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As a new Eldar-player, I'm still expanding my army.
I don't like putting hundreds of dollars into several tanks just to make a competitive spam list and seem like a jerk.
And since also the Jetbikes look lame to me, I have decided to make my army infantry-heavy with mostly Aspect Warriors (and some Wraith-units) with 2 tanks at most.

How competitive is that kind of setup?
How will I deal with tanks/ what are the best HS-options without Prism/Spinner?
(I'll hear your points about the Wraithknight but I'm not likely putting near 100€ in a single model.)

Thanks in advance!

Aspects can be good, but they need to be slotted together to work.

Autarchs can be kitted out for more roles, and can take jumppacks or teleport packs.
Farseers are always useful.

Warp Spiders can take up to AV13, with S6-7 weapons.
Swooping Hawks get Haywire grenades for all AVs.
Dire Avengers can take dire swords for multi-W targets, but massed shuriken weapons are good for that.
Crimson Hunter aircraft are Aspect Warriors, but the models are vehicle-sized.

Wraiths come in many flavours, from both types of Wraithguard, to Lords and Knights. They are high-T, have good saves, and the WL and WK can take long-ranged heavy weapons.
If you take any wraiths, look a the Wraithseer. They can be good when assigned to any unit, but can buff wraiths near them.

But, there's also the weapon batteries and war walkers. It probably depends if you want to use Guardians or not.

It's not about the fluff and 5+ armor makes no difference in vehicle. I can use Guardians as well, altough my regular Troop choice will always be DA over Guardians.

I was also thinking about Warp Packs on Autarch, kitting one in Marine-killing, and stick him into Spider squad. Move twelve, run, shoot, move back 2d6". Repeat until the enemy squad is squishy enough to be assaulted. Challenge HQ/PW Sgt. Profit.

I own 5 wraithguard and 5 blades and I'm thinking to add a Lord to suck up fire, saving the blades to CC

The problem with Wraithblades is getting them into combat.
Compared to the rest of the codex, wraiths are slow. They don't get the run/shoot option, but without guns, it doesn't matter the Blades. They really want to ride a transport to the battle.
Even thought Warlocks can't join a wraith unit, a Wraithseer can? That might be worth doing.

Can't an Autarch with a warp-pack move and shoot with a heavy weapon? Take a Reaper launcher, maybe.

I would also suggest some Dark Eldar allies. Specifically the Baron and a Beastpack. If you take a Farseer and Avatar, and attach the Farseer to the Beastpack, it becomes Fearless. Then you can march up the field and your expensive aspect warriors and wraith units can stay behind the beasts, which your opponent will have to deal with quickly. The Avatar is great for making everything Fearless in a Footdar list, and can add some extra anti-tank abilities.

 soomemafia wrote:
I don't like putting hundreds of dollars into several tanks just to make a competitive spam list and seem like a jerk.

Are you implying that playing Serpent SPAM makes you a jerk?

 Godless-Mimicry wrote:

 soomemafia wrote:
I don't like putting hundreds of dollars into several tanks just to make a competitive spam list and seem like a jerk.

Are you implying that playing Serpent SPAM makes you a jerk?

My apologies if I made that impression. I juts know several guys playing shameless spamming-army and they are simply really boring to play against (and often OP).

 soomemafia wrote:

 Godless-Mimicry wrote:

 soomemafia wrote:
I don't like putting hundreds of dollars into several tanks just to make a competitive spam list and seem like a jerk.

Are you implying that playing Serpent SPAM makes you a jerk?

My apologies if I made that impression. I juts know several guys playing shameless spamming-army and they are simply really boring to play against (and often OP).

I think he was just saying that he would feel like a jerk. Often times players are more strict on themselves when they feel like they're playing too powerful of a list. When we play against that same list, we either complain or go with it because, at tournaments, you expect to see that type of list.

I used to feel like a jerk in 5th for running 9 hive guard.


Usually the players I would call "jerks" would be equally jerkish if they played a fluffy Sisters of Battle list as they would with any spam.

