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I've been trading a lot on dakka and bartertown for a long time. I've just recently started playing warmachine and I'm not totally sure on what units sizes and things go up to and I kind of understand it but I'm still a little wobbley. I traded my CSM for a huge menoth lot and not that I have everything I'm noticing I have multiples of a lot of models and I wanted to know if I should keep them or would it be better to trade them off to pickup some of the warcasters I don't have or maybe even try for their epic forms.

I have
2 avatars of menoth
2 choirs
2 coveneant of menoth
2 harbingers
3 of kreoss
2 paladins of the wall (one is the variant)
the seneschal of the knights exemplar -2
2 exemplar bastion seneschals
2 vassals
4 crusaders
4 repenters
2 dervish

I'm just not sure if it's worth having multiples of all these units or should I keep them and may be able to make a list one day. I'm missing a few jacks and I've love the judicator but I just don't know what's worth keeping and what's worth not. Is there a place that shows optimal unit size for any given list? I have a ton of the normal "units" but I'm not sure what kind of numbers for them I could ever use.

So, if you know what I should and shouldn't have PLEASE help me lol I'm so new and noob that I have no clue.

2 avatars of menoth
2 harbingers
3 of kreoss

These are all characters, and you can only have 1 of each, and as such you'll only need 1 of each. Unless you want them for conversions/to give to a friend to get him into the game/stuff like that, you can drop some of these (down to a minimum of 1 each).

4 crusaders
4 repenters
2 dervish

These are all jacks, and while you probably won't find too much use for 4 crusaders outside of skewed lists, you can always try to pick up the extra arms/order them as bits from PP maybe if they do that? That way you'll not have 4 crusaders, but rather 4 of the crusader chassis jacks (which, if it is the same as Cygnar, will be 3 jacks)

2 coveneant of menoth

This is another character model, and as such you can only ever run 1. So unless you want the other for a conversion, you can offload it

2 choirs

Now this is a question one, do you mean 2 choir members? Or 2 full units? 2 small units?

2 paladins of the wall (one is the variant)
the seneschal of the knights exemplar -2
2 exemplar bastion seneschals
2 vassals

These are solos of which I think you can have multiple (at least you can for the vassal, not sure of the others). Check the FA on the cards. But as long as its more than 1, you can keep them and possibly find use for them

 motyak wrote:
2 avatars of menoth
2 harbingers
3 of kreoss

These are all characters, and you can only have 1 of each, and as such you'll only need 1 of each. Unless you want them for conversions/to give to a friend to get him into the game/stuff like that, you can drop some of these (down to a minimum of 1 each).

4 crusaders
4 repenters
2 dervish

These are all jacks, and while you probably won't find too much use for 4 crusaders outside of skewed lists, you can always try to pick up the extra arms/order them as bits from PP maybe if they do that? That way you'll not have 4 crusaders, but rather 4 of the crusader chassis jacks (which, if it is the same as Cygnar, will be 3 jacks)

2 coveneant of menoth

This is another character model, and as such you can only ever run 1. So unless you want the other for a conversion, you can offload it

2 choirs

Now this is a question one, do you mean 2 choir members? Or 2 full units? 2 small units?

2 paladins of the wall (one is the variant)
the seneschal of the knights exemplar -2
2 exemplar bastion seneschals
2 vassals

These are solos of which I think you can have multiple (at least you can for the vassal, not sure of the others). Check the FA on the cards. But as long as its more than 1, you can keep them and possibly find use for them

2 full units of choir lol

Well I don't know the FA of choir either, but you should check the cards and if it is more than FA 1 then it could be worth it to keep them, they are apparently a great unit for the PoM

I know for certain that the FA for the Paladins of the Order of the wall is 2. I'd highly recommend hanging on to both of them, as they are brutal against opponents. If you're going to be picking up a few things with cash from models you get rid of, I'd also recommend picking up their buddy Dartan Vilmon, as he is equally mean and opens up a fun ability for them.

 grayshadow87 wrote:
I know for certain that the FA for the Paladins of the Order of the wall is 2. I'd highly recommend hanging on to both of them, as they are brutal against opponents. If you're going to be picking up a few things with cash from models you get rid of, I'd also recommend picking up their buddy Dartan Vilmon, as he is equally mean and opens up a fun ability for them.

