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Essentially he is a normal human. I know he's had a load of crazy augmetics but surely he must be past his life span now?? Also how would he have survived the carnage of the dropsite massacre. I mean he lead the friggin fist company. How did he keep up?

Warp magic seems the most likely reason to me. He was pretty skillful in the dark arts.

"He is significant to the plot"
There is no other reason.

Because he is more machine than man.

And because he lives in the warp.

Having your beating heart ripped out of your chest by a Primarch and live tends to make people think your 'ard as nails and eat bolt shells for breakfast.

Why does 'by a Primarch' make a difference?

Having your heart ripped out by the hand of a Primarch is no different to having it ripped out by the hand of a regular Space Marine, a Genestealer, an Ork, or a shaman chanting Kali Ma.

@ Loki - If a woman ever told you size doesn't matter they lied

 -Loki- wrote:
Why does 'by a Primarch' make a difference?

Having your heart ripped out by the hand of a Primarch is no different to having it ripped out by the hand of a regular Space Marine, a Genestealer, an Ork, or a shaman chanting Kali Ma.

A primarch's hand is bigger than a space marine, genestealer, and (most) orks. Therefore, it left a bigger hole in Kor's chest than the other options would have.

I think the bigger question is, why wouldn't he still be alive? The guy's probably one of the chaos gods' most favored and well-versed servants. If anyone could find a way to keep on living despite not being a true space marine, it'd be him.

And yet, for all that size, all that was ripped out was the heart. Same outcome. Primarch really makes little difference. If he's alive after losing his heart, the size of the hole wouldn't be making a whole lot of difference.

I think the big smurf wanted to rip out more than his heart. I'd say other stuff was ripped out and ruptured too when he suffered that 'flesh wound'. But thanks to plot armour set to maximum he lived.

Kor Phaeron is one of the most powerful sorcerers to ever live.

That alone is a sufficient explanation for his longevity.

Living the vast bulk of his lifespan in the Eye of Terror also helps explain it.

But during the early stages of the heresy he wasn't a super powerful sorcerer. How would a human in terminator armor kept up with space marines.

Luthor was a normal human, augmented to be better but still not Astartes, and he could pretty much keep up with his Primarch.

If you are a badass from the beginning, augmentation just makes you even more badass.

Terminator armour in it's one right is enough to enhance a normal human, which is why Inquisitors and the like wear it. Hector Rex banished An'ggrath the Unbound after a duel.

Luther couldn't keep up with his Primarch. He needed the backing of all four Chaos Gods to have that kind of ability. He could, however, outperform the majority of the Marines under his command.

Same with Kor Phaeron, who was considered an exceptional warrior, no sorcery needed.

However, both he and Kor Phaeron were still physically augmented to be far beyond humanity, lessening the gap between human and Astartes significantly, allowing Luther and Kor Phaeron to be exemplars in their Legions.

i didn't say he could keep up with the Lion, I said he pretty much could, slight difference. He could not go toe to toe with him at all only being human, but like you say he outshone the others amongst the Dark Angels.

The scene in Descent of Angels where they attack the last fortress of the Knights of Lupus shows Luthor kicking ass and taking names, only being outshone by the Primarch. So could pretty much keep up. He does so in more way than just being a fighter, he does so in being a leader. This is even before he became augmented.

I wasn't disagreeing, as I said, Luthor was a human like Kor Phaeron, but augmented to be better, but still not Astartes.

I was merely using Luthor as another example of an augmented human capable of feats beyond that of a normal man and closer to an Astartes, if not surpassing them.

Astartes, especially during the Heresy, are not the "Gold Standard" of human augmentation. They are quick, cheap and mass produced.

All that included, they're pretty darn good. But compare the level of augmentation in, say an Eversor Assassin. A Marine will be minced. It's perfectly possible that a few exceptional folk, like Luthor and Kor, will be upgraded on a tailor-made basis to WELL beyond Astartes spec, but doing that for an entire legion will take too darn long.

But they're not getting close to Primarch level, which is actually powered by the Warp, until they start getting a hand from Chaos.

There aren't many things that are close to Primarch level

Luthor is on par with the emp and horus in terms of his inspiring presence, had the lion not sent him home he would have outshon him by a large margin and been one of the greatest living humans the galaxy has ever seen.
Go listen to grey Angel

Graphite wrote:
Astartes, especially during the Heresy, are not the "Gold Standard" of human augmentation. They are quick, cheap and mass produced.

All that included, they're pretty darn good. But compare the level of augmentation in, say an Eversor Assassin. A Marine will be minced. It's perfectly possible that a few exceptional folk, like Luthor and Kor, will be upgraded on a tailor-made basis to WELL beyond Astartes spec, but doing that for an entire legion will take too darn long.

Was going to post something like this but instead ill just agree with you.
The astartes process is codified and relatively easy such that thick headed warriors can do it to each other in the field. The AdMech's bio enhancement branch crusade era could enhance people much further than astartes, but it would have to be an expensive custom job. That they couldnt be implanted with the astartes enhancements probably hindered them in some areas, but they could make up for it in other areas.

You are also starting with a boy, some average chump. If you start with one of humanities champions, greatest heros to ever live and then you start enhancing well even less enhancement might bring you in excess of an average astartes.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Pilau Rice wrote:
There aren't many things that are close to Primarch level

Primarch level is always a bit wierd. Just like SM level is a little off. Sometimes they are killing 10,000 orkz singlehandedly and others they are downed by a stray lasgun. Primarchs are sometimes unkillable and other times basically just space marines.

