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Reecius busts out the new Imperial Fists Space Marines against Frankie's tournament Chaos and Daemon rush list.

Good game, shame about the dice in the Marines debut. I see SM lists as needing to be very focused from what I've read... tailor your army to do one thing and it will work well, but the old "5th edition" lists will fall into the "jack of all trades, master of none" trap and suffer against top lists. But a more focused Shooty Fist list or a bike WS list, or a DP Sally/UM list should be scarier than anything the last codex gave us.

I hold out hope you can still build a TAC list, but we'll see. It will take more play testing for sure.

 Reecius wrote:
I hold out hope you can still build a TAC list, but we'll see. It will take more play testing for sure.

From my initial looks at the Codex, I think Marines will probably compete with Tau for the greatest ability to build an all-comers list. There are a lot of very interesting and flexible options here.

Nevermind I'm a dork[img]

 Kingsley wrote:

 Reecius wrote:
I hold out hope you can still build a TAC list, but we'll see. It will take more play testing for sure.

From my initial looks at the Codex, I think Marines will probably compete with Tau for the greatest ability to build an all-comers list. There are a lot of very interesting and flexible options here.

I feel the same way. I want to play more first, but they have so many tools, especially Ultra Marines.

I think the heldrake single handedly solidifies the role of the dev centurions.

They are a non tank ranged option that can survive heldrakes.

Also well done taking a hodge podge army against a tournament list and doing decently. I think that says a lot about the list that it can do decently against themed forces. Also land raiders, always like seeing landraiders.

Go Marines!

I'm going to have to break out my marines pretty soon. Unfortunately, I don't have some of their greatest toys: centurions, thunderfires, stormtalons and bikes.

Is that A brief Introduction to Dubstep at 4 minutes I hear?
And Swedish House Mafia at 10:23? Good choices! haha

Nice Tactics, i like what you did with the ironclad and the centurions, you had the right idea IMO, sometimes...the dice just make it hard on marines

Great batrep as usual. It's always frustrating when the opponents dice are hot and any correct tactical decision you make is eliminated by hot dice. But meh, it happens. Definitely a thunderfire cannon is a strong consideration. Gaining barrage now makes it incredible for only 100pts. My only comment is that you should've split lysander off from the centurions...and had them assault the khorne dogs to free up your iron clad so it could move on to tarpit a seeker unit. With lysander in the challenge the cultists would be stuck watching and out of the game at that point. Unfortunately Lysander died...but statistically he should have killed Abaddon. If that happened I think the game changes immensely...as you'd have Lysander as a threat, the centurions as a threat and an iron clad freed up. I also would have moved devs into the bunker and the scouts up top at one point to save your missile launchers. They then could have used the fire points to safely shoot without much retaliation from the drake. :shrug: Sadly, with hot dice the outcome would have been the same, but at least you had some better moves to try possibly.

Looking at that game, really makes Devastator Centurions on a Bastion look like a nice option.
Park two Thunderfire cannons behind it and you have an insane backfield base.

Add some storm talons and drop pod troops and I think you will have a nice rounded list. Not sure what to add as a dedicated counter assault unit though.

Thanks for the report.

Tough battle there Reece I knew it was going to be difficult from the get go and your bad rolling didnt make it any easier. I would agree that a thunderfire cannon should be an auto-inclue in every list as it is literally a swiss army knife. Looking forward to future batreps with the marines to see what interesting combinations you guys come up with.

I wonder why not showcase with more balanced armies, the models and table are stunning and the skills are there and all but the game itself was beyond sad and really only shows how fast the new sm will be tabled, turn 3 or 4.

So next time less one sided baneblade-vs-grots games and we might actually learn something about the strenghts and weakneses of the new sm instead of just watching how fast tac squads can be wiped without even having time to shoot once.

@Leth

Yeah, it makes them a bit of a liability. DA allies with a powerfield libby with Divination helps a LOT though, and makes especially IF Devs brutal.

@jy2

Can't wait to get a game in against your marines, bud! And we ordered as many T-Fire cannons as we could, haha, I took one at them and was like, wow. They're selling fast, though.

@iGuy91

Yeah, we listen to a lot of different music here, people like hearing clips of it!

And yeah, the dice just weren't there this game but that happens.

@CaptKaruthors

I assembled my T-Fire cannon the other night! It will be in upcoming bat reps, too good not to take.

Yeah, Lysander going down like a punk was terrible. He should have won, but he didn't. That caused a cascade of bad news and my army folded soon after.

Dice a re a part of the game and we've all been on both sides of it, it just is what it is. Sucks that it happened in our first SM bat rep though, ahaha.

@Dutch

Yeah, that is not a bad combo at all. It gives you a lot of tactical flexibility.

Glad you liked it!

@Ray

Yeah, I got owned! haha, but oh well, it happens. We'll get more reports out that showcase better what the Marines can do.

@Pyriel

SM won't be tabled turn 3 or 4, that was just crazy bad dice and true, a tournament list vs. a non-tournament list. Still, it would have been different had Lysander not gak he bed in the critical combat as I would have followed through into the Seekers and most likely have won the fight, able to then carry on onto the objective. It was just bad luck and a bad match-up.

Well, looking forward to seeing your next batrep, they tend to be really high quality.

