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I'm thinking of starting lizardmen, and while I'm no competitive player I'd like to hear your opinions on a few units/ Items that caught my attention.
First off the kroxigor/skink mixed unit. I seem to recall that kroxigors were mostly not considered worth the points before, thinking I'd like to play a skink focused army is there something that makes them outright awful that I didn't catch?
Then the new fancy Bastiladon . I'm thinking of taking one with the chotec boundspell, but the jungle swarm variant does seem quite lackluster. Is adding a base to a swarm unit worth it, because the snake attacks doesn't since it causes hits, meaning its Poisonned special rule is pointless?(Corrected in the FAQ ,no poison, so are S2 hits worth it ?)
(Tiktaq'to's magic mask says teradons in his unit may use his BS instead of theirs in the French book, is that a typo and means the riders or ?) Corrected to WS instead of BS in the Errata
Salamanders or Razordons? I could see the use of the template , because I tend to play against armies with large-ish units.
Thanks in advance

Skinks with Krox seem cool at first, but then you see that the skinks give easy combat res to the opponent even though they help getting static res through ranks and banner
The chotec thingy Bastiladon is awesome, because Dinozaurs with LAZORS!
TicTac is terribad RAW as he can't join flying units (nobody can), RAI he gives them some more punch, but I don't think he's impressive anyway
Salamanders are still ridiculously awesome against large units (you shoot all templates at the same time, so three salamanders shooting at a 40-strong block can be expected to do around 90-ish hits on a good day). Razordons are good as well, but their value is not so easily seen. They can move and shoot and stand and shoot without problem, then can wreck face in CC as they're very decent in that role. Cast the +d3 BS spell on them and they'll be really good

Alright, thanks for those pointers.
So the Chotek bastiladon is the way to go,
About tiktak'to honestly I had forgotten about that limitation , and I doubt anyone where I play would prevent me from adding him to teradons, especially since he's basically made to enhance them.
The salamanders are fancy indeed, I'll probably end up getting them instead of the razordons.
So the kroxigor/skink unit loses out too much because of the skinks' squishiness? I've got some cheap kroxigors, so I'll give it a try but it makes sense.

Just run straight kroxigors. they work wonderfully.

Skinks can work just use MSU and lots of javelins also some monster support can't hurt.

So run kroxigors like rat-ogres and small units of skinks with javelins (I had figured that one out since you hit on 7 with the pipes and lose the poison). Thanks.
Are the ripperdactyls useable? They seem brutal but they're so damn fragile (toughness 2!) . Ultimate glass-cannon I guess?

 B0B MaRlEy wrote:
So run kroxigors like rat-ogres and small units of skinks with javelins (I had figured that one out since you hit on 7 with the pipes and lose the poison). Thanks.
Are the ripperdactyls useable? They seem brutal but they're so damn fragile (toughness 2!) . Ultimate glass-cannon I guess?

They are Toughness 3 do to the FAQ ruling on Monstrous Cavalry But they are a bit tricky. Generally they need 4+ models and you will have to use your fast cavalry rules to keep frenzy in check because once you have charged if you destroy the unit you need your general within 12" or you will be flying all over the place

Good point on the WHFB FAQ. I know the 40k ones pretty well, but only getting back to WHFB I'll have to do what I did to my 40K rulebook : edit the crap out of it to have the latest FAQ corrections in it. Sigh....

To each of your questions:

- Kroxigors are S5 base, now. Which means S7 attacks and a S5 stomp.
I believe it was HawaiiMatt who said he'd had luck with 11 Skinks and 1 Kroxigor. It's kind of the sweet-spot between price and ability.
I would not think that hordes of such units would be very effective, though.

- you've got to make the Bastiladon work for you, with all of his weird abilities. The Ark is not as potent as Chotec's gem-laser, but it's also not a bound spell, right?
If you're not going to run Jungle Swarms, take the bound item.
And as far as Jungle Swarms go, I think such units are slowly getting to where they need to be. Giving everyone else in the combat Poison is pretty cool.
...too bad the Bastilodons don't benefit from it, that much.

