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Hey guys and girls,

I've spent ages trying to devise a (as close to) perfect 1200 Ultramarines Army. 1200 points is the target as all of the GW games in my store are for this value. Everytime I think of a new unit I have to drop a unit for it to replace, and then I find myself needing to fill the spot the other unit filled until then.

Anyways, what are your guys opinions on a well balanced army for space marines? Suggestions whether it be a theme, rough ideas, "must have" units or a full list.

I personally prefer a shooty army with deepstriking units to take out vehicles/big guns.

What are your thoughts?

Dan

I've had success with keeping the infantry and vehicle loadouts versatile i.e. magnetizing so you can add or remove jump packs from assault squads to save points and things like that

building preds to be versatile too like the AC and lascannon sponson loadouts that everyone on here likes to recommend

this is probably all common sense for you but it seems to me sometimes people just get tunnel vision and build very specialized squads which makes them lose sight of how versatile and customizable the marine kits are

2 TFCs is how I start most my lists. Then just build a list around the style of play I want to use. Sadly though at 1200, C:SM are lacking. This is due to our very costly troop choices.

Have calgar with teleport homers. Scouts with teleport homers and termites could make a nice infiltrate and drop list

I'm going to make the assumption that you want to do an 'all-commers' list and not some kind of wonky power list. Shooty with some deepstriking units? Easilly done.

10 tacticals (whatever special/heavy you like) with a Drop Pod transport
10 scouts (I like full snipers currently, and you could do 5)
10 assualt marines (you could do 5 but 10 is better)
10 devastators (x2 las cannon, x2 heavy bolter)
ADL with Icarus (for the points)
For HQ: I'd go libby and captain

Firstly your going to combat squad everything, las cannons and heavy bolts in the same 5 man teams obviously. Saturate your opponent with target priority decisions. I've won smaller games like this time and time again on that alone. Dont be tempted to throw your assault marines out early in the game, they are a counter-attack force only unless you go up against somethign like Tau or IG. For your tactical squad, put the heavy weapon on the table somewhere back with your devestators. Your Sgt, and the special weapon group comes down in the pod with the Librarian and Captain. I like to place them in such a way that my scouts can provide supporting fire to whatever unit they go for on the turn they land. Obviously there are subtle variations to what you can do but I like heavy infantry lists for low points games. If your meta does not include many assaulty lists you could omit the assault squad alltogether and take another tactical squad or a dreadnought. As for the ADL, I personally like it with the Icarus, true it gets less shots, but its much more effective at taking out those pesky hellturkeys when they show up. The devastator sgt. should man the gun or at least be part of the group that is so you can benefit from his signum.

For a fluffy, TAC, thematic Ultramarine list, there are about a zillion ways to go. Each has pros/cons depending on who you are facing, your local meta, and your mood.

My first suggestion would be to take something from every slot in the FOC. Preferably something iconic.

Elite, go with a 5 man squad of terminators. You wanted to deep strike, these guys do that. Pick one of the big heavies, add a chainfist, and drop them into the mix.

Troops are two full tac squads. In rhinos, or sub one razorback.

FA should start with a 5 man assault squad. I like a power sword and a flamer here.

Your HS pick could be a dev squad, but you are probably better off with a tank or two.

HQ is either a chaplain with the assault marines, or a librarian with the terminators.

That's a generic core army circa 1,000 points. Add more to flavor and taste to get to your point level.

With you go with an assault squad go ten. They can pack a bunch on the first round and stick around for round two maybe round three.

 guinness707 wrote:
list.

Man, that is a nice little list!

To the OP, here is something you might want to consider... Vanguard Vets. Drop in and assault is pretty sweet, specially if your looking to take out the Warlord. Can Combat Squad it up and use the Squad that does not have a Character to avoid Challenges, unless you think your Sarge can take'em, then use that half!

Course, if you want to be /that/ kind of Ultra Marine player, you probably look at named characters, since there are a ton of them.

