resin.

I really wish i could respond to each and everyone of your comments, but thats alot of comments already to respond too. However i hope i have given my thoughts on the current feed back from the community, i think i know what medium i will be using, but i am still listening too the community's feed back, because if one thing i want to do with my company is be very open to the communities feed back and create great ranges that you all can influnce the design and final products ( too within legal and sensable reasons of course !)!.

The trend seems to be towards resin.

BUT...I have always and will always prefer metal. A metal model on a 60mm base has a significant wieght and feel. And when I chuck out the money for a model that big I want to feel it. I also find metal easier to file mold lines off of and correct and convert short of hacking it into tiny pieces. I don't know whether it's real or my imagination but my metal minis have also always taken primer and paint smoother.

I prefer metal:
* the weight
* very durable when pinned (I have never had models shatter when dropped) even for big multi-part models
* not very hard to mildly convert, depending on model
* easily stripped (take from base, drop in paint thinner, take out clean next day without scrubbing).

The only thing I hate about metal is when companies try to do tiny and/or long details in it (thin spears and such) they are always bent when I buy them.

Resin for businesses.

Metal for model makers.

You need to decide whether you would prefer the fluctuating costs of metal or the stability offered by resin products. You then need to weigh this up against the quality you can offer in each material.

For personal modelling experience I'm happy with most mediums (including finecast), true metal is harder to work but not so much with the right tools and has the advantage of being bendy and inelastic. Resin just seems to fly together if the quality is good, it can be the opposite with a poor cast - I'm looking at you battlefront!

put a weight under the base and put a bunch of small rocks for your plastic mini to stand ontop of if you like the "feel" of weight so much.

text removed. No need for that.
Reds8n

Of course OP you'll need to take into account just how much of the metal haters is only for the fact they can't be bother spending 30 mins with a jewellers saw ;-) It sure is harder to work with but that's part of the fun for a lot of us. Go metal woop!
Well, resin is fine too.

Metal is good in small miniatures like infantry, characters etc, as long as they don't feature too many smooth surfaces where metal often doesn't cast well. However large multi-part metal models are an absolute horror. Difficult to assemble, horrible to paint, hard to base, tip over on the gaming table because they're so top heavy. And don't tell me "file off the sharp flash lol you dumbass". When you have a model like BFG battleship, it has so many corners, edges and spikes that it doesn't matter.

Metal does have one thing going for it - resale value of metal miniatures tends to be better, because they're more durable and paint is easier to strip off.

Plastic is the bestest, but sometimes plastic characters tend to lack, well, character. I think it's because they're often sculpted on computer, which sometimes lends itself to sterile expression. Stuff like this gets really esoteric, but that has been my observation.

Hard plastic (no need for any loss of detail with this if done correctly/ carefully) > Metal > Resin.

Just don't make anything breakable, and don't make anything impossible to glue with tiny little joints and you'll be fine.

I've converted models in most materials in my gaming career.
Plastic is easily the most adaptable.
Metal is the least.
resin falls in the middle.

To be honest, I don't mind Finecast. Either the negative hype on the internet is vastly overstated (who would believe that would happen ) or I've been extremely lucky because I've had no problems with any of mine, and I've got at least 50 models in finecast by now with nothing worse than a small bubble. I've had far more problems with metal.

Resin is a nice compromise between metal and plastic.
Plastic is easy to cut and glue, without the warping problems that resin can have.
Metal holds nice detail (although modern plastic technology is becoming comparable), but it's harder to work with, and paint tends to chip more easily. Also if you drop metal, it dents where plastic or resin would bounce.

For example, I just buils some Phoenix Guard for my High Elves.
My old PG are metal, the new ones are plastic.
The level of detail is easily equal, but the plastic ones were easier to put together by an order of magnitude.
The only real problems resin has is warping (which is easy to fix with hot water) and people not cleaning off the mould release agent.

All told, in order of preference, Plastic/resin/metal.

I don't care about converting, nor do most of my gaming friends and everyone I know prefers this order for "human sized" miniatures: Metal -> Plastic -> Resin -> Failcast.

Monsters and larger pieces it's: Plastic -> Resin -> Metal. Note the lack of Finecast in that order.

If Khurasan Miniatures can sell good looking 28mm Sci-Fi soldiers for $1.30 I'm pretty sure metal is still a viable option.

Taking a very different tack...

I'd like to suggest this for a startup company. Just about any material will sell if the cast and sculpt is good and the subject is interesting.

You should be looking at this from your own costs perspective.

You probably know this, but...
-Resin is going to be more labor intensive and require more frequent replacing of molds if you sell alot.
-Metal will give you the best mold life, and there's lots of opportunities to out-source production.

You need to get an idea of how many units you will need to produce, how much of the production you are doing in-house, and how much $ you have to put toward production. It makes no sense to crowd source for favorite materials if it's going to negatively affect your bottom line.

clively wrote:
About 15 years ago Ral Partha was doing something interesting.

The core pieces of several battlemech miniatures were done in a resin / plastic hybrid. Meanwhile the "brittle" parts were still done in metal. This meant that the tiny weapon bits and other parts that stuck out were still highly durable. Now RP had a problem with them in that the resin/plastic parts were pretty low quality and paint didn't stick too well. Although, the idea was great.


I dislike working with pure metal for several reasons. First, they tend to fall apart over time (failed glue joints). Second, trying to re-position an arm that was modeled in place is extremely difficult. So you tend to be stuck with the pose as modeled. However, I have to admit that, with exception to glue joints coming undone, the odds of destroying a metal model is pretty low... as in you'd have to really work at it.

For building the model I like resin better. It's much easier to cut and customize. However, certain thin parts like swords, horns or guns tend to break very easily. I try to be really careful pulling my miniatures out of my bag, but at least once a week something breaks. The good thing is that superglue holds the parts together, so I'm not worried about joint failures. Also I haven't seen a top heavy resin model yet...

If I was starting out, AND I wasn't just going to do plastic to begin with then I'd look into doing parts in resin and others in metal. Supergluing metal to resin seems to be near permanent and the metal parts will survive bag rash, being dropped, etc. Meanwhile the resin parts are easy to cut. Seems like the best of both worlds. I'm not entirely sure why more manufacturers don't do this.

This is pretty much exactly my opinion as well.