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I honestly want Phil Kelly to write the blood angels codex, maybe with troke, although, dakka you are going to Hate me, I wouldn't mind seeing robin cruddace CO WRITE with Phil..

What do you think? Who should write..... gods (and emprah) know they need a reboot. I feel so bad for my poor blood angel friend..

Let me know dakka! Thanks

Ted, the Janitor. I hear he's really a savant at these sort of things.

Joking aside, any of the guys could do it and I wouldn't mind. My only complaint really comes to the way Cruddace writes fluff....it's very dry. It's like I'm trying to read the script for a nature documentary that's being narrated by someone very old and British.

I really don't want kelly touching this one, I have found some codices of his to have TERRIBLE internal balance *cough* spacewolves *cough*.

Better that ward steps back up to the plate for me.

Maybe a new guy. None of their authors really wow me.

I don't care, as long as the rules are well balanced and our SC's are usable I will be happy.

Ummm...I hate to be that guy, but do the Blood Angels even need a new codex? At all? The 'dex doesn't really seem that dated to me...

Vetock first pick, Ward second.
I hope Kelly and Cruddace aren't allowed anywhere near it. You can ignore terrible Ward fluff in game, you can't ignore terrible rules.

Orks have the best internal balance of any codex I know of. If balance is the goal, I'd say have him do it.

If imagination is prized more, then I think codex's like the intricate one that Necrons got is interesting.

Ultimately, though, no one will be completely happy with anything. So it's hardly worth losing sleep over. All I ask is that they have hard core competitive gamers comment on the codex before they finish it. Have them try to break it a bit so that it will be a little more points-priced for the way people actually build lists and not just so that you can go themed. Oh and a little more than just a nod TO theme would be nice.

 Jimsolo wrote:
Ummm...I hate to be that guy, but do the Blood Angels even need a new codex? At all? The 'dex doesn't really seem that dated to me...

From what I gather, they pretty much got hit as hard as orks were. Every single one of their tactics got fethed over one way or another - they were one of the bigged benefactors of the imbalances of 5th and lost the most when all those got the axe, plus a couple of lists don't work anymore because of rule changes. Typical blood angel lists are pretty much a collection of things you wouldn't want to field in 6th.

I don't care as long as we get giant bat riders!

Vetock or Ward, please.

To be honest I'm happy for Ward to do it. I know he has messed up codices and army books in the past of those armies he's not interested in i.e. Ork & Goblins Fantasy but I thought he did a good job with the last BA codex. Jeremy Vetock is next after him.


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 lord_blackfang wrote:
I don't care as long as we get giant bat riders!

The image of that actually makes me shudder. I hope they don't do anything stupid like that.

I really wish they would seperate the authors from fluff and rules. Ward seems to have great game mechanics for units in the back of the book, but doesn't write the story very well. While other authors do pretty good with the writing and then epic fail 50% of the unit listings. I think the game and story would be helped greatly if the duties were split into departments for gaming mechanics and story flavor.

 Jancoran wrote:
Orks have the best internal balance of any codex I know of. If balance is the goal, I'd say have him do it.

If imagination is prized more, then I think codex's like the intricate one that Necrons got is interesting.

Ultimately, though, no one will be completely happy with anything. So it's hardly worth losing sleep over. All I ask is that they have hard core competitive gamers comment on the codex before they finish it. Have them try to break it a bit so that it will be a little more points-priced for the way people actually build lists and not just so that you can go themed. Oh and a little more than just a nod TO theme would be nice.

The problem is his MEQ codex's have been complete

Sure he could maybe write an excellent ork codex, but then you've got Space Wolves (half the codex aint worth using, the other half is so impossibly good), CSM (Codex: Plague marine, Heldrake, and cultists),

ClockworkZion wrote:
Ted, the Janitor. I hear he's really a savant at these sort of things.

Joking aside, any of the guys could do it and I wouldn't mind. My only complaint really comes to the way Cruddace writes fluff....it's very dry. It's like I'm trying to read the script for a nature documentary that's being narrated by someone very old and British.

David Attenborough is old and British. He has one of the single greatest narrative voices known to man.

Im not a big fan of Cruddace' work on the current Nid dex, so id agree to him staying away from certain dex's. I dont know his stance on BA though. I understand he did well on the IG codex he wrote.