A lot of good suggestions here so far, all depends on how you roll. Might have wanted to put up your list right away to show folk what you normally run.

 BlkTom wrote:
To the OP, here is something you might want to consider... Vanguard Vets. Drop in and assault is pretty sweet, specially if your looking to take out the Warlord. Can Combat Squad it up and use the Squad that does not have a Character to avoid Challenges, unless you think your Sarge can take'em, then use that half!

Sorry to pick on you BlkTom, but this is some wonky advice right here. For starters, 10 Vanguard for combat-squadding is way too expensive at 1200 points for a unit that can mishap.
This CAN work, but you need to drop it to 5 men and make sure you have a locator beacon to eliminate scatter. My personal suggestion is a Sternguard drop-pod but Scouts or Scout Bikers would do the trick, too.

Firstly let's dispel the false notion that a balanced list must take a unit from every FoC slot and/or take poor units. A balanced list is a list that can handle any situation without having to take risks; the jack-of-all-trades, no particularly good match-ups but no particularly bad ones either.

To the OP, generally when making a balanced list I weigh up the different threats you need to be able to deal with. These are hordes, MEQ, TEQ, MCs, mech, heavy mech, and flyers. If you have things to deal with all of these then you will always have a fighting chance, and thus a balanced list.

As for the list and the theme you mentioned, Sternguard go very well in a pod list. Vulkan is usually the go to character for this sort of build, but if you are trying to stick with Ultramarines I'm guessing that doesn't work for you. I would suggest a Bike Captain, 2 Troop Bike squads, some Scouts, some podding Sternguard, and 2 TFCs. Melta Bikes can deal with all sorts of mech, Sternguard with combi-plasma can deal with MEQ, TEQ and MCs, TFCs deal with hordes. That just leaves flyers, however at such a small points value you probably won't see many so an ADL might be enough.

Are you allowed / do you want / can you afford forgeworld?

 Super Ready wrote:

 BlkTom wrote:
To the OP, here is something you might want to consider... Vanguard Vets. Drop in and assault is pretty sweet, specially if your looking to take out the Warlord. Can Combat Squad it up and use the Squad that does not have a Character to avoid Challenges, unless you think your Sarge can take'em, then use that half!

Sorry to pick on you BlkTom, but this is some wonky advice right here. For starters, 10 Vanguard for combat-squadding is way too expensive at 1200 points for a unit that can mishap.
This CAN work, but you need to drop it to 5 men and make sure you have a locator beacon to eliminate scatter.

Don't worry about it, I don't mind! But yeah, it is wonky, but I will point out getting into melee as soon as you come in from DS is pretty hot, plus they do get an extra attack on the base guy. As for mishaps, they are not as bad as they use to be to the point of I don't even waste the points on beacons anymore. Those points can be melta guns or a couple of Melta bombs.

But against shooty lists like Guard, Eldar, and even Tau (though they have a lot of tricks concerning over watch and can get a lot of interceptor), they do not want to get into close combat with you, with even a few guys. Your looking at 4 attacks a marine, 3 on their turn... not a lot of troops will survive that. Giving them only an over watch shot on you is pretty hot, something Assault Marines can't really deal with (thus can't really be combat squaded). And you would have the choice when you play Tau to /not/ combat squad your unit to make it more survivable from incoming over watch, specially if you do throw some Thunder Hammers or Power Fists on half of the squad to take down a Riptide. Tossing a couple of Storm Shields in on the lead guys (1-2 figs per Combat squad) can make sure they survive for minimal extra points at the cost of an attack.

Can the unit ramp up on points? Heck yeah! A 5 man squad with 5 Thunder Hammers and 5 Storm Shields is 385pts! I mean, consider what those points are giving you if this goes off! But taking 1-2 Thunder Hammers and 1-2 Shields with proper placement can be very effective both with the unit and with it's cost.

I guess the point I am trying to make is that you can take any unit out of the Codex, and with the proper points spent make them effective. What any player has to learn is how much is to much and then how to properly use the unit on the battlefield to get the most bang out of your buck.