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Hey Guys Jesse here from Team Stomping Grounds. Our second battle report just got posted as i finalized it after returning from a great event up at Da Boyz! It is a 2k matchup with Matt Cerino using space marine bikes vs John Parsons playing Flying Circus DOC. It is a NOVA style mission, and with this time of the year our future reports will be coming out using most likely Da boyz and Adepticon primer missions as we will be testing for Adepticon. Also we are still accepting lists for our list doctor segment, and email can be sent to teamsgvideo@gmail.com

Our future videos will bring a DOC cav army, maybe dog star versus O'vesa star, we are just working on getting the dog list together and painted for the game, as well as list doctor and all the members of the team that went to Da Boyz GT will be doing a Da Boyz review, minus Mr. Gonyo due to distance to travel.

Last but not least this is our first video with our new co-host Chance, Let us know any ways we can improve, Thanks!!

Great report.

The overview is helpful and informative, as are the analyses.

I love this!

The style of the batrep is much like two sportscasters, very good job

Thanks! That is what we were going for, and will keep it going for the future!

Man between JY2, frontline gaming, and the stomping ground reports we are quite spoiled with very informative competitive batreps. Love it, keep up the good work guys and I'm looking forward to more of these.

Chancetragedy wrote:
Man between JY2, frontline gaming, and the stomping ground reports we are quite spoiled with very informative competitive batreps. Love it, keep up the good work guys and I'm looking forward to more of these.

Thank you! I had a blast filming it!

I really enjoy your battle reports. Very informative and efficient.

One thing, though. It looked like the Chapter Master was the warlord in the SM army, but if this is the case, they can't scout. Khan only gives them scouts if he's the warlord.

Really cool report, I really liked the overview shot. Just a few more cinematic/ground level shots would be cool but I suppose the way this game went there wasn't really a point! Lol

Thud wrote:
I really enjoy your battle reports. Very informative and efficient.

One thing, though. It looked like the Chapter Master was the warlord in the SM army, but if this is the case, they can't scout. Khan only gives them scouts if he's the warlord.

Khan was the warlord of Matt s army

Awesome batrep, I´ll be sure to watch more.

Although I still maintain that a slow witted monkey throwing darts at random would be more competent when it comes to balancing the hellturkey then the clueless moron at gw design that did it.
Talk about ridiculously overpowered to the point of ruining the game.

Thank you for posting

Wow, I've never seen a daemon FMC-player play so passively. That could have been a tabling by the daemons.

Actually, John plays alot like Nick, they are both super passive, sometimes its annoying when you don't get to play a game till 4 or 5!


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Actually, John plays alot like Nick, they are both super passive, sometimes its annoying when you don't get to play a game till 4 or 5!

 krootman. wrote:

Thud wrote:
I really enjoy your battle reports. Very informative and efficient.

One thing, though. It looked like the Chapter Master was the warlord in the SM army, but if this is the case, they can't scout. Khan only gives them scouts if he's the warlord.

Khan was the warlord of Matt s army

Okay, gotcha. It was a bit unclear in the army list because of the lineshift.

I do apologize about that, ill yell at my graphics guy :p I had my suspicions of him being a heretic!!

 jy2 wrote:
Wow, I've never seen a daemon FMC-player play so passively. That could have been a tabling by the daemons.

The issue with playing that army aggressively is a lot of times you will end up on the wrong end of a tabling. With such a low model count it is very easy to loose a prince or 2 due to a failed charge, not getting the powers you need (looking at you iron arm), a failed grim roll, or a bad warpstorm table result. Plus his command squad will eat a prince a turn for breakfest.

Up against a white scars army, he could have been easily eating bikes from turn 1.
With only having one DP on the table turn 1 he pretty much threw away a 300 point character as easily as 4 guys in power armor.

His command squad could probably kill a prince a turn... if for some strange reason the Daemons player decided to keep kiting completely around it....

 krootman. wrote:

 jy2 wrote:
Wow, I've never seen a daemon FMC-player play so passively. That could have been a tabling by the daemons.

The issue with playing that army aggressively is a lot of times you will end up on the wrong end of a tabling. With such a low model count it is very easy to loose a prince or 2 due to a failed charge, not getting the powers you need (looking at you iron arm), a failed grim roll, or a bad warpstorm table result. Plus his command squad will eat a prince a turn for breakfest.

That's true. However, you can play both aggressively and smartly as well.

The way Matt was playing - by spreading out his army to avoid the multiple assaults and to claim table quarters - John could have easily did a refused flank maneuver (or in this case, a refused "corner" maneuver) to pick off his troops 1 corner at a time with vector strikes and shooting (and possibly even assault as well). Matt's forces, at least the majority of them, would have been too far away to react in time....not to mention they had to deal with the blasted helturkey as well. Iron Arm is good, but daemons can still win even without it.

The scouting grav guns could murder MC's. You need to be careful when playing scouting bikes....

I feel like this is a pretty bad matchup for the bikes, where they just kind of got lucky that the game ended early. Any ways for bike players to mitigate the damage better than this? I almost feel like clumping in one table quarter would be superior, just to force the FMCs to take the full firepower of the list if they want to Vector Strike anything at all. Admittedly you'd have to be careful with the Hell Talon, of course.

Nice batrep. I love how bloody CD vs white scars games always become.

Ricter wrote:
I feel like this is a pretty bad matchup for the bikes, where they just kind of got lucky that the game ended early. Any ways for bike players to mitigate the damage better than this? I almost feel like clumping in one table quarter would be superior, just to force the FMCs to take the full firepower of the list if they want to Vector Strike anything at all. Admittedly you'd have to be careful with the Hell Talon, of course.

Its not as bad of a match up as you would think. My daemons are dead the instant they hit the ground. Its a matchup I would not want to afford to get super aggressive until turn 4 or so, when I can afford the loss of a prince or 2.

