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I haven't played GK since early 6th when Pure Draigowing was done away with (for the best I know, but still ) Now I've haven't paid much attention to GK tactica since but I keep hearing that running regular GK termies is good, or at least a viable build now. Is this true? What exactly has changed? I remember in 5th and early 6th no one took regular GKT, it was all either Purifiers, Paladins, Henchmen, or a mix of the three, with the occasional GKSS thrown in just in case yu fought a Daemon player...

I dont see why GKTs are any better than before...

They are overshadowed by other choices now IMO.

As one of those Daemon players, lemme tell you....we hate you all for those GKSS/Interceptor shenanigans.

Aside from that though, no, I don't think GKs in TDA are especially scary. A single wound, and die just like any other terminator, and really only threatening if they have Halberds. Still think hammernators are scarier as they directly counter my TDA counter (namely, my MCs), that 3++ is not fun for a lonely prince...

**Edit: just remembered...doesn't the nemesis staff also provide a 3++? If so, they'd be pretty scary to my MCs too.

The staff is a 2++, so indeed, not cool for your MC`s

 Ferrum_Sanguinis wrote:
I haven't played GK since early 6th when Pure Draigowing was done away with (for the best I know, but still ) Now I've haven't paid much attention to GK tactica since but I keep hearing that running regular GK termies is good, or at least a viable build now. Is this true? What exactly has changed? I remember in 5th and early 6th no one took regular GKT, it was all either Purifiers, Paladins, Henchmen, or a mix of the three, with the occasional GKSS thrown in just in case yu fought a Daemon player...

Nothing has changed to make them better. Paladins are still good with certain match ups. The other reason that I can think of the terminators are good is that other things got worse. Having multiple wounds, invulnerable saves and feel no pain are more valuable than ever.

bogalubov wrote:

 Ferrum_Sanguinis wrote:
I haven't played GK since early 6th when Pure Draigowing was done away with (for the best I know, but still ) Now I've haven't paid much attention to GK tactica since but I keep hearing that running regular GK termies is good, or at least a viable build now. Is this true? What exactly has changed? I remember in 5th and early 6th no one took regular GKT, it was all either Purifiers, Paladins, Henchmen, or a mix of the three, with the occasional GKSS thrown in just in case yu fought a Daemon player...

Nothing has changed to make them better. Paladins are still good with certain match ups. The other reason that I can think of the terminators are good is that other things got worse. Having multiple wounds, invulnerable saves and feel no pain are more valuable than ever.

I was just thinking that was probably the reason. With the Heldrake Purifier lists are dead, as are Henchman lists to a slightly lesser degree. GKSS have never been top tier and suffer the same problem as Purifiers. Paladins get flat out massacred by Eldar and Tau now, more so eldar since even their basic troops can punch through their armor. Regular GKTs too, but at least you take take more than 10 of them and still actually have points left over for stuff.

GKTs are alright, they share most of the weaknesses of Terminators this edition, but have a few advantages.

Some comparisons:

At normal Terminator price, they're exactly twice the cost of a GKSS dude with basically twice the survivability, so you're better against AP3 and AP2 (if you're out in the open) weapons b/c of the 2+/5++. Strike Squad are really tasty targets for heldrakes, but with their seeming decline it's less of a major factor.

Strike squads have about twice the firepower as GKT per point, with 2 stormbolters on the GKSS for every 1 on the GKT. The # of psycannons stays the same. Relentless Psycannons make up for a bit, but the lesser S5 stormbolter fire is pretty bad.

Per point, GKT have exactly the same # of attacks as GKSS. The only CC advantage is the 2+/5++ and the free Daemonhammers, which basically are powerfists anyways. The free halberds are nice too. If you're not shelling out for the Bro Banner, they're a bit better in CC overall, because you're often not giving GKSS any special melee weapons beyond a single halberd for the justicar and maybe a normal dude's hammer, whereas the GKT will generally have halberds and hammers, with the occasional sword for the better invuln.

Here's the biggest problem -- Paladins are right there. For less than 50% more points per model, you get: more wounds, WS, Psycannons, and an Apothecary. You have to take Draigo, but despite being nerfed from 5th he's still an Eternal Warrior with a Storm Shield to tank wounds. However, then you're really using them in a different role then you'd use paladins, as you'd be doing Draigo-wing.

GKT are nice in that they're troops without having to pay a Belial or Azrael tax (really a Belial tax, Azrael's actually pretty good). They're reasonable all-rounders. I wouldn't go full Terminators, as then it'd just be better to take Draigo-wing, but if you mix up GKT and GKSS and Henchmen, you can get good mileage out of their differing capabilities.

I play terminator-heavy GK lists...I've always loved the models and feel of them. In my opinion, 6th has made them (and terminators in general) better because of the power weapon changes. The key is to get them into close combat and keep them there.
GK termies have good access to weapons, halberds and hammers being the most useful. They can do horrible things to multi-wound models with force weapons. They are also very survivable in CC, with a 2+ and a temporary 2++ from the warding stave (arguably one of the most efficient upgrades for any unit in the codex, 20 points to save 200 points on average). However, they suffer from low model count as do any such army. They aren't stellar, but they're at least average and are worth taking.

As a note, some people run terminators instead of Draigo because for his price you can get 6 terminators with a warding stave and incinerator. That's 3 S4 AP3 and 15 S8 AP2 force weapon attacks on the charge, protected by a 2++ until it dies.

 greyknight12 wrote:
As a note, some people run terminators instead of Draigo because for his price you can get 6 terminators with a warding stave and incinerator. That's 3 S4 AP3 and 15 S8 AP2 force weapon attacks on the charge, protected by a 2++ until it dies.

Is the wielder of the Warding Stave taking all the hits? Because the 2++ is on conferred on him and only him.

Termies got better, because MEQ became so much easier to kill, but that doesn't make them good either. They are slightly more viable because they don't care about Drakes and the like, but they still die to weight of fire like everything else, and unlike MEQ, they cost a tonne and don't put out as much dakka per point. While they are a bit better, Paladins and Henchmen are still better Troop choices IMO.

I think if you are going for a dual melee and shooty GK list, Terminators are the best bet if you aren't going for a special character list. Strike Squads are no good in melee because their melee weapons are overpriced.


I run Terminator lists a lot and they do fairly well. Its not an easy list to win with, but it can definitely be done.

 c0j1r0 wrote:
Is the wielder of the Warding Stave taking all the hits? Because the 2++ is on conferred on him and only him.

Yes. Just make sure he's in base-to-base with the enemy. As the player taking the hits, you get to allocate the wounds to any eligible model.

Of course you have to roll one at a time, because once he dies they go on to the next model. But yes, you can tank quite a bunch of AP2 hits on the Stave guy.

As someone uses the Baron, I can tell you that there certainly is a stigma attached to 40k for failing one off 2++ saves, so watch out

They also get something no other Terminator does... assault and defensive grenades. Massive, bowling ball sized grenades. I was in disbelief
when I saw that in their wargear list.

They have always been the best when it is your intention to have the most badass looking terminators out there

I don't know when they were ever bad? GKTs have been the unit of choice since the Daemonhunter book first dropped.