Okay, so I made a quick 750p list:

Autarch - 115p
- Warp Jump Generator
- Firesabre

Warp Spiders - 110p
- Exarch w/ TL Death Spinner

Dire Avengers - 140p (x2)
- Exarch

Rangers - 60p

War Walkers - 140p
- Dual BL each

C&C appreciated!

i tried a foot dar list for feast of blades qualifier.... it did O.K.

won fist 2 rounds vs GK and SM. players wernet amazing tho. 3rd round vs competive eldar.... failed miserably. still got third tho

so in conclusion, sure it can work, but competitive? dependos on your opponent i guess.

as for that list, looks pretty solid. i would take out firesabre on autach for DA exraches to take shimmer sheilds. help us squishy elves survive.

Farseers aren't naturally Fearless; they are Ld 10. There is a piece of wargear called the Shard of Anaris that, amongst a fe other things, confers Fearless.

Foot slogging is a slow way to die. A Iyanden army on foot is viable, others are not.

 soomemafia wrote:

your list is good at 750 I have a few suggestions and some for expanding it for later

Autarch - 115p
- Warp Jump Generator
- Firesabre

If your going CC with a autarch when you have more points add banshee mask, the shard or anaris is by far better, and a death spinner
however go with a farseer at this point value

Warp Spiders - 110p
- Exarch w/ TL Death Spinner

TL ing an Exarch doesn't give you much better so just give him fast shot, the chace of hitting 3 times outweights the reroll on a one IMO

Dire Avengers - 140p (x2)
- Exarch

Honestly the Exarch is not needed his better BS WS and I come at 10 points which isn't bad however a challenge could pose a problem, most people tend to field 10 regular avengers

Rangers - 60p

keep these guys in low numbers they lost some flare since last edition

War Walkers - 140p
- Dual BL each

I love war walkers and this one is a tank killer something you need with this list

I play a mixed list and do very well I have never won undefeated (best general), but I placed everytime now since the new codex (winning Best Over All: Point, Paint Score, and Sportsman combined)

Don't underestimate Guardians Defenders they are good in both wave serpents and as a 20 elf blob squad with max heavy weapons

Warp Spiders, Dire avengers, Fire Dragons and Dark Reapers are amazing

As for footslogging infantry you'll find mixed reports on eveything else.

ADL with Icarus lascannon is a good choice for footdar as it gives cover for your fire support units like Dark Reapers and grants you that AA gun that could be a boon

A new try:

Autarch - 125p
- Warp Jump Generator
- Shard of Anaris (seems good but no AP value makes me cry. When tight on points, I might also consider Scorpion Chainsword to neglect the S3 problem)

Warp Spiders - 115p
- Exarch w/ Fast Shot

Dire Avengers - 130p (x2)

Rangers - 60p

War Walkers - 140p
- Dual BL each

50 points to play with. If I replace the Shard with Scorpsword, I'll have 87p. So If I remove the Rangers or 1 War Walker I might take Wave Serpent (TL Scatter Laser, Cannon, Holo-fields) for one DA.
(Any way to stuff Wraithguard/blades in there?)

Take the Soulshrive from Iyanden supplement. It starts as S3 AP2, but for every unsaved wound(should be a few with 5 attacks on the charge) its' S rises by 1. So 3 wounds, you're suddenly S6. 7 wounds and you're S10 with 5A on I6. Not bad if you ask me.

Okay, so let me tell you again that I'm not fond of Iyanden...
I'll use some Wraith-units because they DO look cool, but that's it, I'm not going to use every goddamn magia trick they have to make my very few Wraithguard a tiny bit better.

if you want to play foot-dar, I would look into allies of DE. Hellions and the Baron are a very good unit to ally with a farseer on a bike. I'm working on a foot-dar list right now as well.

Farseer on bike with singing spear
Farseer on bike with shard

warlock on bike with singing spear

10 avengers with exarch having pw/shimmershied
10 avengers(same as above)
3 jetbikes
6 jetbikes with 2 cannons

8 spiders
8 spiders

Wraithknight
Wraithknight
3 war walkers with 2x scatter lasers each

allies:

Baron

14 Hellions

The biggest problems I forsee are helldrakes, baal preds with flamestorms, dreadknights with heavy incinerators, etc. templates in general of ap4 or less give me shivers. Also, the list is kinda light on Anti-air so cron air could be an issue. It's very skill intensive and definitely a finesse army but I think it can compete with most things out there.

 wuestenfux wrote:
Foot slogging is a slow way to die. A Iyanden army on foot is viable, others are not.

