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This weekend I will be playing in my first kill team match ( 200 points, foc modified to 0-1 elite, 0-1 Fast attack, 0-3 troop), and I am looking for a bit of advise for lists. I have been looking through mostly the elite section trying to pick out troops that would be good for this. I have more or less boiled it down to Plague Marines for their longevity, Noise Marines for their salvo, blasts and ignore cover, Raptors/Bikers for their maneuverability, and to a lesser extent Thousand sons for their AP3 everything. Where ever applicable I would be adding MoN and likely plasma guns as medium and heavy armor won't be an issue although we have lifted the restriction on 2+ saves.

Are Rhinos worth looking at to shrug off a few shots? Should I bother adding a Havoc or would adding a second combi of some type be better?

For Context, my opponents will be Necron (with a penchant for Wraith and Scarabs/spiders), Tau (who has been running lots of drones and piranha lately), and Dark Angel (200 is too low to field terminators so I anticipate Bikes, a Dreadnought, or Tact Marines).

Thanks for any responses/adivse.

Large squads of Noise Marines with full sonics tend to wipe the board with Necrons. 1 10 man squad might be all you need.

Hi General Duf, I've been playing a lot of Kill Team games. I love them, I prefer Kill Team to regular games.

I'm having difficulty sharing experiences, only because all your ideas are already good.

Aside from 0-3 Troops and the 2+ save, is your meta modifying the official Kill Team rules in other ways? Are you using AV 33+ vehicles? Are you still using Specialists? Is it still the objective grab in the middle scenario? What I'm going to do is comment on your ideas and just warn you about what I've seen before, so you have foresight while deciding.

Context - in Kill Teams, what gets used a lot are Specialists specifically with Armourbane, Fleshbane, Ignore Cover, hidden at maximum range on top of something out of reach (because every model is its own unit, no squad cohesion). Turns 1 to 3 are usually softening up the opposition, followed by an total mess for the centre objective in Turns 4 or 5, depending on how things went up to then. That's the situation you're facing, useful to keep in the back of your mind.

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Plague Marines and Mark of Nurgle: the T5 is rendered less useful if your opponent is smart making a long-range multi-shot guy a Fleshbane Specialist. Someone like me, I give a Imperial Fist with a Heavy Bolter Fleshbane to go with his Bolter Drills. I will be an issue IMHO.

Noise Marines: I haven't seen them used, but they look pretty good. Remember, if you ARE using Specialists, you can give them the USR from the Kill Team rules to augment their already awesome weapons. I think this is a winner.

Raptors: for a while I think this was the Killer Kill Team and it might still be. Take advantage of the special weapons they can get. Imagine...Raptor with Flamer with Fleshbane, using his maneuverability to place the template optimally. Also a winner.

Bikers: Same thing as Raptors, so they're great, but a little more burdened by Terrain. As we don't have to maintain squad coherency in Kill Team, we are real bastards with cover. We'll put our 1 Heavy Bolter Fleshbane Bolter Drill guy on top of a water tower just so your normal Bikes can't reach him. Raptors can still make an argument about jetpacking up towards us, but not normal Bikes, so I don't know. I also mentioned Fleshbane against your T5 Plague Marines, but in this case, I'm less worried about it. It's because just as Terrain can be used against you, so can you use it, to stay out of True Line of Sight. Hard call, it depends how good a Bike Tactician you are, but a winner.

Thousand Sons: I really don't feel good about this, they're so expensive. I could say the same about Plague Marines, but they still have their FNP. Thousand Sons are really intriguing because you can put Specialist rules on top of their AP3 magical bolter shells, but they're being Slow and Purposeful is a significant disadvantage. I've won games simply by doing a mad dash out of cover towards the objective in the last turn. I really have reservations on this one.

Rhino: yeah...it has its uses, but it's going to be a Wreck. Your opponents will almost certainly take 1 Heavy or a Melta weapon, and if they don't, Armourbane and Tank Hunter. A Wreck as a piece of cover is still useful, but perhaps you wouldn't want to invest extra points in it. Keep weapons off, use it as a mobile pillbox for however long it lasts, then as a piece of terrain.

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Let me conclude like this. Your ideas are all good, I was NOT picking out weaknesses; in fact, considering how competitive all those ideas were, I think you already thought about it a long time before posting. it's just that Kill Team rules NEGATE some of the normal advantages a little. With so few points to play with, that becomes a major COST.

With that in mind, IMHO I think your safest bets are Noise Marines and Raptors, maybe the Bikes (MoN or not, real tough call, I'd say yes because they can maneuver out of True LOS real good). It's because I can't atm think of obvious awesome counter-tactics against them. In fact, I think they're so intriguing I want to make my own Kill Team based on Noise Marines in particular (I heard there's these cool new Forgeworld minis), playing with the Specialist rules on them.

Btw, I wanted to comment on your opponents, but too many variables with 3 different codices and me guessing what they'll take. But more than that, I like your lists because they are very Tactical, real take-all-comers, I love them.

We are using these rules except modifying them to allow 2+ saves: http://www.games-workshop.com/MEDIA_CustomProductCatalog/m3460063a_Kill_Team_Rules_Pack_2013.4.pdf

Thank you for the ideas, I will be mulling them over all morning at work now.

Quick reply to say, perfect, that's the ruleset we use.

(Except the Leadership progression, we play 1-shot games, but that's a minor issue anyway.)

Yeah, all my points were based on experiences with this.

Good hunting!