My favourite codex writers are definitely Phill Kelly and Jeremy Vetock. They seem to be capable of creating very solid and enjoyable books.

Ward writes occasional nuggets of good rules, but quite a lot tends to be a bit/very over the top, or at least enough to make it the trait he is famous for. I also dont like his fluff writing. Again, something he is famous for.

Orks have the best internal balance of any codex I know of. If balance is the goal, I'd say have him do it.

When the blind squirrel finally finds that oh so elusive nut, you don't take that one lucky happenstance as evidence of his skills. lol No. If internal balance is the key, find someone with a CONSISTENT track record. Remove the Ork codex (which I agree was well balanced internally) from his portfolio. How many balanced books does he have now?

EDIT:
In fact, now that I think about it, Kelly may be the single biggest offender of writing books with bad internal balance ... Every author has one or two duds, but I can't think of anyone who has so consistently written books where you really only looked at a third (or less) of the entries as "good" or worth taking.

I honestly want Phil Kelly to write the blood angels codex

Sure sure. He wrote a hugely imbalanced DE book, ruined CSM, and filled the Demons book with so much friggin book keeping it adds like a half hour to every game. So no. If he touches my favorite army, well, I won't do much 'cause it's just plastic soldiers. But there WILL be nerd rage. lol

Ummm...I hate to be that guy, but do the Blood Angels even need a new codex? At all? The 'dex doesn't really seem that dated to me...

Then you probably haven't played with or against it lately. There are admittedly books (like the 'nids) that need to be updated first, but the BA's got the nerf stick pretty brutally this edition. First off, they were primarily set up to be an assault based army. We know how assault stands in 6th ed. Next, you could do pretty decent mechanized lists with them. Hello Hull points. oops. Then there was the dread-heavy lists. Oh. Yeah. Hull points. Honestly though, the single biggest issue is how insanely expensive everything in that book is. Even the basic Tac troopers are so costly (compared to 6th ed point conventions) that it is very hard to make an effective BA list. Many BA armies end up looking similar to 15 man Draigowing armies just because of how badly they need to be repointed.

As for my picks, I would say Vetock because his books appear to have decent internal balance and the units have a good amount of synergy with one another. After him, (and at the risk of much wailing and gnashing of teeth from the peanut gallery) I would say let Ward have a go at it. I quite enjoy his rules (even when I'm playing against them lol) and often find that HE is not the problem. For me it's more that he writes really fun imaginative rules that the other writers can't quite keep up with.

Has to be Ward for me, I liked his style and it's been too long since his last codex.

 HerbaciousT wrote:

ClockworkZion wrote:
Ted, the Janitor. I hear he's really a savant at these sort of things.

Joking aside, any of the guys could do it and I wouldn't mind. My only complaint really comes to the way Cruddace writes fluff....it's very dry. It's like I'm trying to read the script for a nature documentary that's being narrated by someone very old and British.

David Attenborough is old and British. He has one of the single greatest narrative voices known to man.

Im not a big fan of Cruddace' work on the current Nid dex, so id agree to him staying away from certain dex's. I dont know his stance on BA though. I understand he did well on the IG codex he wrote.

My favourite codex writers are definitely Phill Kelly and Jeremy Vetock. They seem to be capable of creating very solid and enjoyable books.

Ward writes occasional nuggets of good rules, but quite a lot tends to be a bit/very over the top, or at least enough to make it the trait he is famous for. I also dont like his fluff writing. Again, something he is famous for.

Attenborough would be an improvement. It's more like I'm trying to eat Saltines with my eyes. I swear that I've had crackers with more moisture than Cruddace's writing. I wonder if he used to write for an Encyclopedia company. Seriously my biggest gripe with him is that he has no flair. His writing style doesn't make my neck hair stand on end with excitement.

As for his work on Guard, it's touted as one of the worst internally balanced codexes ever. It's functionality is locked into less than a third of the actual book, which is a problem frankly.

Thud wrote:
Vetock or Ward, please.

I would like to see them work on this one (and GK) together.