I'm sure Reecius strongly begs to differ.

 soomemafia wrote:
As a new Eldar-player, I'm still expanding my army.
I don't like putting hundreds of dollars into several tanks just to make a competitive spam list and seem like a jerk.
And since also the Jetbikes look lame to me, I have decided to make my army infantry-heavy with mostly Aspect Warriors (and some Wraith-units) with 2 tanks at most.

How competitive is that kind of setup?
How will I deal with tanks/ what are the best HS-options without Prism/Spinner?
(I'll hear your points about the Wraithknight but I'm not likely putting near 100€ in a single model.)

Thanks in advance!

I'm not sure what you want us to tell you.

Wave serpent spam is a proven effective build. It will always be better than exposed dudes on foot.

If you play a massed infantry army, don't expect it to be competitive.

Asmodai Asmodean wrote:

 soomemafia wrote:
As a new Eldar-player, I'm still expanding my army.
I don't like putting hundreds of dollars into several tanks just to make a competitive spam list and seem like a jerk.
And since also the Jetbikes look lame to me, I have decided to make my army infantry-heavy with mostly Aspect Warriors (and some Wraith-units) with 2 tanks at most.

How competitive is that kind of setup?
How will I deal with tanks/ what are the best HS-options without Prism/Spinner?
(I'll hear your points about the Wraithknight but I'm not likely putting near 100€ in a single model.)

Thanks in advance!

I'm not sure what you want us to tell you.

Wave serpent spam is a proven effective build. It will always be better than exposed dudes on foot.

If you play a massed infantry army, don't expect it to be competitive.

My point is that people talk about Wave Serpent like it's some damn god or something.
A friend of mine asked about this here in Dakka some time ago. He said that he has 6 Serpents and asked how his list could be better, and the answer of most people was "well, get seventh".

And it seems just so stupid to me. What I'm asking is that aren't there any effective Eldar-builds without massive spamming?

My answer is there are effective builds that don't revolve around serpents but they are much, much harder to use properly and play well.

Well, for something that's supposed to be a hobby that we all do in our free time, you can either run something competitive that you hate using, or something less-so that allows you to play the way you want.

Sadly, too many people take the first option, and then complain about being forced into using those units. Tournaments will be like that, if you want to do well in them, but there is nothing stopping you from setting up a casual game where both players try out different lists rather than practicing and fine-tuning their tournament lists. I think foot-dar fits into that category.

Unfortunately they made serpents overpowered this edition. People saw it and they are going to use it. It works the same way in all games. People will Min/Max everything. If you have evr played an MMORPG people have a Flavor of the Patch and they change their charcter class depending on what the best PVP damage dealer or PVP healer is at the time. It will never change. People want to win and so if serpent spam is the flavor of the month to win then you are going to see nothing but serpent spam from any competitive eldar player.

There are many builds I've used that can and have competed with the top lists out there...but it does require virtually flawless game play and an intimate knowledge of all your units rules backwards and forwards.

 Xerics wrote:
Unfortunately they made serpents overpowered this edition. People saw it and they are going to use it. It works the same way in all games. People will Min/Max everything. If you have evr played an MMORPG people have a Flavor of the Patch and they change their charcter class depending on what the best PVP damage dealer or PVP healer is at the time. It will never change. People want to win and so if serpent spam is the flavor of the month to win then you are going to see nothing but serpent spam from any competitive eldar player.

Well, I've played Serpent spam for a while. Its very powerful. So I stopped playing it and now I'm working on armies that are harder to use.

As said above, fast moving units with flamers (e.g., Helldrakes, Dreadknights, Baal Predators) are a big threat to foot slogging armies. You have to be prepared for these threats.

It's always been funny how Wave Serpents oscillate from being shittingly bad to incredibly OP.

Asmodai Asmodean wrote:
It's always been funny how Wave Serpents oscillate from being shittingly bad to incredibly OP.

Try to kill 6 Serpents and 3 Warwalkers in a 1500 pt game. Tau tried it twice in RTTs and in both games almost got tabled. Sorry to be off-topic.

Footdar could eventually work. For this, you have to consider an Avatar to be fortuned such that Guardians and Dire Avengers can work in its fearlessness bubble. Eldar is the psyker of choice for this army. Add some fire support units like Warwalkers and a counter-strike unit like Harlies.

You need something to really pull it together. Something that will draw and accept a lot of fire.

In this you will need either a seerStar or a few wraithKnights. Those are high threat targets that will draw attention from your foot units.

If you have that element your in a much better position.