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Haven't played Druchii in 8th so far, just getting back with them now, however I have forty Corsairs on sprues, and am wondering if the handbow is now seen a useful option. Just wondering as two hand weapons was the go to choice in 7th, well it was when I had my previous force, and I'm wondering how best to equip them.

My options pretty much are, two units of twenty, armed the same way depending if the handbow is seen as a hindrance/best, or one of each type if their is no advantage. Or should I go with a forty man horde force armed in one way or the other.

Do any Dark Elf players or folks who face Druchii often and who have been playing in 8th got any suggestions?

Well, right now by far the best way to go is a horde of 30-40 with AHWs and the Sea Serpent Standard.

But that may change in a week.

I would wait, and see what the new Army Book brings.

Played against a guy at a gaming store a few times who used units of 10 with a musician and hand bows with reasonable success. Obviously these were fairly casual games but I found them to be a bit of a nuisance.

Units of 10 with handbows do work decently as chaff, but I find that Dark Riders and Harpies tend to do the whole chaff-thing better. Still, it's a good use for Corsairs if you're looking for a change.

 The Shadow wrote:
Units of 10 with handbows do work decently as chaff, but I find that Dark Riders and Harpies tend to do the whole chaff-thing better. Still, it's a good use for Corsairs if you're looking for a change.

Good use? 10? Handbows? Comprehend! Don't! Brain! Fail!

In competitive play, 30+ with AHW and SSS is the only setup you'll ever take.

The reasons for this are: Mindrazor. Winning.

 thedarkavenger wrote:

 The Shadow wrote:
Units of 10 with handbows do work decently as chaff, but I find that Dark Riders and Harpies tend to do the whole chaff-thing better. Still, it's a good use for Corsairs if you're looking for a change.

Good use? 10? Handbows? Comprehend! Don't! Brain! Fail!

In competitive play, 30+ with AHW and SSS is the only setup you'll ever take.

The reasons for this are: Mindrazor. Winning.

Like you say, certainly not the best use, but a good use if you don't want to run the usual horde for whatever reason.

 thedarkavenger wrote:


Good use? 10? Handbows? Comprehend! Don't! Brain! Fail!
In competitive play, 30+ with AHW and SSS is the only setup you'll ever take.
The reasons for this are: Mindrazor. Winning.

Ok I'll go ahead and bold the parts of Shadow's qoute you obviously didnt read....

 The Shadow wrote:
Units of 10 with handbows do work decently as chaff, but I find that Dark Riders and Harpies tend to do the whole chaff-thing better. Still, it's a good use for Corsairs if you're looking for a change.

Not only has he offered an alternative to the horde method (which the OP has already acknowledged as a viable way to run Corsairs) but Shadow also admitted that there are other, possibly better options for that role and conceded that this is an alternative method for fun/casual games. All you have done is made some pseudo-witty comment followed by a sweeping generalisation... not helpful.

Despite this, hordes of 30 with AHW and the Sea Serpent Standard are the most common way you will see them played, but the frenzy from the standard makes them a prime target for re-directors so be prepared to deal with that.

alex87 wrote:


Despite this, hordes of 30 with AHW and the Sea Serpent Standard are the most common way you will see them played, but the frenzy from the standard makes them a prime target for re-directors so be prepared to deal with that.

I'll just happily sit them behind one out of 5 harpies until I want them to charge. Done. Dealt with. Handbows won't be firing until you're within charge range. At which point, the unit is better off charging.

Cheers for the tips, and yeah I have no real concern about small units or big Horde, which ever suits me best I suppose. Just wanted some tactical insight from those using them of late.

Still seems the handbows aren't worth taking overall which seems a shame. I might take a risk on some anyways, but as it was noted I suppose it can all change next week if the banner gets nerfed or dropped.

Thanks to all those who responded.

You can mix and match them a bit if you really wanted. WYSIWYG isn't a massive issue in Fantasy, so as long as the front rank have the same equipment to what you say you're using, it's almost always fine. So, you can mix them around and change what setup you use in each game, if you want. And it's not like handbows and hand weapons actually look that different.