Have you thought about running an IH HQ with the EW Shield and thunder hammer? Being EW while regenerating wounds and a 6+ FnP sounds really good.

@Pyriel

Thanks, glad you enjoy them.

@Ray

We actually did try that (just not on film) and he was beast mode! He regenerated 3 wounds over the course of the game! It was crazy, he effectively had 7. That isn't normal of course, but it can and does happen.

Thanks again, Reece and FLG crew for another awesome batrep.

Hoping to see more on Centurions in the future, and some of the really nasty space marine lists possible.

We're working on them! The Centurions are much cooler models in RL than in the pics but so far I have really struggled to get them to pull their weight. They are actually really tricky to use right. I played a Grey Knight player who made a bit of a lucky charge with his Dread Knight and by by Grav Cannons.

The issue I am having is that you have to get close to use them, but how do you get them there? Walk? Most armies have the means to either kill them with shooting or fast assault units like FMCs, cavalry, bikes, etc. What we're seeing is that they shoot once, and then peace out. The shooting isn't as hot as you'd think, either. For example, full strength volley of 15 shots into Paladins, who you'd think would be a good target, 1 wound.

Now, granted, my opponent was hot on his saves, but that happens and when it does, the counter attack is devastating.

I am finding you really want to run them with a character or in a LR of some variety. I am a bit underwhelmed with Grav weapons so far, honestly. Good old Plasma seems to perform better on average.We'll see though, we're still playing around with it. I am thinking that Centurions with Las Cannons and missils may be OK, but damn they're expensive.

We'll see. I am kind of meh on centurions right now, honestly. I dig the models though and they damn things took ages to build, haha, so I will keep experimenting. If only you could put them in a Drop Pod! Gah, then they'd be fantastic.

I usually never watch video batreps, they become such a waste of time.
You guys are the only ones I've seen who make batreps worth watching.

I'm a big fan of your thinking when it came to everything that had to do with the Bastion. Reserves into the interior able to jump on the objective last turn, Tank Hunter flakk missiles on the quad gun, denying mobility like you did, great stuff!

My only gripe with this Batrep was that you were fighting a tournament list, which kinda missed the point on this Batrep imo as even you said in the video, you just wanted to field some SM, see what they were like so I think the Chaos player should have brought a more casual list, such as 3 Hellbrutes and some Forgefiends for example just as a fun game but so that we all could learn from what SM can be like in this new edition but that's just my opinion, apart from that it was a great quality batrep as always

@Herpguy

Thanks, glad you liked them!

@Talore

Yeah, that was a cool little trick we stumbled upon. I am sure plenty of others have thought of it, too, but it has worked really well for especially my Chaos. Havocs with auto-cannons man the Quad gun and Culstists come out of reserves into the Bastion where they hang out and drink beer until it's time to get out onto an objective.

@happygolucky

I agree. I almost asked Frankie to tone it down on his list but if you know Frankie, he only has one gear: smash face! haha, and he wanted to practice for Feast of Blades, so I thought we could kill two birds with one stone. The shop is often too busy to film a nice bat rep so we try and get as much done as we can. In retrospect though, it would have probably have been better to play a less brutal army to get a better feel for what the Marines are capable of.

That said, I have been having a lot of fun and success playing 50-60 Tactical Marines with Calgar, that is a solid army.

Ah ok if I was to ever go to the SM side I would do a historical ultramarine 2nd company invasion force of Damnos, because it would look really cool

 Reecius wrote:
That said, I have been having a lot of fun and success playing 50-60 Tactical Marines with Calgar, that is a solid army.

Great minds think alike! That's how I envision my space marines to be. Lots of tact guys led by Marneus, the man himself, with thunderfires in the back and stormtalons in the air.

I'm just short some of the tact marines, the thunderfires and the stormtalons.

After messing with the Force Requisition ( army builder ) in the ipad sm codex, I leaned towards Dev. Cents. w/ TL lascans and missile launchers. T5 with 2 wounds, walking 6" and shooting stuff sounds decent. I well armoured and mobile devestator squad. I would keep some kind of assault unit near them to 2nd guess opponents charging into them.

Or put them in a skyshield for a 4+ invuln?

@Jy2

Yup, that jumped out at me right away as what is likely to be the best list. My second choice is Tigurius with Sternguard and more vehicles. I think Calgar with Tacticals is more reliable, though.

White Scars are no joke. That really is a super fun, powerful army. Our test games have shown it to have the tools to go the distance.

@happygolucky

That would be sweet! Sicarius is a good all around HQ, too.

@Garukadon

I think running them with a Power Field Dark Angels libby is probably the best bet so that he can buff and protect them and keep them mobile where the Skyshield forces them into static tactics.

Im with you on the centurians. I just think they are way too expensive and situational for a model with no ward save and the need to be close to take advantage of their best weapons.

Seems like everyone thinks the best build for cents is the grav cannon. I think they can work with twin linked lascannons and one grav cannon... Best of both worlds. Now if GW should FAQ it such that grav weapons ignore cover versus vehicles they will be very popular with that build.

hey recius,

just wanted to say I really enjoy the quality you put into your reports and the models turned out by you and your minions tend to look pretty awesome. while its likely we shall never play (being based on the eastcoast) i wanted to say you seem like a pretty cool dude. Keep up the great models, great reports, and great fun you seem to have!