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Done a lot of trawling through the army list forums, and theres lots of types of 'spam'. I want to know if Land Raider spam can work? logically you could fit 3-5 in a 1750-2000 point list. Serpent spam tends to be 4-5 serpents.

So what do people think? viable?

Surprisingly, yes. A lot of armies are unprepared for AV 14 in the current meta, you could really throw someone off guard with that sort of a list.

I've ran dual LRCs with 2 vindicators and stormtalons before. And this is the 4th edition BT codex where points were a little more expensive.

Just a fully loaded dual crusaders in lrc with 2 talons and 2 tfc support is around 1400. Theres enough points for a biker captain and get 2 bike troops with special weapons, and a chaplain to join one of the crusaders.

Yes and No.
Some metas will be more than prepared to eat up that AV14, others you can just sit in them all game and take 0 damage.

Its all about saturating a specific type of threat.

Just threw together a Blood angels list, 5 squads of 5 troops, 3 assault marines without jump packs, and 2 squads of 5 tactical marines, with a reclusiarch as a hq, allows me enough points to purchase 5 land raiders, 2 standard, 1 crusaider and 2 redeemers.......

Quite tasty? or easily beaten?

Khaine's Wrath wrote:
Just threw together a Blood angels list, 5 squads of 5 troops, 3 assault marines without jump packs, and 2 squads of 5 tactical marines, with a reclusiarch as a hq, allows me enough points to purchase 5 land raiders, 2 standard, 1 crusaider and 2 redeemers.......

Quite tasty? or easily beaten?

As said, it will depend on the meta. The Landraiders should make some damage before the troops (scoring units) disembark.

Chaos can't really do it effectively, but loyalists can. Multiple raider variants and Power of the Machine Spirit means they can blow stuff up while charging forward to vomit assault units all over the enemy.

Actually Chaos can do heavy land raider quite well. In my opinion you only need two to three for it work. Take Kharn or a Khorne Lord and load them up with Berzerkers. Chaos land raiders are cheaper so it works out. Dirge casters on land raiders will make Tau cry.

As said it depends on the meta. Some armies will have an easier time dealing with it (when your anti-tank is to spam Lance weapons (like I do with my Ulthwe army) it really doesn't matter the AV of your vehicles).

It can work fantastic, but you have to understand that you'll have no chance against an opponent that's prepared.

eg,
At a tournament about 3-4 months back, In the final round I played another player who hadn't lost all day. Templars list, with 4 LR's. Godhammer, and 3 Crusaders. He also had a stormraven.

I play Eldar, and have 3 BL's in my guardians squads, two crimson hunters (4x BL's), a squad of Swooping Hawks (with haywire grenades) and Eldrad rolled up Eldrich Storm (LB Haywire).

Needless to say, they game didn't go so well for him. But he won 3/4 games, and apparently I was the first person to blow up more than 1 LR. So yeah, that tends to be how that plays out.

Pray you don't face DE...

Can work well against other armies though.

This is actually one thing Blood Angels still do really well - since their Land Raiders are dedicated transports. However, I don't think you have the option to take one in a HS slot instead...

I recently had a game with just a *single* Raider in the list, and it completely flummoxed the opponent to the point where he ended up just ignoring it - which he wouldn't be able to do if I took 3 or 4. That should tell you a lot about what people expect to face at the moment.

Belly wrote:
It can work fantastic, but you have to understand that you'll have no chance against an opponent that's prepared.

eg,
At a tournament about 3-4 months back, In the final round I played another player who hadn't lost all day. Templars list, with 4 LR's. Godhammer, and 3 Crusaders. He also had a stormraven.

I play Eldar, and have 3 BL's in my guardians squads, two crimson hunters (4x BL's), a squad of Swooping Hawks (with haywire grenades) and Eldrad rolled up Eldrich Storm (LB Haywire).

Needless to say, they game didn't go so well for him. But he won 3/4 games, and apparently I was the first person to blow up more than 1 LR. So yeah, that tends to be how that plays out.

