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I'm looking at creating a thousand point list for a doubles competition and I really like what Tigurius and divination can do. However I'm not enamoured with the Ultramarine chapter tactic, especially versus the Imperial Fist one. My question is thus is he worth the trade off?

I'd say yes. His guaranteed warlord trait is fantastic, he is mega cheap for what he brings alone. Finally, the ultramarines tactics are fine: they're not white scars it's true, but they're pretty damn flexible and useful.

the main issue is repainting your whole army in Ultramarine colours

Hmmm I'm running a loyalist Astral Claws army. I was under the impression that so long as I used the right chapter tactic it wouldn't matter what way they where painted?

Are you willing to have a pod full of marines that can reroll to hit once a game? Or are you willing to unlock tellion on a icarus lascannon (to snipe enemy characters with... lol).

If so, you can ally your IF with Ultras to get him.

 lunarman wrote:
the main issue is repainting your whole army in Ultramarine colours

I don't care if your ultramarines are blue, red, or pink.
So long as your using the UM CT, you can use whatever you like.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

kevhplus9 wrote:
I'm looking at creating a thousand point list for a doubles competition and I really like what Tigurius and divination can do. However I'm not enamoured with the Ultramarine chapter tactic, especially versus the Imperial Fist one. My question is thus is he worth the trade off?

In regards to this question, the UM tactics are really under-rated. While they are not consistently strong, they give you some good flexability during the game. If the UM are your primary detachment, your going to need to build your army around using them. You will need tactical squads, dev squads, assault/bike squads, etc.

So, how is everyone using Tigurius? IE, what units are you attaching him to? I keep having trouble where I want to have the option to combat squad any of my infantry (for more scoring, to specialize the shooting portions, to avoid getting pie plated by an intercepting Riptide upon deep strike arrival, etc). Unfortunately, he can't fit in Drop Pods or Rhinos with a full squad.
As a result, I'm currently looking at attaching him to a large IG blob squad with some Autocannons.
I also considered putting him with Devestator Centurions, but the unit just looks so expensive, and they also get outclassed in damage output by other options unless you're running the Grav Cannons, in which case range becomes a problem.
SO.... how is everyone else running this seemingly badass character?

 lunarman wrote:
the main issue is repainting your whole army in Ultramarine colours

Rules citation please.

For the moment, I played him in an escalation game and we all started at 500pts. I used him in 4 games up to now and integrated him in a unit of 8 ordinary space marines. I rolled the invuln 4++(can't remember the name) and took Prescience in divination in each games and tried some powers in Pyromancy and biomancy for the third power.

I also had an anihilator pred which I made invulnerable for a few turns. I made good use of the chapter tactics for twinlinking tactical squads. I also used his warlord power and then prescicence for the rest of the game.

I think he is a top of the line booster character.

When we will increase the games to 750pts, I will probably add a storm talon and will make use of his ability to reroll reserves.

Just for him, I will always have an Ultramarine primary or secondary detachment in my lists.

PS: BTW, My marines are home brew and are sand colored with colored shoulder pads (desert marines style called the Iron Scorpions) and I always used them has Space marines, blood angels and Dark angels.
Note that I always wysiwyg my stuff and thus always have the legit characters/units from each armies. I never proxy them. That is basically the rule I forced on myself with my habit of switching codex regularly.... though I do not expect to return to dark angels anytime soon with the new SM codex.... The only thing I could gain from the DA codex would probably be a powerfield generator or a Dark shroud, but Tiggy can provide some inivulnerables saves if lucky so I do not think this will occur.)

Smurf chapter tactics are the least user friendly but have every bit as much potential as white scars. The problem with tigurius isn't being ultrasmurfs it's calgar does so much more for you, and tig+cal= real expensive. auto Pass fail leadership + 4th use chapter tactics is as amazing as khan bikers.

Thatguyoverthere11 wrote:
Are you willing to have a pod full of marines that can reroll to hit once a game? Or are you willing to unlock tellion on a icarus lascannon (to snipe enemy characters with... lol).

If so, you can ally your IF with Ultras to get him.

You can't take allies in a doubles tournament

 A GumyBear wrote:

Thatguyoverthere11 wrote:
Are you willing to have a pod full of marines that can reroll to hit once a game? Or are you willing to unlock tellion on a icarus lascannon (to snipe enemy characters with... lol).

If so, you can ally your IF with Ultras to get him.

You can't take allies in a doubles tournament

And you know this how? Not every tournament uses the same rulespack. And considering I've played in a doubles event where allies were allowed, it proves you are wrong with such a blanket statement here. Let the OP give the rules for the tournament before jumping to such falsely generalist conclusions.

Hmmm I'm running a loyalist Astral Claws army. I was under the impression that so long as I used the right chapter tactic it wouldn't matter what way they where painted?

Yeah, that's how it works. You just can't take say, Tigurius and then use White Scars Chapter tactics. That's the actual rule. You can paint them whatever you want ...

There are a few ways to take tigger without being totally stuck in.