Handbow range is getting increased to 12".


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Sea Serpent banner is not in

Yeah if the banner is indeed removed, hand bows might not be so bad.

With the current book (not that it will matter for too much longer) units of 28 have worked well for a guy in our group.

He uses 2 units of 28: 1 with SSS and two hand weapons, the other with the AP banner and two hand weapons in his Corsair themed army.

7x4 is decent as the horde formation wastes a lot of the frenzy attacks, and this way you put out 28 attacks from the frenzy unit and 21 with AP from the other without running 10 wide or wasting the points of bumping them up to 40.

Also, I rather like the Corsairs with hand bows, but they are not the best option. Compromise! Make Shades from corsair bits plus the new High Elf Shadow warriors! If you use cloaks/ legs from the SWs and the arms/ heads from the Corsairs its a decent kit bash that makes unique models

 thedarkavenger wrote:

 The Shadow wrote:
Units of 10 with handbows do work decently as chaff, but I find that Dark Riders and Harpies tend to do the whole chaff-thing better. Still, it's a good use for Corsairs if you're looking for a change.

Good use? 10? Handbows? Comprehend! Don't! Brain! Fail!

In competitive play, 30+ with AHW and SSS is the only setup you'll ever take.

The reasons for this are: Mindrazor. Winning.

You only get 1 mindrazor. You still need more core.
20 with handbows is surprisingly good; if you're using buildings. It makes for an awesome mage bunker. Shoot, stand and shoot, fight, then you're stubborn. Repeat.


-Matt

 HawaiiMatt wrote:

 thedarkavenger wrote:

 The Shadow wrote:
Units of 10 with handbows do work decently as chaff, but I find that Dark Riders and Harpies tend to do the whole chaff-thing better. Still, it's a good use for Corsairs if you're looking for a change.

Good use? 10? Handbows? Comprehend! Don't! Brain! Fail!

In competitive play, 30+ with AHW and SSS is the only setup you'll ever take.

The reasons for this are: Mindrazor. Winning.

You only get 1 mindrazor. You still need more core.
20 with handbows is surprisingly good; if you're using buildings. It makes for an awesome mage bunker. Shoot, stand and shoot, fight, then you're stubborn. Repeat.


-Matt

You only need 1 unit of corsairs in the army, as the current book stands. That is for the mindrazor. The rest of your core is a power dice bunker for the level 4. What the new book brings is fair game to say.

You know what makes for a better mage bunker? More warriors. Paying 200 points for 20 models, is a waste when with Warriors you could get 33 warriors for 198.

This is without any upgrade.

Also, with the shoot, stand and shoot plan, you need to march to get in range to make use of them, which eliminate shooting. Then you hit on 6s when charged. I'm failing how to see that they're good.

 thedarkavenger wrote:

You only need 1 unit of corsairs in the army, as the current book stands. That is for the mindrazor. The rest of your core is a power dice bunker for the level 4. What the new book brings is fair game to say.
You know what makes for a better mage bunker? More warriors. Paying 200 points for 20 models, is a waste when with Warriors you could get 33 warriors for 198.
This is without any upgrade.
Also, with the shoot, stand and shoot plan, you need to march to get in range to make use of them, which eliminate shooting. Then you hit on 6s when charged. I'm failing how to see that they're good.

In a mage bunker, I'm even more happy if I never get in range to shoot. That means my mage is safe all game long. If you charge the building, quick to fire lets me stand and shoot. If you don't break them (they are steadfast in the building), you're pushed 1" away and combat ends (building rules). On my turn, I cast freely, and shoot again, and then stand and shoot when you charge.
Due to not being able to be locked in combat, you are getting a shooting phase every turn. Quick to fire also gives you a stand and shoot every turn. Building rules say only 1 unit can charge you, so they cannot even attempt to soak up the stand and fire with a throwaway unit.
A 3 story building is giving you 30 shots on 4+, and 30 shots on 5+ every turn that enemies are attack. That's ~32 S3 hits per game turn. Old rules, take it with a focus familiar and you get plenty of range options for your spells, and give them corsairs the banner of discipline.