TBH though, if he were playing a LR spam list as old BT and not taking Blessed Hull he was asking for that very scenario to happen.

Could it work? Yes. Land Raiders are great vehicles. Will they last long? Probably not. Any opponent who has even a decent TAC list will have enough melta or lance to deal with land Raiders. Heck, I designed my space marine list to be a TAC list and every single squad has at least two melta weapons in it.

I would say DA is the best way to run LR spam. Between the salvo banner, DW Vehicle rule, and PFGs, DA offers some tough LRs that can pump out a lot of firepower.

Land Raider spam is still a viable strategy. Just make sure you have some AA Capabilities as FMC Span can really hurt. Most Eldar and Tau builds will struggle vs AV 14.

IMO it and Storm Raven Spam are what BA still can do. Tri Raider and Tri Raven is doable sub 2k. If 2k, could even throw in Mephy.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 McNinja wrote:
Could it work? Yes. Land Raiders are great vehicles. Will they last long? Probably not. Any opponent who has even a decent TAC list will have enough melta or lance to deal with land Raiders. Heck, I designed my space marine list to be a TAC list and every single squad has at least two melta weapons in it.

I don't quite understand your post. How can a list with two meltas in every squad be TAC? And that is besides the point that no list can truly be TAC, best you can hope for are TMC(Take Most Comers). Most competitive armies struggle taking out multiple sources of AV14. Even Melta isn't perfect. Each marine has a 66% chance to hit, 58.33% chance to pen and a 50% chance to explode a Raider.

A Squad with a pair of meltas has only a 35% chance to blow up a Raider. A Squad with 4 meltas has a 58% chance.

Automatically Appended Next Post:

 McNinja wrote:
Could it work? Yes. Land Raiders are great vehicles. Will they last long? Probably not. Any opponent who has even a decent TAC list will have enough melta or lance to deal with land Raiders. Heck, I designed my space marine list to be a TAC list and every single squad has at least two melta weapons in it.

True enough, for most armies.

Not every army HAS melta and lance.

Orks, for example, pretty much have to punch AV 14 to death.

No Lance, no Meltabombs (Tankbusta Bombz are not the same..), No EMP, one Melta pysker power that is random rolled, and never shows up when you want it....

Of course if by some miracle a BW survives long enough they can steamroller it

Multi-LR can be pretty effective against Orks, as they tend to have to work at it to down AV 14.


Nids are a bit Melta-light too IIRC, but they have Zoanthropes and drop pods..

Here is a 2k point list that is heavy on the land raiders w/ possibility of even more LR fun you can drop the termies and power weapons for another raider. and since BA have LR as DT you can fit in lots!.

Army 2
Librarian w/ epistolary, terminator armor- 180
2 Sang priests w/ power weapons- 130
2x 10 man assault squad w/power weapons on Sgt-410 (one sergeant has a combat shield, I had 5 points left over)
Assault terminator unit w/ 4 TH/SS + corubulo-325
2 Land Raider Redeemers w/ MM as dedicated transport for assault squads- 430
2 Land Raiders w/ MM- 540

I play tri-raider spam at 1500-2000 points with dark angels .... it can work really well.

With Dark Angels it all pivots around banner of devastation (with your command squad inside the land raider) and each land raider putting out 24 twin-linked bolter shots a turn. I normally run either two bare bones tactical squads inside the other two land raiders or two squads of deathwing knights (the knights work well due to the fact if kanz / dreadnoughts / MCs / anything that gets within charge range they can disembark & smite - dropping the unit of tieing it up for a long period of time).

With Dark Angels you can run a techmarine on a bike trailing behind with a PFG for the 4+ invu save which is an extra bonus .... most armies don't expect the amount of firepower you can put out with the banner of devastation ... just 2 barebone tactical squads and 3 land raiders can put out 152 bolter shots a turn.