See, that's been my experience as well (as a bikes player), but I always felt that I was simply getting lucky in my wins. However, my opponents were playing much more aggressively than you were.

Out of curiousity for you SG guys. How does Matt deal with flyer armies like say necrons or multiple drakes? With zero anti air it seems like it could be rough? I've been debating dropping my 2 storm talons for the command squad for a little bit now. Which would bring my army nearer to what Matt was running but I'm super apprehensive about having zero AA.

Edit:secondary question what about alpha strike drop pod armies as well. These 2 archetypes have proven to be my hardest games.

Tzeentch princes?

Around here in Dallas, the Slaanesh princes with Lash of Despair and Psychic Shriek tend to be the weapons of choice for DP spam armies.

Why no wings on the CSM prince? It's really a death wish without them. I'd almost suggest going with an economy lord (65 points naked) and consider him and the cultists as the tax required to get the heldrake. Maybe squeeze another tzeentch prince or some other CD unit in there.

 Spellbound wrote:
Tzeentch princes?

Around here in Dallas, the Slaanesh princes with Lash of Despair and Psychic Shriek tend to be the weapons of choice for DP spam armies.

Why no wings on the CSM prince? It's really a death wish without them. I'd almost suggest going with an economy lord (65 points naked) and consider him and the cultists as the tax required to get the heldrake. Maybe squeeze another tzeentch prince or some other CD unit in there.

I'm fairly sure the csm prince has wings, it must've been omitted from the army list during the video. He would, as you said, be fairly useless on foot.

The favoring of tzeentch over slaanesh is due to the tax you have to pay in a keeper of secrets vs a lord of change. Much like the above comment of a mace prince with no wings being dead weight so is a keeper. Also tzeentch princes are slightly more durable and have a bit of a larger threat range due to tzeentch spells having a longer range than both lash and psy shriek. Lash is a nice power though I'll say that. Also tzeentch princes are a little more durable thanks to rerolling 1's on failed saves.

The model doesn't have wings either, that's why I was wondering.

I see the keeper working well as long as it doesn't roll a 3+ armor save, at least against grav guns. It deep strikes in - but of course then they can just run away from it.

thanatos67 wrote:

 Spellbound wrote:
Tzeentch princes?

Around here in Dallas, the Slaanesh princes with Lash of Despair and Psychic Shriek tend to be the weapons of choice for DP spam armies.

Why no wings on the CSM prince? It's really a death wish without them. I'd almost suggest going with an economy lord (65 points naked) and consider him and the cultists as the tax required to get the heldrake. Maybe squeeze another tzeentch prince or some other CD unit in there.

I'm fairly sure the csm prince has wings, it must've been omitted from the army list during the video. He would, as you said, be fairly useless on foot.

The favoring of tzeentch over slaanesh is due to the tax you have to pay in a keeper of secrets vs a lord of change. Much like the above comment of a mace prince with no wings being dead weight so is a keeper. Also tzeentch princes are slightly more durable and have a bit of a larger threat range due to tzeentch spells having a longer range than both lash and psy shriek. Lash is a nice power though I'll say that. Also tzeentch princes are a little more durable thanks to rerolling 1's on failed saves.

All the princes fly. Also Thanatos is correct, in 2k when given the choice of the keeper or the lord of change, the loc is superior. Having those extra div rolls is huge, as is the loc having wings.

Spellbound wrote:The model doesn't have wings either, that's why I was wondering.

I see the keeper working well as long as it doesn't roll a 3+ armor save, at least against grav guns. It deep strikes in - but of course then they can just run away from it.

So the keeper isn't bad, I can't explain why, because on paper he looks awful but if used to hunt cheap backfield units and if he rolls well on his gifts and powers, he can be a big pain. Actually in the 1850 version of this list, the loc becomes a keeper, and the princes go from mot to mos to save pts. The ability to take lash in place of say armor bane and flesh bane or 3+ armor save is nice.

First of all - friggin awesome report. Excellent camera and very good commentary. I would play more aggressive - but hey that is just me. Leaving the chances to lose on turn 2 just doens't sit well with me. But hey I failed to roll forewarning in two games on 9 and then 13 dice rolls - so I don't trust my dice haha.

I've liked MOS princes due to just the whip being useful to remove models. Not having to worry about Deny the Witch is excellent.

Be'lakor would be a great CSM DP for this list as he survives grav and other guns fairly well - and is kind of a pain in the butt with all those spells and abilities.

But hey - thanks again for the report - I didn't fast forward or anything!

 jy2 wrote:

 krootman. wrote:

 jy2 wrote:
Wow, I've never seen a daemon FMC-player play so passively. That could have been a tabling by the daemons.

The issue with playing that army aggressively is a lot of times you will end up on the wrong end of a tabling. With such a low model count it is very easy to loose a prince or 2 due to a failed charge, not getting the powers you need (looking at you iron arm), a failed grim roll, or a bad warpstorm table result. Plus his command squad will eat a prince a turn for breakfest.

That's true. However, you can play both aggressively and smartly as well.

The way Matt was playing - by spreading out his army to avoid the multiple assaults and to claim table quarters - John could have easily did a refused flank maneuver (or in this case, a refused "corner" maneuver) to pick off his troops 1 corner at a time with vector strikes and shooting (and possibly even assault as well). Matt's forces, at least the majority of them, would have been too far away to react in time....not to mention they had to deal with the blasted helturkey as well. Iron Arm is good, but daemons can still win even without it.

Trouble is he can only pivot 90% and bikes can easily avoid their arc and 24" move to vector, and with two priests attached to such a large bike unit they pretty much shut down the demon shooting which isn't that strong vs Bikes IMO.

This game as many in 6th was all about the initiative.