New rules, the sacrifice dagger only works on a 4+; if you fail, you can knife another. With warriors going up in cost, I'd seriously question the value of that knife. You're looking at close to 20 points per bonus power die.

-Matt

 HawaiiMatt wrote:
In a mage bunker, I'm even more happy if I never get in range to shoot.

Then why spend more points on corsairs than warriors then?

And if the rumours are true of Witches going to core, I'm not failing to see why anyone would take anything other than two 300 point hordes. It gives you two mindrazor targets, and lets you focus your army even more.

 thedarkavenger wrote:

 HawaiiMatt wrote:
In a mage bunker, I'm even more happy if I never get in range to shoot.

Then why spend more points on corsairs than warriors then?

And if the rumours are true of Witches going to core, I'm not failing to see why anyone would take anything other than two 300 point hordes. It gives you two mindrazor targets, and lets you focus your army even more.

You have to put your level 4 somewhere.
IIRC, they still cannot join witch elf units (or executioners). And I pretty sure you don't want to stick the level 4 in the front of your frenzied melee unit; far too easy to kill the wizard before she gets to cast mindrazor.
The whole reason to take a 2nd block of corsairs is to have something durable to hide your wizard in.

-Matt

 HawaiiMatt wrote:

 thedarkavenger wrote:

 HawaiiMatt wrote:
In a mage bunker, I'm even more happy if I never get in range to shoot.

Then why spend more points on corsairs than warriors then?

And if the rumours are true of Witches going to core, I'm not failing to see why anyone would take anything other than two 300 point hordes. It gives you two mindrazor targets, and lets you focus your army even more.

You have to put your level 4 somewhere.
IIRC, they still cannot join witch elf units (or executioners). And I pretty sure you don't want to stick the level 4 in the front of your frenzied melee unit; far too easy to kill the wizard before she gets to cast mindrazor.
The whole reason to take a 2nd block of corsairs is to have something durable to hide your wizard in.

-Matt

And rather helpfully, their sea dragon cloaks are now confirmed to be simply 'Scaly Skin 5+', meaning if they keep light armour, (which I'm fairly positive they are), gives you a 4+ save mage bunker with a stand an shoot reaction.

In my general experience playing a very small group of guys (who are very competitive in my eyes) horde formation of corsairs with AHW and SSS banner is definitely the way to go. Even the mere THREAT of having a mindrazor go off on that single unit is enough to force your openent into a disadvantage in the movement phase.
If my opponent focuses his attention on that horde and moves to present the best front to the corsairs, he opens up the flank to cold ones and hydra/dragon (yes i run a terribly suboptimized list, but i love the black dragon and can't bring myself to cut it out). This has the added benefit of making my spear bunker for my sac sorc get nearly ignored.
If he focuses on the speark bunker to try and get the mindrazor out of play, corsairs to the flank with frenzy and AHW in horde formation is NOTHING to scoff at, no matter what the unit you face is, again freeing up my dragon, hydra, and cold ones to engage the targets that they WANT freely.

Even without the mindrazor, AHW and SSS is still a pretty tough nut to crack with enough bodies piled in. But i will say this, when the mindrazor does go off it is absolutely beautiful to behold!

With the rumors of the corsairs losing the SSS standard option the possibility of handbows is back on the table in my book, but I am 99% certain i will still run the AHW horde barring any major nerf.

Corsairs now have the best armor save for all DE infantry(core and otherwise) now that Sea Dragon Cloaks are a straight 5+ scaly skin stacked with light armor.

So at 11 points the are 2A 4+ infantry. They can still take a 25 point banner, but the Sea Serpent Standard is gone, so basically Discipline or Eternal Flame are all that will get used.