So it sounds like the problem with the codex isn't an issue of the codex being outdated, but of people trying to play 6th edition games with 5th edition tactics. I know it's kind of like trying to kick the tide, but I feel like I should at least point out that the change in editions and enemy codexes requires the constant rethinking of tactics, strategies, and army composition. Assault is just as viable in this edition, it just requires a modicum of forethought as opposed to the Superman approach of flying into all your enemies chin-first. Vehicles aren't nearly as unreliable as the internet doomsaying seems to believe they are. I still see the two Blood Angels armies at my local scene doing just fine, and my allied detachment of Blood Angels continues to do just fine. It seems like people too often see one particular style of play become less than powerful, and rather than try to experiment with different tactics and selections from the army in question, are just throwing up their hands and saying "Well, codex is nerfed! Time to play something else until I get my new 'dex."

That being said, if Games Workshop DOES put Blood Angels into the line up anytime soon, I really don't give a damn who writes it. I've been reasonably satisfied with most of the writers from GW. Honestly, Kelly does some good work, Ward does some good work, and Cruddace does some good work. If anything, I think that Kelly has the fewest number of rules discrepancies, grey areas, and contradictions that I've noticed. Ward probably has the most, but I think his writing style tends to capture the epic nature of the Space Marines a little bit better.

In any event, I hope that when the new codex DOES come out, everyone's happy with it, friend and foe alike.

Ward. His fluff migth be bad but at least his books are never boring to play.

Ward. Mostly because I want the BA to be more competitive.

GreyHamster wrote:Vetock first pick, Ward second.
I hope Kelly and Cruddace aren't allowed anywhere near it. You can ignore terrible Ward fluff in game, you can't ignore terrible rules.

I have to agree, Ward would do a wonderful job, even if the fluff would be fething crazy. But then again, 'fething crazy' is kind of what BA stand for. Nobody loses 950 marines in unnecessary suicide missions like them!

Jimsolo, the BA are now the worst list in the game. It's not about tactics, its about overpaying for every unit in the codex. There is literally no way to overcome this over the course of a series of matches.

Martel732 wrote:
Jimsolo, the BA are now the worst list in the game. It's not about tactics, its about overpaying for every unit in the codex. There is literally no way to overcome this over the course of a series of matches.

3 Death Company (no jetpacks) for 60 pts. 10 pts/model less than Tyranid Warriors who are synapse creatures or 3 pts/less than Ymgarls who are tank busters (Leman Russes are easy, Land Raiders are a bit of a challenge) and they only get pistols and chainswords.

On foot, DC are pretty bad.

Vetock would be entertaining at the very least.... I still say Phil Kelly. His balance has been great. I love all his random tables..... okay csm got broken bya technicality ... *ahem* zombies and heldrakes *ahem*

But I have noticed that ward codices lean towards buff hqs cheap elites and expensive troops.... which results in big games of herohammer.

 ImotekhTheStormlord wrote:
I really don't want kelly touching this one, I have found some codices of his to have TERRIBLE internal balance *cough* spacewolves *cough*.

Better that ward steps back up to the plate for me.

I wouldn't mind seeing Ward and Kelly working together, Ward on rules and Kelly on fluff.

 darthnatus wrote:

Martel732 wrote:
Jimsolo, the BA are now the worst list in the game. It's not about tactics, its about overpaying for every unit in the codex. There is literally no way to overcome this over the course of a series of matches.

3 Death Company (no jetpacks) for 60 pts. 10 pts/model less than Tyranid Warriors who are synapse creatures or 3 pts/less than Ymgarls who are tank busters (Leman Russes are easy, Land Raiders are a bit of a challenge) and they only get pistols and chainswords.

Yet they are only 1 point more expensive on foot than Khorne Berserkers and totally worth the point to boot!

What kills the Blood Angel Codex for me is the cost of the bloody jump packs! 15 points for a jump pack for a single Death Company Marine. This needs to come down closer to 3 points to be competitive. Anything more than that and you might as well take Rhino's and just pile out on your oponents turn one when it gets wrecked.

Every model in that Codex that can take Jump Packs as an option are over paying compared to 6th ed book.

Edit: I'd take Ward or Vetock for Blood Angels. I would like Cruddace too over Kelly. The Space Marine Codex has a lot of interesting builds in it. Kelly's Chaos Marine Codex was un-imaginative.

Ward, please. Sure the 5th book had fluff "issues" but nothing TOO heinous like Draigo, and the Necron thing honestly was kind of understandable when you retroactively work in Newcron fluff.