I actually have him somewhere on my work table I'm not sure which one he is yet but he's there. I'm just not sure what else I can get I'm this army lol and my flgs owner wants me to trade him my extras but I like to do deals myself

A note on other things:

PP does sell bits on their site through their store, and you can order some to turn your crusaders into Templars or Vanquishers (though I'd probably hang on to at least one crusader, depending on your tastes).

In terms of other stuff, you can run two of each of the seneschals, and up to three full choirs, so you've got no need to get rid of those either. So really, barring the character stuff and possibly changing the crusaders around, you don't have a whole lot of off-loading or changing to do.

 grayshadow87 wrote:
A note on other things:

PP does sell bits on their site through their store, and you can order some to turn your crusaders into Templars or Vanquishers (though I'd probably hang on to at least one crusader, depending on your tastes).

In terms of other stuff, you can run two of each of the seneschals, and up to three full choirs, so you've got no need to get rid of those either. So really, barring the character stuff and possibly changing the crusaders around, you don't have a whole lot of off-loading or changing to do.

Vanquishers, anyway. They don't sell the Templar bits due to there never being a metal model.

Ah, good point. How did I overlook that.... ?

For the 4 Crusaders and 4 Repenters, there are some lists which will use them, but they're very specific ones, and you won't get a set of 4 out together on the table very often.

Amon Ad-Raza can do well with lots of cheap jacks, and some Repenters, Dervishes and Crusaders fit the bill quite nicely, but he's a tricky caster to start with. Outside of him, however, you're generally not going to get more than 2 Repenters in a list, though you could keep an extra for marshaling to one of your Bastion Senechals or for multi-caster games.

Meanwhile, the Harbinger's theme force gives you cheaper melee Heavies, which means those Crusaders become 5 points, cheaper than many light jacks, and she can support them well. Her theme force also includes Vilmon and Paladins, and the Avatar, so you've basically got everything you need for it already.

So yeah, you can get use out of them, but if don't feel like starting a skew list like those two early on, you could happily sell off a couple of each (Repenters and Crusaders).

Also a note on the 3 Keoss, is to make sure they're all the same type or not. There are two versions of him on foot, and a version of him on horseback. It's still worthwhile to own each different version of him.

 AduroT wrote:
Also a note on the 3 Keoss, is to make sure they're all the same type or not. There are two versions of him on foot, and a version of him on horseback. It's still worthwhile to own each different version of him.

It's the same kreoss, with him holding his mace with both hands?


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Maddermax wrote:
For the 4 Crusaders and 4 Repenters, there are some lists which will use them, but they're very specific ones, and you won't get a set of 4 out together on the table very often.

Amon Ad-Raza can do well with lots of cheap jacks, and some Repenters, Dervishes and Crusaders fit the bill quite nicely, but he's a tricky caster to start with. Outside of him, however, you're generally not going to get more than 2 Repenters in a list, though you could keep an extra for marshaling to one of your Bastion Senechals or for multi-caster games.

Meanwhile, the Harbinger's theme force gives you cheaper melee Heavies, which means those Crusaders become 5 points, cheaper than many light jacks, and she can support them well. Her theme force also includes Vilmon and Paladins, and the Avatar, so you've basically got everything you need for it already.

So yeah, you can get use out of them, but if don't feel like starting a skew list like those two early on, you could happily sell off a couple of each (Repenters and Crusaders).

I know there is a character jack that looks like a crusader but is just a character could I use one of my crusaders for that? I have the admon guy I like his look lol So basically I should just get rid of the extra "I can only have one of these" units and keep everything else? what would you make the crusader chassis into?

 Gharron wrote:
I know there is a character jack that looks like a crusader but is just a character could I use one of my crusaders for that?

You might be able to turn one crusader into the Blood of Martyrs. It depends on if they are the metal or plastic versions. the Blood of Martyrs kit was made for the plastic jack and you would have to rip off a head and hand to get the new parts on. The metal crusader would be much more difficult to use those parts on since it is built differently.
The character crusader is the Fire of Salvation. While Fire looks like a crusader he is much more ornamented so you would have to do lots of little super-detail conversions to a crusader to have it stand in for him. The most important thing is that nobody confuses one for the other.
The scourge of Heresy is the third character on the crusader chassis but for him you will need both the crusader's fist and the vanquisher's ball and chain so it will a case of buying the right parts from multiple jacks.
If you opt to change the crusader to a non character jack, try the vanquisher, you could use more guns.

So basically I should just get rid of the extra "I can only have one of these" units and keep everything else?

Yea, basically. You can never field more than one of a character model no matter how large the game so having multiples does nothing for you.