Tigger + telion scout squad as allies. Small and effective.

Im doing an ultra drop pod army at 1500 for the lst little while. First three pods that come down contain two dreads and a tac squad for de-meching people or flaming out campy units.

Then down comes Tigirius, along with another tac squad to finish up the job, cast some protection and then I pop my twinlink tactic. If anything is left of the first tac squad, it tries to launch some assaults or screen what just came down. Now is also when a storm raven and talon come in (rolling separately for each) because of twin linked reserves.

Tiggy and some sniper scouts....hhhmmm I like that idea . As for the tournament its a friendly one that the local games centre is running, they haven't exactly said that allies aren't allowed but then again at such a small price point I would imagine its implied. Thanks for the advice


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I just looked at Telion's outline. What does it mean when it says that his weapon is strength X? That can't mean ten can it?

Its sniper class so wounds on a 4+ rending on a 6.

Thanks I should have realised

With these rules we need equivalent Heros for other chapters like iron hands ( who have no Heros in this codex)

Iron hands have god mode chapter master. I think that qualifies.

It's S1 but wounds on a 4+ always.

Look up Sniper in the rulebook.

Drakka77 wrote:
With these rules we need equivalent Heros for other chapters like iron hands ( who have no Heros in this codex)

You'll have to wait for your supplement I guess, but your wait will be shorter than Night Lords/Iron Warriors/Alpha Legion/Word Bearers, so it could be worse.

BronzeJon wrote:
It's S1 but wounds on a 4+ always.

Look up Sniper in the rulebook.

Str 3 against vehicles.

My money? Absolutely. Anyone familiar with my normal posting style can attest that I'm normally really against proclaiming something "better" or "best" in any given codex, but if I had to pick a "best" character from the new Marines codex, it would be Tigurius hands down.

My main temptation with him comes from me running a lot of devastators on a skyshield and having three squads of legion of the damned in reserve. His combined talents of twin linking and reserve manipulation, in addition to his defense of the pad against scary daemons and such is very tough to give up. The ultramarines chapter tactics almost even seem to compete with the imperial fists for devastator redeployment and one turn of full on tactical fire and rerolled assault rolls, but I feel that the imperial fists perhaps mixed with a raven guard laserback with a librarian might make a meaner punch. What do you think in my situation?

Is Tigurus Worth It?

Just some quick notes based on what I've read in this thread.

Tiggy can't drop down and cast any blessings or maledictions, from my understanding of the rules for those. I don't have my rulebook handy, can someone confirm this?

I played an 1850 point game with him and a salamanders detachment. The Ultra tacticals dropped in first and popped rhinos, razorbacks and a dread. After that, tiggy was not in range to help them out and being tacticals they died fast. The best benefit of the UM tactical doctrine will be when you have a bunch of squishy targets in front of a tactical gunline.

storm of fire was nice. Prescience was nice. Foreboding deterred someone charging a LOTD squad.

I think Tiggy is a great force multiplier, but probably works best in a gunline next to devastators using storm and prescience on them.

My god, your absolutely right! Looks like ive cheated two people playing the drop list already; I'll hafta go back and correct that soon!

I had the same problem of not knowing rules when I started playing with MC's for the first time, although that time it benefited me not at all!

What is it that makes the Tigster so great? Reserve manipulation and twin-linking (Divination along with the Warlord trait)? Is being L3 and the ability to reroll tests (and the powers obtained) that great? I've been thinking of grabbing a cheap DA Librarian just for Prescience, and in that context Tiggy seems pretty lackluster. I may be selling the rest of the psychic shenanigans available short though.

Is he worth it just as a L3 librarian with really reliable psychic powers?

 Lansirill wrote:
What is it that makes the Tigster so great? Reserve manipulation and twin-linking (Divination along with the Warlord trait)? Is being L3 and the ability to reroll tests (and the powers obtained) that great? I've been thinking of grabbing a cheap DA Librarian just for Prescience, and in that context Tiggy seems pretty lackluster. I may be selling the rest of the psychic shenanigans available short though.

Is he worth it just as a L3 librarian with really reliable psychic powers?

Yes.

Simply put, all that twin-linking is, in fact a huge deal. Divination really is THAT good. Having a good chance of getting the exact powers you want really can help you that much.

He rerolls ALL failed psychic tests, so even at leadership 10 you can almost guarantee no miscasts. He gets to reroll all of his psychic power choices if he wishes, or just one, or two. He gets divination. He makes your reserves more reliable and not coming in piecemeal. And he happens to be no slouch in combat, although only initiative 4, 3 wounds and a soul blaze master crafted staff with 3 attacks is pretty beast.

Tigurius on his own can be good. At 1K points, I'd spring for Telion and an ADL Quad gun to put him on and try to have a sternguard squad in there too. That'll eat up a lot of points, but Tigurius with Sternguard can be very dangerous. Prescience means you're basically going to hit with all your shots, and you have a high chance of getting the relentless power if you roll twice (with rerolls on the biomancy table). That's a unit that will be able to do a lot of damage to a lot of things.