We play D3 special rules added to 3 individual models, once you lose half your models, each model being able to operate on their own, you start taking leadership tests. One failed test and you fail the game, and each test is taken at -1.

My Chaos enemy uses some chosen with an assortment of deadly weapons and a rhino, he does very well with that group.

I run Nids, I use Doom in a pod and a group of gribblies, I give Doom EW and the fun begins!

I'd say go with the NM
6 x NM (1x blast master, 4x sonic blasters, champ w/combi-plasma, rhino)
giving them shrouded, slow and purposeful, and (tank hunter/preferred enemy/ skilled rider)
hopefully you'll additionally get stealth from the 2D6

 chillis wrote:
I'd say go with the NM
6 x NM (1x blast master, 4x sonic blasters, champ w/combi-plasma, rhino)
giving them shrouded, slow and purposeful, and (tank hunter/preferred enemy/ skilled rider)
hopefully you'll additionally get stealth from the 2D6

only one model each gets the special rule, so you could give the blast master shrouded, but not the whole unit(as there are no units)
why take slow and purposeful when you could have rerelentless. Also fleshbane on a sonic blaster would be nice.

Oh so it doesn't confer to the unit as per the normal rules? sad day :( Well then, scrap those specialties

 chillis wrote:
Oh so it doesn't confer to the unit as per the normal rules? sad day :( Well then, scrap those specialties

each model is a unit, and thus one rule confers to no one but the guy with the rule

Stormbreed wrote:
We play D3 special rules added to 3 individual models, once you lose half your models, each model being able to operate on their own, you start taking leadership tests. One failed test and you fail the game, and each test is taken at -1.

My Chaos enemy uses some chosen with an assortment of deadly weapons and a rhino, he does very well with that group.

I run Nids, I use Doom in a pod and a group of gribblies, I give Doom EW and the fun begins!

Although devious, no reserves. I have consider chosen, but I had rather poor luck with them the last time I played.

But otherwise, I am strongly leaning towards NM. I'm not sure on a blastmaster. Although an amazing weapon he could sniped out by some of the long range Tau weapons without much ado. I was considering taking a single Chaos Spawn with the 'It Will Not Die' USR and leaving them all with Sonic Blasters. The spawn would mostly be for grabbing/contesting the objective and drawing fire. Thats the thought anyway. What do people think about a sonic blaster Armorbane. On average the pen roll would be 11 (roll of 7 plus the S4 of the blaster)? Might have trouble with a Ghost Arc is my concern. Maybe the Champion with a Combi plasma Armor bane instead?

Do Icons of Excess count in Kill Team missions? Would you be able to get FNP for each member of a unit?

Each member is its own, so by RAW no I would think not.

Spawn exceed the maximum wounds I believe. Was running one in some practice games until we clued on, it was really effective alongside possessed of all things.

Probably just because noone knew what they were doing =/

Yeah I caught that right before my games too. Used the points for a blastmaster.

As I expected I lost to Tau due to their JSJ and a lucky rail rifle on a pathfinder, and I had to run them down. Before I could flank them, I lost a break test.

Dark Angels went quietly into the night. I exploded his Razorback with TL assault cannons on my first try with my armorbane sonic blaster before it even got in range to kill anything. I decided to give him a fighting chance and engaged as many as possible in hand to hand, but between my init and superior remaining numbers (~3:1) it didn't help. I honestly didn't lose a model.

Necrons never showed up.

I just played a 205 point kill team tourney. 8 plague marines w/ flamer and votlw wrecked. votlw for extra leadership for tests once you are below half.

6 MoN bikers! Add in 2 melta guns and you will cause some issues! Meltas speak for themselves, and with MoN the bikers will be T6! Something relatively rare in kill team games!

With the fleshbane people are mentioning... I was told in the Kill Team FAQ they said that rules only affect the model, not the gun, so having fleshbane wouldn't do anything to guns? Or have I been misinformed?

Chaos Terminators.....
MoT them for a 4++, fill them out with combi-weapons and (with 4 of them) you'll be near the 200pts level; if you don't take many power fists you may be able to squeeze an other terminator in and get a heavy weapon.

Probably easy enough to get around providing you are on a board and a propper kill team.

Tactical_Genius wrote:
With the fleshbane people are mentioning... I was told in the Kill Team FAQ they said that rules only affect the model, not the gun, so having fleshbane wouldn't do anything to guns? Or have I been misinformed?

According to this FAQ (I believe this to be the more the more recent ) http://www.games-workshop.com/MEDIA_CustomProductCatalog/m2600141a_Kill_Team_FAQ.pdf one can pick a weapon rule and give it to a weapon that the model use ,

Q. Can I take the special rules that are weapon specific, such as
Melta, Torrent or Master-crafted?
A.
Yes, but they must be allocated to one specific weapon on your
specialist. Simply write this on your army list when you hand it
in, and your record card on the day.

Tactical_Genius wrote:
With the fleshbane people are mentioning... I was told in the Kill Team FAQ they said that rules only affect the model, not the gun, so having fleshbane wouldn't do anything to guns? Or have I been misinformed?

Thats because there are several editions of KT on the net with pdfs circulating for all of them.

The latest clears it up, specifically saying stuff like this applying to man and weapon. It also cleared up stuff like Necron reanimation, and banned 2+ saves and vehicle AV over 33.

As for Icon of Excess etc, it specifically says (in all the editions) that it only applies to the one guy who has it. Stupid, and people could just homerule it out, but thats the official view on it.