- Salamanders are still pretty wicked-awesome. Razordons have gotten a lot better, too; cheaper and more reliable. One or two Salamanders is a useful little threat. 6 Razordons is a formidable unit.

- Ripperdactyls are awesome. I see them in most lists. As Skaven, I don't mind going up against them; Terradons are worse for me.

I thought about going to the exact opposite of Marley, meaning an oldblood on a carnosaur, with large blocks of Saurus warriors, skink priests and one Saurus with the army standard. everything else is negotiable, and its not something I'm building tomorrow, as I'm still finishing my White Scars.

Are the Saurus still cold blooded with scaly skin? Mind you, I'm coming at Fantasy after playing 40K, so I have a very rough idea of what's going on, just worried about the lack of high level wizards leading me to get owned in the magic phase.

thanks for your points warpsolution. Care to elaborate a bit on what makes teradons more annoying to a skaven player than ripperdactyls? I can see their Killing blow being a bit of a waste and their lowish I stat having them die before striking but how are the teradons better?

 B0B MaRlEy wrote:
thanks for your points warpsolution. Care to elaborate a bit on what makes teradons more annoying to a skaven player than ripperdactyls? I can see their Killing blow being a bit of a waste and their lowish I stat having them die before striking but how are the teradons better?

Terradons with the rock drop pretty much murder weapon teams, and then have a good chance at taking out other weapon teams, warmachines or characters in combat. I'd say you can redirect with them, but I don't see skaven charging a lot.

As for Skink/Krox units, I've been running units of 11 skinks full command, 1 krox, and poison attacks. It deploys 5 wide, throwing out 9 S3 poison attacks, 8 S3 poison shots, 8 S3 poison stand and fire shots, and maybe 3S7 attacks.
The krox is more for the leadership bonus. Ld7 and cold blood is pretty good, it's a huge step up over Ld5.
With M6, these little 157 point units are constantly pulling their own weight.

I've also been running a unit of 30 cohorts with poison attacks to great effect. With wild form for +1 S, you basically triple the bonus, since you get it on the shoot, the stand and shoot, and then again in combat.

Saurus blocks seem to work best as character bunkers; and stubborn character are usually needed. They are decent, but need a little more hitting power, and tend to be too expensive to risk without stubborn.
Gor Rok in one block, and a stubborn crown character in another makes a very solid center.

Nice, I thought about those things, glad I didn't miss out on some sneaky trick.

The smaller units with the krox makes sense, and the cohort is how I thought of running it, wildform included.
The stubborn part I can see, and even thought of playing Gor-rok in my otherwise full skink army just for that. Didn't even remember the crown ... shame on me....

Khan Raider wrote:
Are the Saurus still cold blooded with scaly skin? Mind you, I'm coming at Fantasy after playing 40K, so I have a very rough idea of what's going on, just worried about the lack of high level wizards leading me to get owned in the magic phase.

The Saurus are indeed as they once were. But cheaper and better. As for Wizards, you can try packing two lvl2's with the Dispel Scroll and the Cube of Darkness. That's usually enough to see you through.

 HawaiiMatt wrote:

 B0B MaRlEy wrote:
thanks for your points warpsolution. Care to elaborate a bit on what makes teradons more annoying to a skaven player than ripperdactyls? I can see their Killing blow being a bit of a waste and their lowish I stat having them die before striking but how are the teradons better?

Terradons with the rock drop pretty much murder weapon teams, and then have a good chance at taking out other weapon teams, warmachines or characters in combat. I'd say you can redirect with them, but I don't see skaven charging a lot.

Exactly so. Though the worst thing they do is hang around my Cannons, forcing me to deal with them before they take out my artillery. Ripperdactyls are much easier to re-direct and deal with; they charge in, kill a bunch of my models, and then I attack back and kill them. They just don't stick around long enough to make up their points, when their targets are all 5pts/model or less.

And for your information, HawaiiMatt, I charge all the time! Granted, I usually do a healthy amount of fleeing as well...