Dorn was killed on a space hulk, by what gibbering cultists?

Kruze was killed by an assassin that snuck onto his battle barge. Yes he didnt put up a fight, but if the assassin couldnt have done it with him putting up a fight why send a highly trained(and thus expensive and rare) assassin to try to kill him in the first place?

Because Phaerons are Everliving. Everyone knows that.

Ba-bum (tsh).

 Exergy wrote:

Primarch level is always a bit wierd. Just like SM level is a little off. Sometimes they are killing 10,000 orkz singlehandedly and others they are downed by a stray lasgun. Primarchs are sometimes unkillable and other times basically just space marines.

True, but it is consistently portrayed at being superior to an Astartes by some degree, varying by the the author. I am not sure where they have been said to be just marines, they seem as fallible as marines in certain regards, but their physical prowess doesn't seem to be one of these things.

 Exergy wrote:
Dorn was killed on a space hulk, by what gibbering cultists?

Unless there is more info than what the IA provides on his death then no, we don't know. Just that he died on the Sword of Sacrilege.

 Exergy wrote:

Kruze was killed by an assassin that snuck onto his battle barge. Yes he didnt put up a fight, but if the assassin couldnt have done it with him putting up a fight why send a highly trained(and thus expensive and rare) assassin to try to kill him in the first place?

Desperation, not having a better solution available at that time? The highly trained assassin got it's highly trained butt whipped by an Astartes after she had carried out the deed. I don't think there was any real chance of the attempt actually working if Curze hadn't had wanted it to happen. Even headshots don't seem to keep a Primarch down ... or Titans

 Pilau Rice wrote:

 Exergy wrote:

Kruze was killed by an assassin that snuck onto his battle barge. Yes he didnt put up a fight, but if the assassin couldnt have done it with him putting up a fight why send a highly trained(and thus expensive and rare) assassin to try to kill him in the first place?

Desperation, not having a better solution available at that time? The highly trained assassin got it's highly trained butt whipped by an Astartes after she had carried out the deed. I don't think there was any real chance of the attempt actually working if Curze hadn't had wanted it to happen. Even headshots don't seem to keep a Primarch down ... or Titans

Got her butt whipped by multiple night lords. When running around a battle barge alone the LEGION of fully armored super humans have a slight advantage when they bring their numbers to bear.

Nope, by a single legionnaire, the only one that dared ignore their fathers order to let her leave.

Anyhoo, the Assassin we're talking about aside, there are pretty scary assassins who can kill Astartes, look at the Garantine ...

 Pilau Rice wrote:
Terminator armour in it's one right is enough to enhance a normal human, which is why Inquisitors and the like wear it. Hector Rex banished An'ggrath the Unbound after a duel.

Hector Rex actually fits nicely into the theme of augmented humans. Similar to Kor Phaeron and Luther, Rex has also received extended gene therapy and biotic augmentations which brings him closer to a space marine's standards. He actually wears Artificer armour (though it also looks closer to Terminator armour to me too).

 Exergy wrote:


Dorn was killed on a space hulk, by what gibbering cultists?

It wasn't a Space Hulk. It was a Despoiler class battleship, filled with Mag'ladroth knows what.

Kruze was killed by an assassin that snuck onto his battle barge. Yes he didnt put up a fight, but if the assassin couldnt have done it with him putting up a fight why send a highly trained(and thus expensive and rare) assassin to try to kill him in the first place?

Because the Imperium is stupid.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Greyish wrote:

Hector Rex actually fits nicely into the theme of augmented humans. Similar to Kor Phaeron and Luther, Rex has also received extended gene therapy and biotic augmentations which brings him closer to a space marine's standards. He actually wears Artificer armour (though it also looks closer to Terminator armour to me too).

Being an immensely powerful psyker and wielding some of the most potent banes of Daemonkind probably also helps.

 Greyish wrote:

 Pilau Rice wrote:
Terminator armour in it's one right is enough to enhance a normal human, which is why Inquisitors and the like wear it. Hector Rex banished An'ggrath the Unbound after a duel.

Hector Rex actually fits nicely into the theme of augmented humans. Similar to Kor Phaeron and Luther, Rex has also received extended gene therapy and biotic augmentations which brings him closer to a space marine's standards. He actually wears Artificer armour (though it also looks closer to Terminator armour to me too).

My bad, it is Artificer armour, but that then add emphasis at just how much of a tank you become when you put on boss armour.

 Void__Dragon wrote:

 Greyish wrote:
Hector Rex actually fits nicely into the theme of augmented humans. Similar to Kor Phaeron and Luther, Rex has also received extended gene therapy and biotic augmentations which brings him closer to a space marine's standards. He actually wears Artificer armour (though it also looks closer to Terminator armour to me too).

Being an immensely powerful psyker and wielding some of the most potent banes of Daemonkind probably also helps.

Indeed! The fact that Rex is a highly knowledgeable daemon-expert also plays a big part in the achievement of his feats. You can never underestimate the power of knowing a daemon's true name, etc...

I think becuase he lives in the warp, and was also protected by the [matt] ward save granted by plot armor.

Chaos favor...

with a pinch of Telomerase

 King Pariah wrote:
Chaos favor...

with a pinch of Telomerase

Let's be honest....Chaos Telomeres are WAY more durable. If anyone watches Archer, they'd realize that Kor Phaeron is actually a Perpetual because he plays Archer's huskarl, Woodhouse. >.>