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As a small conversion and painting project mainly, I have been considering a Non-TS Tzeentch list, now, I also like to win where possible and would still like to be as competitive as possible, but realising that Tzeentch is the worst of all marks, I have no idea how far exactly I could take it. This list would be in the 1000 -1500 point range, at least initially.

The one thing that I do want to help keep the Tzeentch theme, is that every unit that can take at least one of the following, must take them where possible.
Mark of Tzeentch (this is a given)
Gift of Mutation

Anyone have any ideas, I'm quite open to anything at the moment.

TLDR: How competitive can a list be where every unit that can take it has to have MoT and a Gift of Mutation.

 Krellnus wrote:

TLDR: How competitive can a list be where every unit that can take it has to have MoT and a Gift of Mutation.

To answer your question in the nicest but honest possible way, not very competitive unless you go Daemons as Primary. Something like this -

Fateweaver
Herald Tz, disc, lvl 3 Exalted
Herald Tz, disc, lvl 3 Exalted

Horrors
Horrors

9 Screamers

Allies
DP Tz, Wings, Mace, Armour
Cults
Helldrake

Leave the GoM's at home, far too random for the points investment.

For troops, I'd take Tz Cultists. It's a cheap mark and because they have such a crap armor save to begin with, it might actually save a few bullet catchers.

Beyond the Black Mace DP, a Tz Lord on a Disk with Sigil would be a good HQ choice, T5 and 3++ isn't half bad at all.

Well...
You can take 3 Drakes, which solve a ton of problems for any list.
The Tzeentch DP with Wings and Black Mace is very good, 2x tzeentch cults don't hurt and then you can ally daemons where tzeentch is also pretty viable with Kairos, a Tzeentch-DP and a unit of horrors

You can also work around it by including more armor in your list. A predator painted in Tzeentch colors still counts but doesn't have to worry about whether or not a mark or GoM is good.

 Krellnus wrote:

TLDR: How competitive can a list be where every unit that can take it has to have MoT and a Gift of Mutation.

how competitive can you be when you are paying 10p tax per character and a ~10% per model tax on the useless MoT. Well you can be about 90% as competitive as anyone else.

Some models gain a lot from MoT. Oblits(though not as much as MoN) Warp Talons, Mutilators(though not as much as MoN) and Possessed. Unfortuneatly only one of these units is any good.

DP of tzeench are pretty good
Chaos lords on bikes with MoT are alright with the 3++
Sorcerers are pretty bad with MoT, but they are still sorcerers.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 minigun762 wrote:
You can also work around it by including more armor in your list. A predator painted in Tzeentch colors still counts but doesn't have to worry about whether or not a mark or GoM is good.

Unfrotuneatly in the fluff Tsons specifically dont use vehicles. There is some question as to where all their gear is stashed, at one point they had a whole legions worth of land raiders, preditors etc.

Unfrotuneatly in the fluff Tsons specifically dont use vehicles. There is some question as to where all their gear is stashed, at one point they had a whole legions worth of land raiders, preditors etc.

True but the OP wants non 1k Sons Tzeentch troops.

1KSons dont use vehicles?! In "Battle for the Fang" they used vehicles, assault troops and rubric terminators.

I've just started posting but I've been reading rulebooks (and eventually forums) since 1988. The fluff for every army has had some weird major announcement that changed & handicapped the way they're supposed to play at least once, probably twice. The Death Guard didn't use rhinos in the second 3rd edition chaos marine codex. Necron Lords were soulless automatons serving their star gods for at least two editions. One of the oldest White Dwarfs I have (116, I think) says the Word Bearers and Night Lords worship Khorne. The idea of these supernatural spooky marines slowly and menacingly walking everywhere is cool but if it doesn't work in-game then I say ignore it.