However after you play it a few times people will start to hard counter you by spamming as much anti-armor as possible ... the list is pretty fun to play though.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Just to throw out there, it's required that you spam land raider crusader for the salvo bolters.

Hope this helped.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
One last thing ... with DA Deathwing Vehicle it the equivalent of the old venerable rule, making your opponent reroll explodes with a land raider is well worth the 30 points (and makes all your shots preferred enemy chaos)

I'd love to play. 3-5 Land Raider lost just too see how people deal with it.
Would be pretty boring to play no? You'll have to be careful about positioning and target priority, but you'll have short turns and probably spend 3/4 of the game watching your opponent move and roll dice.

MC Nids would love it, if you get cover saves right, with some FNP and/or iron arm thrown in, a list with 5+ MC (which is really easy to fit at 1750, let alone 2000) will eat Land Raiders up, don't even need Zooanthropes, they might not even be a good idea with Librarians about.

DA with salvo, venerable, aand PFG would be nasty. Against tac lists just target the units that can hurt you 1st.

Problems would be monster heavy lists like nids or flying circus. Necrons can also be a problem depending on the list as dlords war scythes voltaic staffs and scarabs can make short work of them

I was thinking about the possibility of putting together a couple of landraiders for my Ravenguard list.

As long as I take them as dedicated transports for terminator units, they can scout. And it's possible to hide a lot of jump troops behind a land raider.

I think LR spam could work in the right meta.
I have only played against it once in my area since 6th dropped and that was against Grey knights. Suffice to say my opponent was defeated by end of T3.
Granted I do run an unconventional list but it works for my play style.
Like I said tho it all depends on your local meta, also, you must remember that LR can still suffer from the lucky golden shot as can any mech.

Since a lot of AT solutions centre around melta or lance, LR spam is only at its most effective with the Achilles, IMO. Not to mention they have THUNDERFIRE CANNONS
Achilles spam works (anectodal: I've done it in quite a few games and won).
Just one ("small") problem: Necrons.
If you come up against Necrons don't bother unpacking, because unless their troops are all tesla immortals and they have 0 gauss and 0 haywire (i.e. A situation that will NEVER happen in competitive play) they will demolish you. They will ram a barge pole so far up your metal backside that you will suffer epileptic fits at the sight of anything vaguely silver or croissant-shaped.

Although not technically a land raider chasis, a spartan is MILES better than a godhammer for only a little more! Twice as many las shots, 1 more hull point, ability to be immune to melta, 25 transport cap. More firepower than the achilles but not immune to lance. Achilles with 2 spartans would get to peak efficiency I reckon. 8 tl las for anti tank and a thunderfire cannon for anti troop, plus all the other weapons. And all 3 are more durable than normal raiders (especially the achilles). Just shoot every fireprism, swooping hawk and zoanthrope you see until they are smoking ruins...then shoot at them some more, just to be sure. As Tac Gen says - necrons are the hard counter!

No Forgeworld allowed in my group. LRs in general suffer from a lack of dakka/pt.

Last week with my guard I played a Iron hands/ Dark angels list with four raiders and bikezander. This army took my guard apart and my the end of the game I had immobilised one raider and that was it lol.

The land raider does pose the conundrum that nearly all anti-Wave Serpent weapons suck against the LR, and vice versa.

Martel732 wrote:
The land raider does pose the conundrum that nearly all anti-Wave Serpent weapons suck against the LR, and vice versa.

Except the LR is an assault vehcile! Say hello to some Krak grenades, Mr. Serpent.

UnadoptedPuppy wrote:

Martel732 wrote:
The land raider does pose the conundrum that nearly all anti-Wave Serpent weapons suck against the LR, and vice versa.

Except the LR is an assault vehcile! Say hello to some Krak grenades, Mr. Serpent.

You are assuming you are going to get close enough to charge said Wave Serpent.

Besides, LR spam doesn't worry someone who has 10+ Lance weapons in a single list.