Why is wargaming so much more popular in the UK than the USA?

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**marielle**

Sorry to disabuse those claiming it is population density, culture, historical differences etc.

The answer is far more prosaic.

The UK has a history of magazines, sold in high street shops, that have either been specifically about wargaming, i.e. Battle, or had a wargaming section Airfix Magazine and Military Modeller spring to mind for historicals. White Dwarf is the most obvious example for fantasy/sci fi - though their were others.

These allowed the growth of various manufacturers - Citadel for example - by mail order advertising.

As for why US companies are not more prominent - which is contentious, especially historically, Battletech was massive in Europe with events in Germany attracting upwards of 5000 players - I would suggest the reason is twofold; they are too parochial and the shipping rates are too high.

**marielle**

Donut64 wrote:
I postulate that, no there aren't more people who play Wargames in the UK than in the US.

The UK has a higher per capita income, meaning that everyone has more hobby money than those in the US. Combine this with shorter travel times for games, and shorter travel times in general meaning less money spent on gas, the average US gamer for Wargames is going to have a LOT less money to spend.

Strange though how US has the higher point average for "listed" games. I'll argue that since folks play at home more in the US (I've only played a wargame in a store once, over 5+ years of it), it's even more local than in the UK. By extension, most people in the US who buy GW stuff maybe have only a few boxes of minis and play whenever convenient.

And based on a bunch of anecdotal evidence, I'd say there are more total people who play wargames in the US than any other country in the world. However it is almost certainly true that they are more spread out, and most of them spend less on the hobby than their overseas counterparts, meaning the sales output from the US might be smaller than it is in the UK. I would like to point out that the middle-north-east of the US, around Ohio/Indiana/Illinois/Michigan, seems to carry the most TT wargame weight (probably because Ral Partha was based in Ohio).

Local store argument? Valid for exposure, but not valid for continuing sales as the vast majority of folks eligible for 40k are, by now, used to ordering their items online anyway. That's probably way GW wants exclusivity for the online market because that's how the majority of folks in the US will be getting their minis.

I'm pleased to see that jingoism is alive and well.

Automatically Appended Next Post:

Alex Kolodotschko wrote:
marielle wrote:

The UK has a history of magazines, sold in high street shops, that have either been specifically about wargaming, i.e. Battle, or had a wargaming section Airfix Magazine and Military Modeller spring to mind for historicals. White Dwarf is the most obvious example for fantasy/sci fi - though their were others.

WH Smiths(UK's largest newsagent at virtually every train/bus station and every town centre) has now stopped stocking White Dwarf, iirc from chatting to my GW Account Manager it was because they were squeezing for more money off. Why GW didn't give the magazines to them for free or an insane discount is a complete mystery to me.
It was a first exposure for many of us (mainly due to the cool front covers) and a catalyst to go and find a GW store. I'm sure it's going to hurt wargaming in the long run.

Indeed, but WH Smiths is not the be all and end all, and I believe Martins still stocks White Dwarf - as do the supermarkets - and Dragon magazine far outsold WD, back in the day - but I somehow doubt you have ever heard of it.

However I was speaking of when WH Smith did stock the magazines I was referring to, which since you are obsessed with GW, carried advertisements for Citadel, Marauder etc. And of course the Tyne Tees TV series the Battleground with Edward Woodward should not be disregarded in this respect.

byw... I doubt the withdrawl of WD will have the chicken licken effect you suggest on wargaming, as Smiiths still stock Miniature Wargaming, WSS, and Wargames Illustrated - which following your logic will only be a good thing for the hobby as it will produce a generation of gamers free from the OCD of the GW generation.

**marielle**

Easy E wrote:
Palindrome wrote:
marielle wrote:
[
And of course the Tyne Tees TV series the Battleground with Edward Woodward should not be disregarded in this respect.

A wargaming Tv series in the 70's, I never would have guessed that such a thing existed. http://wargaming4grownups.blogspot.co.uk/2009/11/edward-woodward-battleground.html

Edward Woodward? You mean the Equalizer? I would liek to see this show!

Indeed, but the problem is that it will cost you @£800 an episode for the TV company to give you a copy - and there are apparently copyright restrictions that prevent you from distributing it.

Which is a shame as there is a refight of Gettysburg using Britain's figures.

**marielle**

Aerethan wrote:
At a month old, this really didn't need to get dragged back to the first page.

Too soon?

**marielle**

kronk wrote:
Phobos wrote:
Many of the wargames companies are UK based, and there seems to be more UK players than USA players, in spite of the population in the USA being nearly 5 times larger.

So what gives? Is wargaming a more "mainstream" hobby over there?

The UK may have a higher % per capita of wargamers than the USA, but I refuse to believe that there are more total wargamers in the UK than there are in the USA.

I'm curious as to why you believe this?

Incidentally it should be borne in mind that the country with the most wargamers is probably Germany.

Automatically Appended Next Post:

Aerethan wrote:
MajorTom11 wrote:
Aerethan wrote:
At a month old, this really didn't need to get dragged back to the first page.

Not your call Aerethan. A month is not all that long, thread stays open.

Thanks!

Well then how about the part where the bump was entirely off topic?

Really?

So the broadcasting of a network television series at precisely the moment when many of the major figures - in terms of GW... Rick Priestly, the Perrys, Mark Copplestone, etc, etc etc, are in their early to mid teens - has no influence on the way wargaming develops in the 1980's and 90's?

And subsequently creates the impression, on which the thread hangs, that wargaming is more popular in the UK because of the numerous companies and figure ranges/rules that have spun off and out of GW. Not to mention the historical mini manufacturers of which many on this site are entirely ignorant.

Odd.